'Bullied' schoolgirl killed herself

[Cupcake]

I didn't blame the school, I didn't blame the parents, I have a teenager, and 2 younger kids and I feel the school.. where my children spend the majority of their day, is responsible for providing a safe atmosphere. My daughter in kindergarden a few yrs a go got her pants pulled down by 2 boys on the play ground no less than 3 times and the playground monitor did nothing, wasn't looking, didn't hear her screaming, and when they finally did get around to nopticing they didn't call me or tell me. I had to drag it out of my child exactly what happened. When I called the principal she said she can't help it, kids learned things at home and she couldn't watch them the whole time. Thats where I made my safe atmosphere statement, took it to the super and board. Police were called and it was determined that the school was at fault FOR NOT PROVIDING A SAFE ATMOSPHERE AND NOT PROVIDING PROPER PLAYGROUND SUPERVISION. When you have charge over someone else's children you DO take a hefty responsibility. Our counselors ARE certified for counseling on a variety of issues... not just classes.

No, I am not supporting your blaming the parents. The parents can't be at school with their children.

I agree with you in that the school MUST provide a safe atmosphere and couselors ARE there for personal problems, not just to advise on classes. Sometimes, you have to just take the bull by the horns and make the principal understand that you want something done, and done now. My elementary school where my kids went knew me well! One of my kids had a teacher that picked on him, also ... you don't mess with my kids, man! I always take up for them, when I know they aren't in the wrong, because no one else is going to, and kids are at the mercy of the adults (teachers) when they're at school. I have gotten personally involved more than once when I felt it was necessary, and it took some bitchin to get it done. Obviously, I don't have problem speaking my mind! LOL

Truthfully, it takes the parents and school officials to take responsibility, not just one or the other.

 

[smellsarat]

I didn't blame the school, I didn't blame the parents, I have a teenager, and 2 younger kids and I feel the school.. where my children spend the majority of their day, is responsible for providing a safe atmosphere. My daughter in kindergarden a few yrs a go got her pants pulled down by 2 boys on the play ground no less than 3 times and the playground monitor did nothing, wasn't looking, didn't hear her screaming, and when they finally did get around to nopticing they didn't call me or tell me. I had to drag it out of my child exactly what happened. When I called the principal she said she can't help it, kids learned things at home and she couldn't watch them the whole time. Thats where I made my safe atmosphere statement, took it to the super and board. Police were called and it was determined that the school was at fault FOR NOT PROVIDING A SAFE ATMOSPHERE AND NOT PROVIDING PROPER PLAYGROUND SUPERVISION. When you have charge over someone else's children you DO take a hefty responsibility. Our counselors ARE certified for counseling on a variety of issues... not just classes.

No, I am not supporting your blaming the parents. The parents can't be at school with their children.

The better behaved the children...the less policing needed.. AND the behavior of these kids is shaped by the parents.That is the ROOT of the problem.

 

[nixmom]

Wow there are so many differing opinions on this subject, I am hoping some of you can give me some suggestions as how to handle this subject with my son. While I can't say he is out and out being bullied, there is another boy in his class who has consistently made fun of my son one way or another since they were in the first grade (they are now in fourth grade). It always involves something regarding my son's physical appearance, i.e., he has freckles, dark circles under his eyes, his current haircut, his shoe size, just stupid stuff. My son is a very sensitive kid and and takes all of this to heart. He also is compassionate and will step in to defend anyone else that is being teased or picked on, but he will not stand up for himself. When he was in the first grade he would actually cry in the morning before school and ask me to put concealer under his eyes because this kid was teasing him about having dark circles. The teasing by this particular kid has eased up over the past year or so, but still occasionally he will still find something to tease my child about, most recently the fact that my son is smaller than him. To date, I have not been able to convince him that this kid is probably teasing him out of jealousy. The teaser is a little bit overweight and I am convinced that is the reason he teases my son. I tried to talk to the boys parents, but they feel it is just "boys being boys" and they will not even address it with their son (and this man is a physician!). Am I missing something? Does anyone have any other angle to point out to him? Any input would be appreciated!

 

[smellsarat]

Wow there are so many differing opinions on this subject, I am hoping some of you can give me some suggestions as how to handle this subject with my son. While I can't say he is out and out being bullied, there is another boy in his class who has consistently made fun of my son one way or another since they were in the first grade (they are now in fourth grade). It always involves something regarding my son's physical appearance, i.e., he has freckles, dark circles under his eyes, his current haircut, his shoe size, just stupid stuff. My son is a very sensitive kid and and takes all of this to heart. He also is compassionate and will step in to defend anyone else that is being teased or picked on, but he will not stand up for himself. When he was in the first grade he would actually cry in the morning before school and ask me to put concealer under his eyes because this kid was teasing him about having dark circles. The teasing by this particular kid has eased up over the past year or so, but still occasionally he will still find something to tease my child about, most recently the fact that my son is smaller than him. To date, I have not been able to convince him that this kid is probably teasing him out of jealousy. The teaser is a little bit overweight and I am convinced that is the reason he teases my son. I tried to talk to the boys parents, but they feel it is just "boys being boys" and they will not even address it with their son (and this man is a physician!). Am I missing something? Does anyone have any other angle to point out to him? Any input would be appreciated!

Nixmom ...I am going to send your question to my son...who has come a long way from a similar situation,...I do know he used humor to deflect the creeps who bothered him...I wil let you know what he says..
And that man is a doctor...he should be ashamed!! ignorant Jackass!!

 

[LP Moderator]

I'm so sorry your boy is going through that Nixmom. Its heartbreaking when a child is teased like that. Maybe you and he could think up one line combacks that he can think of in his head, but not say. Know what I mean? He'll think the comeback and smile to himself and the boy won't even know what happened. The boy will eventually get tired of it having no effect on your son and go away. This worked for my oldest boy. Some kid was bothering him because I was divorced and my son's father lived in a different state. My son would think up all kinds of stuff he could say in response and just smiled and walked away.

 

[nixmom]

Thanks smellsarat...I would really appreciate hearing what worked for your son. The physician :snooty: is a pompous *advertiser censored*, and unfortunately, the coach of my son's basketball team. My son almost backed out of playing when he found out Dr. R was going to be the coach. Thankfully, my husband was able to convince him to give it a go and he has really enjoyed it. Thank you too, DP. I think your idea will appeal to him as it would involve something known only to him. I know one of the reasons that he won't speak out to the teaser is that he is afraid of the repercussions (from the teachers). Thanks again to both of you :blowkiss: , it has been so frustrating trying to help him deal with this and not really being able to and I can't stand seeing him hurting. It makes me want to pull a Rebecca Demornay scene from her movie "The Hand That Rocks the Cradle"

 

[sansoucie]

LOL! Thanks Cupcake. I am a very quiet and reserved person until it comes to kids.. anyone's kids.

The boy that is being bullied... is it possible to invite the bully over for a playdate if younger or a similar thing? We had a similar situation though not as intense with my 10 yr old and it made a huge difference when I contacted the parent without mentioning the problem, and asked if the girl could come for a sleepover. The kid wasn't thrilled and made it obvious, but it didn't take long for her to warm up! Now they are friends. I don't know if it was the case with your kids bully, but this child wasn't from the best of families and I believe jealousy played a huge part in the problem. It is easy to and yell, but to reach out sometimes has a better effect, even though it is more difficult. I honostly don't know what I would have done if things went sour at the sleepover... but it all worked out for the best! I think it also sets a good example when your kid sees understanding and mercy coming from you.. not just anger v.s anger. Inside I wanted to rip this kids head off and beat the parents to a pulp... thankfully I am not impulsive! LOL!

 

[Ghostwheel]

Ghostwheel,

The parents of both of these children made statements to the press that they knew about the bullying. The one family claimed the boy had been bullied from age four despite many school changes. They also acknowledged that neither child had made reference to any bullying in suicide notes. One of the two children left more than one note... and still no reference. The boys that carried out the slaughter at Columbine before turning the guns on themselves made no secret of feeling as if they had been bullied.

The parents may have known about SOME bullying, not necessarily ALL bullying, or all types of the bullying. Kids usually tell about it in the beginning, but as it continues, they stop talking. Especially if they have told someone, and nothing was done. Should the parents have pulled their kids and home-schooled them? Sure. Or tried moving them to another school? Sure. Were these things possible? Maybe, maybe not. I don't buy that just because they didn't mention it in a suicide note that it didn't make any difference in their lives. Anyone who has ever been bullied, or witnessed bullying, knows differently.

The point, however, is that they SHOULD NOT HAVE TO DO THAT! If you, as a parent are REQUIRED to send your child to school, it had better well be a safe environment. And that includes not having to wait until you get home to go to the bathroom (I remember those days well....and it's even scarier whe you read some kids slit another ones throat in the bathroom). Let's just blame the parents and let the school off the hook? Can't go there.

I am sick to death of my kid's schools telling me I have to send them to school even if they are sick, scared of someone, whatever, because if I don't, they lose money, then finding no toilet paper in the bathrooms at the end of the day, one monitor for the whole playground at recess, no one checking to see if the kids are eating their lunch, etc.

I would agree that it is pretty odd that there were two children who could have found enough painkillers to kill themselves. There is no such thing in our house.

 

[sansoucie]

You said it, Ghostwheel!

 

[smellsarat]

Thanks smellsarat...I would really appreciate hearing what worked for your son. The physician :snooty: is a pompous *advertiser censored*, and unfortunately, the coach of my son's basketball team. My son almost backed out of playing when he found out Dr. R was going to be the coach. Thankfully, my husband was able to convince him to give it a go and he has really enjoyed it. Thank you too, DP. I think your idea will appeal to him as it would involve something known only to him. I know one of the reasons that he won't speak out to the teaser is that he is afraid of the repercussions (from the teachers). Thanks again to both of you :blowkiss: , it has been so frustrating trying to help him deal with this and not really being able to and I can't stand seeing him hurting. It makes me want to pull a Rebecca Demornay scene from her movie "The Hand That Rocks the Cradle"

Hey Nixmom...spoke to my son tonight...unortunately not as much help as I'd hoped..claims he can't remember much about "those days" ( Sometimes amnesia is good..LOL)(and he was soo tired, half asleep)...But here is some info...I do know he used humor to deflect these kids and he was resolute that they would not "scare" him away..He acted brave...but I was scared cuz they always attacked him in a pack. he would have loved to fight one or even two..but they didn"t have the balls to take him on alone...I was the one who insisted on involving the school-his"absentee" Dad in another state urged him to fight...These days kids can fight with more than fists so ...NOT a good idea!!! Does your son have a friend or friends...Chris did much better when he aligned himself with a small group of kids he did get along with...They became his firends and that took some of the pressure off... The only time Chris "hit" back...he threw a rock at the pack of them when they were stalking him on his paper route. Ironically, a neat neighbor man here saw everything and told me he had seen these boys congregate and follow Chris in the neighborhood and threw first....... My son was industrious even as a kid...had a paper route and very responsible...I think they envied him that... The school isolated him from the perps when it should have been them punished, making him eat lunch in the office, don"t let them do that to your son!!! Insist they cooperate and threaten a lawsuit otherwise...That is what helped with us...Things came to a head when the dad of one boy made physically violent threats towards my son by way of his friends....The Guy is a total creep..and the neighborhood *advertiser censored*! Anyway I got a lawyer and filed charges on him...THAT seemed to put the brakes on... Check out the internet..saw a great site there "Bullies to Buddies"...lots on there cuz the problem has increased tremendously...obviously school shootings etc..Ironically checked out Andy Williams( Santee school shooter) tonight on the web and San Diego paper (SignonSanDiego.com has story on him today.!).Still hurts to see how his life ended up---if someone had helped him it might have been different...Is your sons' dad around enough?...if not see if you can get a Big Brother, or an uncle to help..my brothers also helped him ......tried to do that but not enough to go around ...Best of Luck...and any help needed let me know...My son will probably call me tomorrow and remeber things ...if he does I'll keep you posted...OH, also I had him in counseling because the dpression was gettting to him...I think it is very important he let off steam to someone...other than you of course...Oh and also , Chris took up karate...I think that helped too cuz the teacher was good and they teach respect as well self defense...It gave him more self-confidence.... (unfortunately he quit after maybe a year...can"t remember Have CRS!!!! NITE!!!

 

[Cupcake]

Humor does work! Most of these bullies back down after being laughed at or you stand up to them. I know that can be hard for a shy kid ... having friends around him could help, too. I agree, too, that the bully could be jealous of the child he/she is bullying. Kids really have it harder than I did when I went to school. Also, I have taught my sons not to pick on people or make fun of anyone ... to remember how it makes them feel when someone does it to them. Kids can be so cruel to one another!

Good luck!!

 

[nixmom]

Thanks to all of you who have offered advice and ideas. We have had no school yesterday or today (love those snow days!) so I haven't approached the subject with my son, he's having way too much fun! I am really liking the humor approach and I think my son will respond well to that line of thinking. He does have many friends in his class, but most of them are pretty quiet and hesitant to speak up for themselves against this boy as well. The boy who does the teasing is from a family who funnels lots of cash into our private school. The school administrator (also our parish priest) is aware of the boy's actions, but apparently isn't overly concerned by it as several parents have attempted to speak with him about it. I think that the kids have seen this boy engage in enough inappropriate behavior and ultimately avoid any repercussions that they feel that they won't be heard even if they do speak up. It is very frustrating especially when there have been periods of time that I have taken an additional part time job to afford the tuition, thinking that my son would receive a better education with a spiritual base. :banghead:

 

[smellsarat]

Thanks to all of you who have offered advice and ideas. We have had no school yesterday or today (love those snow days!) so I haven't approached the subject with my son, he's having way too much fun! I am really liking the humor approach and I think my son will respond well to that line of thinking. He does have many friends in his class, but most of them are pretty quiet and hesitant to speak up for themselves against this boy as well. The boy who does the teasing is from a family who funnels lots of cash into our private school. The school administrator (also our parish priest) is aware of the boy's actions, but apparently isn't overly concerned by it as several parents have attempted to speak with him about it. I think that the kids have seen this boy engage in enough inappropriate behavior and ultimately avoid any repercussions that they feel that they won't be heard even if they do speak up. It is very frustrating especially when there have been periods of time that I have taken an additional part time job to afford the tuition, thinking that my son would receive a better education with a spiritual base. :banghead:

Very Important Nixmom..IF that school is aware there is a problem..and others have complained about this kid...and they have done nothing about it....I think they have placed themselves in a very precarious situation...I would bet a lawyer would use that against them.....I would drop hints about that...A friend of mine went to court for sexual harassment ...the company knew this guy had harrassed others before her,,,and did nothing ..except demote her!!! She ended up getting a sizeable settlement.The fact that the company knew and did nothing is VERY BAD!!!! Use it if you have to and threaten to get a lawyer... And especially if its a catholic school..Aye Carumba they are having to dole out enough money for their past indiscretions Sometimes that is enough to inspire action...
Glad he's having fun this week!!!

 

[Imon128]

We can only hope that those who speak against bullies, never in turn become one, by osmosis. It is so hurtful, but the best medicine, IMO, is to stand up to them, with backing, and put it to an end. I hope the family of this young gal, has some sort of validation for their young daughter's feelings that stemmed from the A holes. It could have stemmed from severe jealousy on the part of the bullies, but the poor young vicitm isn't here now to get justice. Only we left on earth can help this kind of situation, if we only will. JMO

 

[smellsarat]

Considering standing up to bullies...which is the classic response...The rules have changed...I myself do not advocate that. Today kids have been known to bring weapons to school, and are not afraid to use them...I feel it is best to involve adults and force them to address the issue.

 

[Imon128]

I said in my post, with backing. Perhaps I wasn't clear, but that includes involving some who can do something about it. Sorry if I wasn't clear.

 

[Old Broad]

Children can be so cruel! IMO every bully has problems themselves and when a school knows of a problem caused by a bully, they should have some type of plan not only to help their victim but to help the bully.
Parents have to be just that, a parent, but when their child is at school they can not know everything unless there is a good line of communication with the child and also the school itself.
When I was a child I never mentioned things to my family about problems at school.
A bully in school grows up to be a bully in adult life unless something happens to open their eyes and heart so they understand just what they're doing to someone else. They look for someone smaller/more vulnerable who will help them think they are powerful and important because they are lacking in self-esteem.