Burlap and Forensics

Discussion in 'Long Island Serial Killer' started by stillwatersc, Apr 29, 2011.

  1. ps149

    ps149 New Member

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    It's funny you mention that because when they began to expand their search I thought for sure that more bodies would be found at the north end of the Robert Moses Causeway because for two summers in a row there was a horrible odor there.
     


  2. dotr

    dotr Well-Known Member

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    Thinking that even if there was an odour, people would be reluctant to check it out to see if it was deceased animals or humans, maybe they did not really want to know.
    imo, speculation.
    http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2011/04...h-long-island-in-serial-killer-investigation/



    http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2011/04...roperty-values-decreasing-after-bodies-found/

    rbbm.
     
  3. NY Ranger Fan

    NY Ranger Fan Member

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    I see "official" trucks in and out of the area at all hours. Bay constables, oil spill remediation and so on. Some are state, some Babylon Town, some county trucks too.
     
  4. PositiveLight

    PositiveLight Active Member

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    I agree!
    I'm just shocked no one ever smelled anything? Wind currents can pick up odors and travel for a good distance.
    Not trying to be gross here, but being a nurse, I know what decomp smells like. You KNOW something or someone is deceased.
    But I do agree LISK timed his kills for the summer months so decomp was quicker and chose the area because it was desolate.
    It makes me want to think of how older people go to Florida during the winter. IMHO LISK has the cash to travel for long periods of time. Maybe retired early with property in many states. Or is able to work from home on his own pace.
    I do think he keeps trophies too. MOO but I think he's either well off, old money, or lives a minimalist life. I think he keeps to himself with occasional dating. But maybe nothing too serious to interfere with his dark passenger.
    The burlap may have something to do with his business. I think he runs it mainly from home or is seldom seen at the business, at least during working hours.
    All MOO of course. But I would think it makes more sense and easier to move if the body was wrapped vs. in a bag.
     
  5. PositiveLight

    PositiveLight Active Member

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    Yes it is very sad indeed.
    :( It's even more sad that their murders aren't taken as seriously. And that some of the families are completely unaware their loved one has been missing for months. I hate when I see a missing person's case and it says last seen in like May2006 but not reported missing until December 2006. Those break my hearts.
     
  6. PositiveLight

    PositiveLight Active Member

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    I wondered the same thing before I read your comment!
    Decomp is a smell all it's own though. It could be possible that they had experienced the odors so often they thought it was normal for the area. But weren't doctors living in that area? They surely would recognize that smell. And scavenger birds would be all over the area too. Didn't someone ever get curious during that time period?
    I don't think he's stopped though. If it is a group then they have just moved their deeds to another area. Maybe SG was too close of a call and they changed locations. I just don't think SG was lying when she said that "they" were trying to kill her. "They" could be as little as 2 people. I think SG gave him/they a run for their money and had a lot of fight in her.
    He/They have changed body dump locations or have found another way to dispose of their victims.
     
  7. PositiveLight

    PositiveLight Active Member

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    To me at least, the smell of decomp of a human has a much stronger pungent odor.

    http://www.medicaldaily.com/indescr...ntify-unique-gases-emitted-decomposing-354024
     
  8. NY Ranger Fan

    NY Ranger Fan Member

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    I was present when a body was removed from the cab of a truck on Vets Highway, maybe 20 years ago. I was 6 lanes across on the other side of the divided highway. It seems that a homeless person was taking winter refuge in a junk truck behind a repair shop and we at a deli picking up lunch. This was in April when it was discovered. The smell at 100 yards was unbelievable, we were all gagging and made a hasty exit from the area. This is like a dead raccoon x 1000.

    I don't see how the GB4 went unnoticed by people driving by. I posted elsewhere that the bodies may have been covered with lime or something else to mask the stink.
     
  9. PositiveLight

    PositiveLight Active Member

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    Exactly!
    Decomp is just the worst thing to smell. You may be right. There may have been lime spread on them to mask it some. But still. :sick:
     
  10. No it's not

    No it's not that simple

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    A combination of that, plus blending into nature, blending into means of transportation and possibly something ritualistic? How about a "sign of submission"?

    'It later came to mean also a garment made from such cloth, which was chiefly worn as a token of mourning by the Israelites. It was furthermore a sign of submission (I Kings xx. 30 et seq.), and was occasionally worn by the Prophets.'

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sackcloth
     
  11. Ms.Jules

    Ms.Jules Member

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    So it could be just about freaken anybody [emoji19][emoji17]


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  12. Ms.Jules

    Ms.Jules Member

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    This was for this quote

    Sorry I forgot to hit quote [emoji58]


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  13. Ms.Jules

    Ms.Jules Member

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    I was going to say,maybe another reason for the location is wind tides and which direction the wind was traveling, maybe summer (for many reasons) wind tide is high and travels/traveled that direction. How close is Moses causeway to bodies?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  14. PositiveLight

    PositiveLight Active Member

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    I've wondered that too.
    It does give off a vibe of a ritual/religious undertone. As if he is either punishing them for what he feels is a sin or he's trying to purify them in death. He's not done is the sad thing. He's probably stalking his next victim right now. This is why it is important to catch him/them before more innocent victims die.
     
  15. PositiveLight

    PositiveLight Active Member

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    Unfortunately yes.
    I do however think the burlap is tied to his business or he is around it all the time. Or was at least. Scary thought too. I'm sure though that when the perp/perps are caught everyone that knew them will say one of two things 1.) I just can't believe it! He goes to church and is a nice person (or) 2.) He/ they always made me uncomfortable and was weird,,
    It is sad that we really don't know about our neighbors and what they are capable of. Would they even let you in if you stumbled onto their porch in the middle of the night beaten and barely alive..... would they even recognize you? Do they even know your name to call 911? Would they even open the door?
     
  16. NY Ranger Fan

    NY Ranger Fan Member

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    Regular garden center lime breaks down quickly and may show no or little trace other than the pH of soil samples under the discovered bodies, but they would have to be looking for it. The acidity of local vegetation can neutralize it fairly quickly. This is why you can lime your lawn every year safely.

    The first weeks of a body breaking down is where the odor is strongest. Once the bodily fluids seep into the ground, the smell may be undetectable from even a close proximity.

    Quick lime is what farmers use when they dispose of livestock remains. This is calcium oxide (CaO) and far different from what is used by Harry Homeowner around the yard. It has more odor stopping properties than a tissue decomposition accelerant and may actually preserve a body rather than break it down. It will ward off insects and flies as well as scavenging animals that attract attention.

    Was it used by LISK? I've never seen any mention of it anywhere in what I've read so far. Quick lime is a commercial item, not readily found at home centers but available online (like many other commercial chemicals). The likelihood of regular lime being used is more probable, but that effectiveness would only buy a little time to mask a corpse.
     
  17. Salsa

    Salsa Former Member

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    Does anyone know if burlap is transfer proof? Hair, carpet fibers, permeable substance, or other evidence does not stick to it. I have heard of no evidence regarding any transfer fibers of any material. Not one piece of hair. arm hair, caught in bag as they were stuffed in.
     
  18. Ms.Jules

    Ms.Jules Member

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    I believe someone on this thread said they use burlap on the floor in their sewing room because it picks up leftover thread, fabric etc. something to that effect. So that would be yes, it is a possibility of transfer evidence they may have found. I have a feeling we will never know..........


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  19. NY Ranger Fan

    NY Ranger Fan Member

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    Burlap will pick up and hold fibers, hairs, pieces of thread easily. But to sort it out after a year on the ground exposed to the elements and animal traffic is next to impossible and the killer had that in mind when he chose burlap. Great camouflage, biodegradable, not easily traced.
     
  20. Super Sleuth

    Super Sleuth Armchair Detective

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    You're walking and you notice a big black plastic bag in the woods... curious? You're walking and might notice a burlap sack... maybe not so curious?

    The burlap sacks are less suspecting than a big black plastic bag. Someone driving down Ocean Pkwy would notice a big black bag faster than a burlap sack. I don't think the killer just used them because he had them. He thought that out very carefully.

    Either way, there should still be hair fibers on the inside of the sacks. At least DNA that can be traced back to the one same killer. And what about this "touch DNA" that can be done now? Is that useless in this case?
     

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