CA CA - Barbara Thomas, 69, from Bullhead City AZ, disappeared in Mojave desert, 12 July 2019 #8

Discussion in 'Missing Persons Discussion' started by fictionisbetter, Jul 13, 2019.

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  1. Sabrina1011

    Sabrina1011 Well-Known Member

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    I have frequently thought this same thing about Jennifer Dulos.
     
  2. MsBetsy

    MsBetsy Well-Known Member

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    Isn't there plenty of evidence of foul play in that case, as well as motive?
    In this case there is no evidence of either one.

    There is also no indication that she would have disappeared on her own, especially since she was planning on visiting her brother in the hospital. Imo
     
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  3. Sabrina1011

    Sabrina1011 Well-Known Member

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    Just because I “think” it doesn’t mean it is true. I am absolutely no expert here, I just like reading about these cases. Just making conversation about how I have actually thought that about Jennifer because she is so mysteriously gone, this is exactly why I usually don’t post anything because I don’t want to get roasted.
     
  4. 10ofRods

    10ofRods Verified Anthropologist

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    Okay, so I tried to figure out more about the property issues, since there's such a lull here.

    Dbdb recalls that RT was the real estate agent involved in a purchase made by Barbara before they were married. I can't find a record of that. But I do have records on a real estate sale by Barbara (and a person who jointly owned the property with her) on January 27, 2006. She was a joint tenant, the property sold for $359,000 (which was split between the two owners, one of whom is someone we've never heard of before and isn't part of this case).

    It appears that Barbara continued to live on in that condo, after its sale, with the new owner(s) as her landlords. RT joined her there. She then was part of the purchase of her current home (in 2008, for $312,000).

    The current house is owned in joint tenancy, so no trust.

    Residence history: 2008-now Bullhead City, AZ
    Late 2006-early 2009 Henderson, NV
    2005-early 2007 Boulder City, NV
    2000-2006 - San Diego, CA (but with residency records during that period in Phoenix - looks like perhaps she owned a place in SD, but lived in Phoenix?)

    Anyway, 11 years in Bullhead City. There have to be some friends, associates - something?

    I am going to assume that a place to start with a marriage records search would be Nevada, although I don't know how useful that information is. I am assuming some of the overlapping residential information is coming from USPS.

    If I"m confused about RT and real estate, maybe Dbdb will have a chance to correct me.
     
  5. campbellsouup

    campbellsouup Well-Known Member

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    Property Records

    It doesn't look like they ever sold the Henderson house, I wonder if they rent it out or something
     
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  6. AliceInPain

    AliceInPain Well-Known Member

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    bbm
    I see plenty of evidence of foul play in this case, and where a spouse is gone, there is always motive.
    jmo.
     
  7. Kapua

    Kapua Well-Known Member

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    Strange, but not without prededent. Steven Capobianco in the Charli Scott case (he is now serving a well-deserved life sentence for murder.) Here's an excerpt from his interview with Maui Now reporter Mileka Lincoln:

    Mileka: “Have they officially questioned you? Sometimes they make people take a lie detector test.”

    Steven: “I volunteered for all of that. I went down there as soon as I could. I let them interrogate me. I let them polygraph me. I did everything.”

    Mileka: “How’d the polygraph go?”

    Steven: “To the best of my knowledge, it went ok.”

    Mileka: “Did you pass, fail?”

    Steven: “The Police told me I failed.”

    Steven: “They didn’t make me take it again. I’m honestly not convinced I failed, I think they might have just said that as a tactic, but I really don’t know I’m walking around right now without handcuffs on.”

    https://mauinow.com/2016/08/06/tv-reporter-testifies-at-capobianco-murder-trial/
     
    Last edited: Aug 31, 2019
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  8. 10ofRods

    10ofRods Verified Anthropologist

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    I would think so. I also came across a record for a worker's comp distributed settlement for Barbara. I would also assume she had SS.
     
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  9. MsBetsy

    MsBetsy Well-Known Member

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    Yes, there can be, but I thought in the other case it was a little clearer what the motive may be, where in this case we don't even know if there is a suspect yet.

    (By evidence I mean known evidence that LE has, not what we assume is evidence.)
     
    Last edited: Aug 31, 2019
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  10. MsBetsy

    MsBetsy Well-Known Member

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    I'm not saying it's true, I was just asking.

    I'm not caught up on the other case.
    I thought her husband was a suspect in her murder, and there was evidence that he was involved. I did not know there might be evidence that she went off on her own, I just meant that in this case it does not seem that Barbara went missing voluntarily.
     
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  11. MsBetsy

    MsBetsy Well-Known Member

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    Maybe there is some weird psychological explanation.
    Didn't Merrit say something about his polygraph that wasn't true? Or maybe he said he passed but he really didn't? I can't remember.

    Seems like everybody lies about their lie detector tests. Imo
     
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  12. Twistinginthewind

    Twistinginthewind Well-Known Member

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    I have too, for both women, in the part of my psyche that thinks it would be nice (if they had escaped on purpose and were some place holed up and waiting for things to blow over and for them to be safe again). Unfortunately, I have followed so many missing persons cases where after wishing it and holding out a secret hope for it being true, they were found to be murdered. And there always seems to be something about their lives and the timing of their disappearance, that would indicate otherwise, for me anyway. With both Barbara and Jennifer, I am reluctant to think they would leave their families distraught, thinking the worst had happened to them. But that's just MOO
     
  13. Twistinginthewind

    Twistinginthewind Well-Known Member

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    Thanks, campbellsouup, that's informative. Polygraphs are interesting, IMO. Here's what SBCSO Special Investigations webpage says about polygraphs:

    "The function of the polygrapher is to assist an investigator in establishing the truth-telling profile of a job applicant, crime suspect, or the credibility of a witness. The polygraph can assist an investigator by giving direction on the investigation and assist in corroborating evidence and statements that may otherwise be difficult to measure. It is not intended to, nor can it replace, basic investigative techniques or evidence interpretation."
    Specialized Investigations – San Bernardino County Sheriff's Department
     
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  14. Twistinginthewind

    Twistinginthewind Well-Known Member

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    I agree it was strange.

    (1) Maybe that's all he could think of to say in his state of confusion and upset, to acknowledge it right off and be above board about his take on what LE was thinking. He could have mistook some of their questioning and giving him the polygraph as them being 'suspicious' of him when it was actually just routine stuff (this is what the LE spokesperson was quoted as saying in the Media Thread in the Daily Mail article -- it was all routine to question both family members and the last person to have seen an MP, and he happened to be both, but when pressed by DM interviewer (about him saying he thought he was their prime suspect), she said that was up to him / his business if he wanted to think / say that).

    (2) Maybe it was a ruse or a signal to her abductor(s) (he was so certain were involved in her disappearance) that they were not in danger of being 'found out' because LE was looking at him as the 'prime suspect'. Which would go along with what he said on camera to whoever took her about just dropping her off somewhere, no questions asked. And, hey, I'm being looked at as the bad guy, so you really don't need to worry.

    MOO
     
    Last edited: Aug 31, 2019
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  15. campbellsouup

    campbellsouup Well-Known Member

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    IMO prime suspect is pretty appropriate terminology for that point in the investigation, it is a missing persons case where there is only one party left to explain what happened. That one person would obviously be treated as a witness, but would also be the only suspect at the beginning of the investigation, since nobody else was there. That can always change further down the investigation.

    Could have been as simple as the sheriff explaining this to RT. The thing with news reporting is they usually will talk through the interview first to see where they are going to go with it, so this was likely not his first telling of the story to their crew. When you repeat info like that you subconsciously simplify it / dull it down. A simple "They even said I was the prime suspect at this point!" could have ended up something more tame like "They said I'm the prime suspect" which can have an entirely different connotation.
     
    Last edited: Aug 31, 2019
  16. 10ofRods

    10ofRods Verified Anthropologist

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    I see lots of bad and questionable decision-making in this case, but holiday-makers are often bad decision-makers. Stressed people overlook things that would benefit their safety. We are all capable of poor decisions. Is that what happened here?

    In fact, if RT is not a suspect, but merely who he is (and, in my view, a participant in some questionable decision-making), then that's still part of finding Barbara.

    If she really is near where he says she is (and I know of too many searches that missed someone on first search), we need to be open to and aware of that. It's true it was a very extensive search/recovery mission. I think that's because LE believed him - they thought she was out there. They may not have been thinking exactly as Barbara did, they may not be accounting for all variables (did she try to hitch a ride? did she choose the wrong trail at some point? was she a fast walker and still pretty energetic at that time of day?) It was only 20 people on day one, of whom probably 12 were actually in the field at a time.

    There are lots and lots of other, specific questions that make me want to put some pressure on LE for another search. When it's cooler.
     
  17. ZsaZsa

    ZsaZsa Well-Known Member

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    He probably thought a display of righteous indignation would signal his innocence.
    Barbara's son didn't buy a word of it though, and neither did I. Cunning, IMO.
     
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  18. ChuckMaureen

    ChuckMaureen Well-Known Member

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    As has been noted in this and other case threads, more than a few times a body has been recovered from an area previously searched, and searched numerous times by different entities. "Gee, how'd we miss that?!"

    It appears the 'rock formation' was searched, as there are photographs showing searchers on the slope and top of the formation. Did those searchers climb the formation to peruse every possible crevice and pocket or did they climb the formation only to get long-distance views of the broader area? I hope their purpose included both.

    If they have not done so already, it's time to get cadaver dogs on the formation; searchers may have to carry the dogs up the rocks, as it seems nearly impossible for a dog's stride to safely accommodate the distances between sloped, smoother boulders.

    Before certain avenues may be effectively pursued, others must be eliminated from the list. Either BT is in that desert rock formation or within the limited (within 5-15 minutes walking distance) broader desert area or, she isn't.

    LE must be positive the search teams performed flawlessly and be adamant BT is not in the limited desert area. When that is true and, given the extremely low probability of an abductor just happening along Kelbaker or Hidden Hill the exact moment BT was approaching their RV... there are only two possibilities left: BT disappeared on her own accord or the other possibility, which we are not permitted to comment.

    This has gone on long enough. I believe LE is stumped at this point. They have no direction which to pursue. Short of a discovery, a confession or a someone giving up what they know, this case will reach temperatures typically experienced only in Antarctica, and that makes me sad.
     
    Last edited: Aug 31, 2019
  19. 10ofRods

    10ofRods Verified Anthropologist

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    You and I are thinking the same thing (about the cadaver dogs). I watched all the SAR video I could find, and what I see are sniffer dogs (the same ones, possibly on multiple days). Now, I don't know if they call bringing in cadaver dogs a "search" (as in, SAR is involved). If it's a recovery mission, I think it's often just LE and cadaver dogs.

    They'd want to search a broader area, too. My friends in SAR say that in conditions like the Mojave right now, it is really hard to get out there and stage before it becomes too hot. Not for a recovery situation anyway.
     
  20. rkidd21

    rkidd21 Member

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    Excuse me if I missed this question in the threads some where...

    Is there any proof that BT ever arrived at the camp location in Mojave? It seems RT is the only person to have confirmed this story happened.
     
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