CA CA - Bob Harrod, 81, Orange County, 27 July 2009 - #15

[zwiebel]

Okay, I've tried and completely failed with the graph/timeline thing. I'm going to ask someone who is good at that sort of stuff if it's possible. It really is a waste of time for me to try and do it.

I think.......we really, really need a word from LE at this stage. Even if it is just to say the investigation is active, or ongoing. I mean, we have an old article here where LE says the investigation is 'dormant' but not cold, or something. That doesn't sound promising. And 'Long Lost Love' has been and gone.

I think.....people need guidance. Is this a 'recovery investigation'? Is there any possibility LE are looking for a live Bob? Where should people look, if they are looking?

I know the answer to most of us will be obvious, but to others it might not be. I wish those in charge of Bob's case would just say something - anything - officially. People, including the media, need something to go on, to keep his case alive.

 

[Seajay]

As far as I'm concerned, Agnes is the only one who is correct in her timeline. I look at it this way. She made arrangements with Bob to be there on Monday instead of Tuesday. They would have also talked about a time for her arrival. And she would have made that time. She was an employee, she had a schedule. She knew what time she was suppose to be where. If she says noon, it's because she was suppose to be there at noon. This was her job. So IMO noon it is.

So how does the 11:00-11:30 am phone call from PB fit in?? That narrows things down to 1 hour to half an hour if she's to be believed. (Not saying she is.) And JeM was just RETURNING from somewhere that doesn't have a receipt.

And I remember one of the daughters saying that even though Bob told them to get lost for 6 months, she still went by to check on him and he seemed ok with her presence there, so it wasn't a complete 6 month dry spell where none of them saw him.

 

[deca]

IDK but I am thinking I am going to ignore the "favorable" phone call. That would free up a lot of time.
Unless....would it be possible that Bob was hidden somewhere (like the garage?) that the CL wouldn't have gone in? But LE took cadaver dogs through the house and grounds, right?

 

[zwiebel]

I do believe Agnes' words on Disappeared. I don't think there was any sloppy program making or mistakes on her part there.

But...I am still wondering about the 3pm timeline we had for so long, and why it happened. If you were the housekeeper, and you saw all those articles appearing stating son-in-law had a receipt for 3.04pm, yet you knew Bob was gone by 12 noon, wouldn't you have said? At least go to LE and remind them you had told them Bob was gone by noon, when you arrived?

We know the housekeeper was interviewed, but that 3pm timeline went on for a long, long time. In fact, it was the 'current' timeline up until the Disappeared episode. All the later media reports have it.

So I am still wondering what happened, because I am convinced something did. And still wondering why LE haven't at least released the time they think Bob went missing. If they want people to come forward with what they saw, it would really help at this stage if people knew when they were supposed to be remembering.

I know LE said they didn't want to show their hand a few years ago, but I'm beginning to wonder if they have handed in their chips now. They haven't capitalised on Disappeared at all, as far as I can see, and that's disappointing. Not even a single line of a press release to help the media. Or the local public who might have taken an interest in his case.

It's not really my problem though, it's theirs. I'm not an Orange County LE Officer and don't bear the weight of that responsibility. There is only one missing person on the Placentia police website though and he kind of sticks out like a sore thumb. Eighty-one-year old newlywed, just disappears from under the nose of media? A marine vet, to boot? Leaving behind an elderly, vulnerable widow who has been struggling for years to keep her husband's case in the spotlight, in very adverse - if not downright frightening - circumstances?

I am glad Bob's case isn't my official responsibility. I wouldn't be sleeping nights, if it was.

 

[believe09]

Actually, I am willing to give the family some room for not rushing out and going into Bob's house (some of them)...they had just broke a 6 month separation where Bob had paid them to get out of his business...and then argued again. I can see them reasoning that Bob wanted his independence and had managed by himself for 6 months and might not want them putting their nose back up in his business. They were still very angry with him and walking on a short leash with him. He was still very upset with them.

From your post TDW-I concur with zwiebel. JuM making such an intimate gesture doesnt fit then.

But, I wont give them a pass because their substantially elderly father, one day after a very heated confrontation, disappeared off the face of the earth having last been seen alive by SIL who has apparently never been asked to this day what the timeline for the day was.

:waitasec:

Then the public and apparently LE are told he was showing signs of dementia and would never drive on the highway. Then the phantom SUV and BL are thrown into the mix. PPD is sent on a wild goose chase having to verify the whereabouts of BL(done, crossed off), BL family (done, crossed off), verify with the physician (done, dementia crossed off) and then they discover Bob had recently made a lengthy drive on the highway at night in order to introduce Fontelle to dear friends.

AH wont enter the house without LE, bio family who all live within a small radius of Bob refuse to come and look for him....and within 48 hours, there is an atty on board and a run on Bob's money.

I think they would have been better off if they had said they were refusing to look for him because they dont care and that they were in it for the money. At least everyone would be able to match actions and words. JMVHO.

 

[zwiebel]

For any member of the public who might be wondering, here is the official, Placentia Police flyer.

You are looking for a brown-eyed man, who disappeared from his house at approx 11am. Police know that because; when a 'family member' (I think that means son-in-law) returned to the house about 1pm, Bob was gone.

http://placentia.org/DocumentCenter/Home/View/102

Good luck with sorting that out, any locals who are interested in bringing Bob home. Any queries, please contact Placentia Police Department at the names and numbers listed at the bottom of the flyer. Or maybe not. I think they are slightly out of date too.

 

[believe09]

thats just what we need- more misinformation. If it werent for Mrs Harrod, I would start to suspect that the pictures we have seen werent even Bob... grrrr

 

[Seajay]

IDK but I am thinking I am going to ignore the "favorable" phone call. That would free up a lot of time.
Unless....would it be possible that Bob was hidden somewhere (like the garage?) that the CL wouldn't have gone in? But LE took cadaver dogs through the house and grounds, right?

I agree deca. You wouldn't say "favorable manner" unless one of two things happened. You didn't hear or remember what was said but remember it was positive, or you made it up because you weren't fast enough to think of something better.

That brings the timeline to 10:00am when the last person who is not a family member talked to Bob on the phone and noon when Agnes got there. 2 hours unaccounted for. And JeM was just coming back from somewhere at noon. I bet this is the time he DOESN'T have a receipt for.

Wish Agnes had addressed if JeM had any purchases with him when he met her at the front door. I guess he gave her no explanation as to where he had been???

 

[believe09]

I agree deca. You wouldn't say "favorable manner" unless one of two things happened. You didn't hear or remember what was said but remember it was positive, or you made it up because you weren't fast enough to think of something better.

That brings the timeline to 10:00am when the last person who is not a family member talked to Bob on the phone and noon when Agnes got there. 2 hours unaccounted for. And JeM was just coming back from somewhere at noon. I bet this is the time he DOESN'T have a receipt for.

Wish Agnes had addressed if JeM had any purchases with him when he met her at the front door. I guess he gave her no explanation as to where he had been???

If he was going in and out while she was there, I wonder if she saw other items as well or other purchases? Or some construction waste and how he was transporting it?

 

[zwiebel]

So.

Who gave that info for the official Placentia Police flyer?

If it's correct (brown eyes, disappeared at 11am) why haven't all the 2.30pm, 3pm etc stories in the media been corrected?

It really is not helpful having that flyer there if the information is not correct. If it is correct, that means the majority of the media stories are wrong, and PPD needs to issue an update.

 

[believe09]

So.

Who gave that info for the official Placentia Police flyer?

If it's correct (brown eyes, disappeared at 11am) why haven't all the 2.30pm, 3pm etc stories in the media been corrected?

It really is not helpful having that flyer there if the information is not correct. If it is correct, that means the majority of the media stories are wrong, and PPD needs to issue an update.

Or, the information PPD has regarding a real timeline is hold back because they wanted to see what the family would do....for example, constantly changing the timeline they gave in their statements.

It is kind of comical without being funny-this is why I think the first statement by JuM (dad disappeared 28 hours ago) is closest to the truth. It was before receipts were turned over and all that stuff I bet.
Unfortunately for her, both the 10AM and the 12 or 1PM speculation put JeM in the house, or JeM AND CL in the house at the time Bob disappeared.

Was there collusion between JeM and CL? I have seen all kinds of speculation about all kinds of relationships in this case, but never any mudslinging regarding these two...CL is really beautiful imo.

Now, I dont believe for a hot second there was collusion between them-CL not only appeared on camera, she was very believable. And she did an excellent job of communicating her fear, her distress and her concern about Bob's absence.

Why is there none of the same in his bio family? I would say that they are stoic, but we havent seen that from them at all. In fact we have seen the opposite, right? They have voluminous internet postings about the most mundane things...idk.

 

[Seajay]

Wow. The police flyer says 11 am??? Ok. And now JeM returned at 1 pm instead of noon like the CL said??? I'm getting a migraine. :banghead: I wonder why??

So verified phone call when someone talked to Bob at 10:00 am. JeM saw him at 11:00 when he left to run errands. The CL got there at noon and was locked out because no one answered the door and Bob left no key. JeM returns at 1 pm from running his errands and lets the cleaning lady in who has no waited out there for an hour???

What about PB's call at 11:00-11:30 am now? It would have been closer to 11:00 for the flyer time to work.

The CL cleans for 3 hours, she's spooked about something upstairs, JeM leaves before her to go to HD (the 3:04 receipt), she is then left alone in the house that she feels spooked in?

I'm still looking at 10:00 for the last verified non family member call and noon when the CL said she showed up. 2 hours. Forget the family and their fairy tales. None of them learned how to tell time or they didn't learn how to tell the truth. One or the other. I give up.:truce:

 

[Cubby]

I agree deca. You wouldn't say "favorable manner" unless one of two things happened. You didn't hear or remember what was said but remember it was positive, or you made it up because you weren't fast enough to think of something better.

That brings the timeline to 10:00am when the last person who is not a family member talked to Bob on the phone and noon when Agnes got there. 2 hours unaccounted for. And JeM was just coming back from somewhere at noon. I bet this is the time he DOESN'T have a receipt for.

Wish Agnes had addressed if JeM had any purchases with him when he met her at the front door. I guess he gave her no explanation as to where he had been???

BBM. Bingo! Between the info we have for the 3:04 pm receipt in previous MSM, and the email from an LEO with PPD with the am CVS/Rite Aid (in some places people use the term rite aid like people do Kleenex.) along with the reinactment of JeM's interview with Det. Loomis - which verifies the 3:04 receipt, the 'holes' in the timeline are pretty clear.

IMO, the holes in the timeline are what will eventually be cleared up at trial.


And an on another note, cheesy humor warning. Every time I think about Bob's case and baseball, I can't help but want to yell out, "Hey Ernie, Let's convict two!" (Anyone who is a bb fan will get that. )

 

[Cubby]

Or, the information PPD has regarding a real timeline is hold back because they wanted to see what the family would do....for example, constantly changing the timeline they gave in their statements.

It is kind of comical without being funny-this is why I think the first statement by JuM (dad disappeared 28 hours ago) is closest to the truth. It was before receipts were turned over and all that stuff I bet.
Unfortunately for her, both the 10AM and the 12 or 1PM speculation put JeM in the house, or JeM AND CL in the house at the time Bob disappeared.

Was there collusion between JeM and CL? I have seen all kinds of speculation about all kinds of relationships in this case, but never any mudslinging regarding these two...CL is really beautiful imo.

Now, I dont believe for a hot second there was collusion between them-CL not only appeared on camera, she was very believable. And she did an excellent job of communicating her fear, her distress and her concern about Bob's absence.

Why is there none of the same in his bio family? I would say that they are stoic, but we havent seen that from them at all. In fact we have seen the opposite, right? They have voluminous internet postings about the most mundane things...idk.

BBM, that's why I have been thinking for sometime now. I posted before I read your post....

 

[bourne]

So glad you guys have not forgotten sweet Bob Harrod! He deserves to be found, and also deserves justice because I suspect foul play is definitely involved.

I had watched the Disappeared episode last week and had some deep impressions of the POIs. But got caught up with real life and the Boston thread. and SIGH, now I've forgotten my thoughts!

Anyhow, I'll return either later/tomorrow to post my thoughts. I have to re-watch the episode again. lol

 

[believe09]

Looking forward to it bourne!!! :blowkiss:

I think the bulk of the reporting around the last known call, and this includes Disappeared, puts the call around 10AM.That could be any where between 9 and 11 I would think. I favor the call being before 10AM because that works with the timeline JuM provided...the earliest one that is.

It doesnt work with the PB call, in that I dont believe PB was the last known.

 

[TDW59]

I think JuM was in the situation of playing pretend I don't know what I know and guessing how and what would be a "normal" thing to do on the day after. I noted before, aside from her forum postings..in the family dynamics she plays the youngest daughter, the "good girl" role.

I think that is what she was doing there the next day..and perpetrating the idea that her dad would be back any minute....creating an illusion, or trying to.

and they were happy for their dad's marriage.

just for that day.

I don't have a very good feel for the other 2 sisters yet, I meant to read back and get to that poison pen letter today but have been busy all day.

My honey did finally manage to download the episode but I have only been able to watch it with other people in the room talking. (boy did we have trouble, it kept freezing up during the introduction argh) :stormingmad:

But I do know that when one of the sisters talked on the show, I felt everything she said was a lie.

Right on about the timeline holes and lack of receipt and sure wish Agnes would have filled in more blanks.

I don't recall there ever being a search with dogs??

With so little real info and so much missing, I wonder at all kinds of possibilities.

I am wondering today if it is at all possible that Bob left with someone other than JeM? Another family member??

Thank you for the recipe Z. drool.

I, too, think LE could have cleared alot up without jeapordizing the case.

I think I am just too tired to think about it today.

T.

 

[zwiebel]

I don't believe there was any collusion between JeM and the housekeeper. I do wonder if it has come down to a situation of his word against hers though. If the housekeeper arrived at 12pm and left at three, it would be possible for someone to say she only arrived at the house around three.

Of course, if the housekeeper went home and lives with other people, or went to another job after leaving at 3pm, there'd be a problem - there would be someone else to verify she was not at Bob's, maybe?

All the changes for the timeline; does anyone know what LE could actually do with it, prosecution wise? How valuable would it be to a DA to have evidence someone had not told the truth about the times? I was just thinking that proving someone could have had time to disappear Bob, isn't the same as proving they did disappear Bob.

Sigh. Seajay, is there room behind that wall for two?

 

[TDW59]

I don't believe there was any collusion between JeM and the housekeeper.

not in my wildest imaginings!

 

[believe09]

I just find it interesting that in a case where the family's position comes down essentially to feminine wiles (Mrs Harrod and BL), the CL has escaped that character assassination.

I think TDW's assessment of JuM playing a role is spot on. I think that is true for the entire family. They are playing a role and they are off the mark every time.

Still looking for RB to take to the airways with the results of her LDT, but I suspect that ship sailed a while ago. I think it is safe to draw some conclusions about the results, but you never know.