CA/Canada - Elisa Lam - 21 years old - Los Angeles/Vancouver - 31-Jan-2013 - #2

[LittleWing]

Hi guys, I am also new here. I was up until 7 am reading the first thread and am fascinated by this case.

Anyway maybe this is a bit redundant but I'd like to also put forth that she was on the 15th floor.

I think that the lights on many of the elevator buttons were not working properly. Watching the video very closely, keep your eyes on the elevator button panel at around 3.10. When the door opens about halfway, you will see the faint 14th floor button on the panel turn off. And of course as you can see the lights turn off one by one as the elevator descends.

If the photo from yelp is still accurate and nothing happens in the bits of footage that has been omitted

http://www.yelp.com.au/biz_photos/c...-OWLhagZg5E7tpXwXfn8Fw#8WRRjdNxuSdkRLmwF7csdQ

You will see that she must have pressed at least all of the center row floor buttons. The dim lights also accounts for how she went crazy pushing a bunch of buttons the second time around but only a few actually look lit up.





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[Robert White]

I Don't think Elisa was on drugs (Heavily, or at all) and the elevator clip is very scary. She was followed and scared, you can tell. I'm very curious to see how this plays out, and have not been able to sleep the past few nights boiling over this happening where I live. Needless to say, I'm moving to a different area in a month.
I wanted to post as a resident here, and if anyone has any questions about the area, let me know. Sorry if this is scattered, I just have so many thoughts and questions.

I've spent a bit of time speaking to this, and putting forward my experiences and that of my colleagues in regards to this. I am curious as to why you believe her to be followed and scared. Please review my previous posts for background reference if you'd like. And of course, I open this debate to anyone.

 

[tapu]

So she's... using sign language... toward a camera outside the elevator... to signal that she's in trouble. And she signs "friend," "computer," and "capture"?

If it's anything like that, I'll eat my hat.

 

[ShyGamer]

I Don't think Elisa was on drugs (Heavily, or at all) and the elevator clip is very scary. She was followed and scared, you can tell. I'm very curious to see how this plays out, and have not been able to sleep the past few nights boiling over this happening where I live. Needless to say, I'm moving to a different area in a month.

Exactly, I have a very hard time believing that she was on vacation to experiment with drugs, getting drunk and being promiscuous.

Friends of Elisa in Vancouver have consistently mentioned that she does not indulge in drugs, alcohol, or any other kind of risky behavior.

I don't know her personally, but from her personal pictures that are available from the media, she just does not look the type at all.

I can't wait until the toxicological tests come back, I hope I'm not wrong about her. lease:

 

[Shlock Homes]

Hi guys, I am also new here. I was up until 7 am reading the first thread and am fascinated by this case.

Anyway maybe this is a bit redundant but I'd like to also put forth that she was on the 15th floor.

I think that the lights on many of the elevator buttons were not working properly. Watching the video very closely, keep your eyes on the elevator button panel at around 3.10. When the door opens about halfway, you will see the faint 14th floor button on the panel turn off. And of course as you can see the lights turn off one by one as the elevator descends.

If the photo from yelp is still accurate and nothing happens in the bits of footage that has been omitted

http://www.yelp.com.au/biz_photos/c...-OWLhagZg5E7tpXwXfn8Fw#8WRRjdNxuSdkRLmwF7csdQ

You will see that she must have pressed at least all of the center row floor buttons. The dim lights also accounts for how she went crazy pushing a bunch of buttons the second time around but only a few actually look lit up.





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Thanks for reposting the link to the elevator buttons. The bottom middle button is Door Hold. That makes sense now. She was the one who kept the door from closing, not someone in the hallway or someone monitoring the elevator. Door Hold keeps the elevator door open for about a min from what I've read. Since she kept pressing the buttons in the middle section of the panel, she kept hitting the door hold button. Had she pressed the other columns of buttons instead, the door would have shut sooner. The elevator 'malfunction' was not mysterious at all, she did it.

 

[luckycat7]

Hey Robert. The first time I watched the video, I felt that this is exactly how I would be in a situation like I "imagined" I imagine that like my own building, the security can switch the elevators to manual mode. The first time they did this and I walked in, I was so confused and pressing several buttons to try to get the elevator to close. Doors would also slightly start to close and keep going back like it does at the beginning of the video. How this happened with Elisa. I don't know. It's not uncommon for these security guards to have their gangs of friends loitering around or anything. Maybe it was a staffer who could manually do this, maybe they did a favor for their buddy. Sometimes one elevator is left like this for people moving in/out. I feel a staffer is definitely involved, though.

She seemed to be playing it cool when she walked in, she seemed to have known she was being tailed but swiftly got in and assumed that she would be able to go to a different floor. From there, I can see her getting panicked and I would be reacting with the same gestures (Hands on the head, changing positions, jumping in and out of the car) I do believe somebody may have been outside as well, but its so hard to give definitive proof of where and what was transpiring. She's definitely explaining something to someone, and the odd gestures seem to be out of growing fear. I do the same thing. I'm not sure what to think about her walking away or the suspicion of the hand or foot at 2:28 but I just feel that she wasn't on drugs, or mentally ill.

Im 23 and tout the same attitude about my "mental illness" as she does on her tumblr its just something us twenty somethings all joke about. We're actually okay. lol.

 

[tapu]

I've spent a bit of time speaking to this, and putting forward my experiences and that of my colleagues in regards to this. I am curious as to why you believe her to be followed and scared. Please review my previous posts for background reference if you'd like. And of course, I open this debate to anyone.

To me she comes off as being followed, but by someone who's coming with her, someone she is having fun with. If she were afraid, I don't think she'd do the quick back and forth look the way she does it. She would seem more cowed, body language that starts out tentative before looking out. Certainly when she is outside the elevator, she isn't frightened. That doesn't seem like what you'd do, stand there bopping around, if you were scared.

 

[NTG86]

So she's... using sign language... toward a camera outside the elevator... to signal that she's in trouble. And she signs "friend," "computer," and "capture"?

If it's anything like that, I'll eat my hat.

I just posted the video because it does look like she signs "friend."

Another possibility is that she was drugged and that was her attempt to use sign language while on drugs.

 

[Shlock Homes]

I just posted the video because it does look like she signs "friend."

Another possibility is that she's drugged and that was her attempt to use sign language while on drugs.

She also looks like she could counting off points she's trying to make to someone in her head or to herself (first....then....etc...), you know when you using all of your fingers on one hand and grab one finger at a time on the other. After watching the video many times, I'm not convinced she's chatting with anyone in particular. Its all happening in her head.

 

[LittleWing]

Just noticed something....8if she pressed all the center buttons (14,10,7,4,M, possibly B possibly door hold), it would appear that the door opening on levels 14 and 10 has been omitted from the footage. I say this because at 3.38 if you watch carefully, the third button down (what would be 7) turns off. It's hard for me to see the gaps in the footage according to the time lapses. Would the above be accurate to say?



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[ShyGamer]

It's unfortunate the Cecil hotel does not have better security cameras set up, it's not enough to capture only what's inside the elevator. We're not seeing enough to get a clear perspective of what really happened, and there are not enough witnesses.

 

[fred&edna]

It's really interesting to see all the opinions as to her hand gestures. I saw what appears to be stroking/petting as you would do to a dog and then with the knee bends it still looks to me like she's tying and pulling (twice -two knee bends) some imaginary thing. It's been years since I've actively practiced "signing" but I don't see any language/message she's attempting to convey.

 

[cluciano63]

What is that sleeping pill that has had some side effect where people did all sorts of things in their sleep? I cannot think of the name but it has been in the news recently. If she mentioned insomnia, she could have tried it.

 

[Robert White]

Hey Robert. The first time I watched the video, I felt that this is exactly how I would be in a situation like I "imagined" I imagine that like my own building, the security can switch the elevators to manual mode. The first time they did this and I walked in, I was so confused and pressing several buttons to try to get the elevator to close. Doors would also slightly start to close and keep going back like it does at the beginning of the video. How this happened with Elisa. I don't know. It's not uncommon for these security guards to have their gangs of friends loitering around or anything. Maybe it was a staffer who could manually do this, maybe they did a favor for their buddy. Sometimes one elevator is left like this for people moving in/out. I feel a staffer is definitely involved, though.

She seemed to be playing it cool when she walked in, she seemed to have known she was being tailed but swiftly got in and assumed that she would be able to go to a different floor. From there, I can see her getting panicked and I would be reacting with the same gestures (Hands on the head, changing positions, jumping in and out of the car) I do believe somebody may have been outside as well, but its so hard to give definitive proof of where and what was transpiring. She's definitely explaining something to someone, and the odd gestures seem to be out of growing fear. I do the same thing. I'm not sure what to think about her walking away or the suspicion of the hand or foot at 2:28 but I just feel that she wasn't on drugs, or mentally ill.

In regards to specifically the highlighted area:

I've discussed the dynamics of fight or flight (simplified), as well as thoughts in regards to individual threat levels and assessments. I have argued that given this, people typically do not confine themselves (ie. elevator vs. optional routes).

But let us assume that Elisa was in such a mindset took the first available route to her. If we go on the theory that you presented that she was knowledgeable in her tail, we would see some evidence in defensive posture, which shows no matter how trained you are (ie. raised shoulders, balled fists, or pressed to the corner immediately).

Instead what we see is that she took her time in pressing buttons, then stood centre-bottom of the elevator, rather than corners. We can also see that she entered from the left, and if her adversary came from either left/right, she would have reacted with the farthest available corner. This did not occur.

Contrary again, is that she kept exiting the elevator. Under duress, we typically see individuals stay within a protected area. If she knew someone was out there, she wouldn't have escaped regardless. Control is based on the ability to inflict fear. I did not see any indicators that fear was present.

Either or, I enjoy our debate! Not trying to shut you down - we have our theories based on our professional/life experiences. I am also from Vancouver, but I am in various places now due to my work. Ps. I am not terribly older than you either!

 

[manlet]

I read two reviews for the hotel that mentioned the "communal bathrooms and showers are located near the elevators".

 

[luckycat7]

In regards to specifically the highlighted area:

I've discussed the dynamics of fight or flight (simplified), as well as thoughts in regards to individual threat levels and assessments. I have argued that given this, people typically do not confine themselves (ie. elevator vs. optional routes).

But let us assume that Elisa was in such a mindset took the first available route to her. If we go on the theory that you presented that she was knowledgeable in her tail, we would see some evidence in defensive posture, which shows no matter how trained you are (ie. raised shoulders, balled fists, or pressed to the corner immediately).

!

This is true, however, I do believe that different cultures do react differently in situations. Elisa, being of Chinese descent, may not show emotions and defense as much as other cultures.

I don't really know how to piece together what I really think is going on, but she may think she is being followed and that's what I got from the video. You guys here are really methodical in your thinking process, it's really interesting to read your viewpoints:waitasec:

 

[fred&edna]

It is also strange to note that she gets in the elevator again around 1.30 and at that point she appears to be pressing many of the buttons and as soon as she does she steps off ... as if she plainly doesn't expect the elevator to move.

 

[fred&edna]

What is that sleeping pill that has had some side effect where people did all sorts of things in their sleep? I cannot think of the name but it has been in the news recently. If she mentioned insomnia, she could have tried it.

Could you be thinking of Ambien? There have been several posts mentioning it.

 

[Robert White]

This is true, however, I do believe that different cultures do react differently in situations. Elisa, being of Chinese descent, may not show emotions and defense as much as other cultures.

I don't really know how to piece together what I really think is going on, but she may think she is being followed and that's what I got from the video. You guys here are really methodical in your thinking process, it's really interesting to read your viewpoints:waitasec:

I'm new to this board - only joined because of my interest in this case as she is from my hometown. I even likely know many people she knows (six degrees of separation).

I am actually of Chinese origin myself. The thing with fear is that it reveals itself intrinsically no matter what the culture/race/religion. We all see the video in our light, and I respect your perspective.

 

[sherbetjello]

Posters are still referring to the sighting of Elisa on the street corner, and I’m interested in the rationale as to why anyone is considering that a credible sighting. The ”sighting” was posted on the net Friday, Feb 15. The poster said it was the previous Saturday, which would be Feb 9.

Where do you think she was from Jan 31 to Feb 9, and how do you think she ended up back in the water tanks at the Cecil without anyone seeing her there?

I have very little doubt that it wasn't Elisa that was seen, but someone that looks very familiar to her. It would be very easy to confuse the plethora of young asian girls that are in that area. Hope that statement doesn't sound ignorant, it's just very true (and I have no PC way of saying it, sorry).