CA - Elliot Rodger kills 6, injures 13 in Isla Vista, Near UC Santa Barbara, #3

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Nymeria said:
Has any MSM confirmed this besides the Daily Mail?
Appreciate the link....but is IS the DM, y'know? :giggle:



ETA- I wish they would stop calling him "Virgin Killer".
IMO that is going to push young adults who may still be virgins even harder, associating anyone who is still a virgin with someone who will "snap" one day.
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“I understand he was on Xanax for about six months,” Astaire said

http://abcnews.go.com/US/parents-santa-barbara-killer-distraught-speech-stuttered/story?id=23908059
 
CARIIS said:
I did not read whole thing and am not asking quote !! What was the general drift when he mentioned Xanex and did he mention it more than once?
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The only specific reference to Xanax was on pg 133, when he is discussing the end of his plan:

"...I will quickly swallow all of the Xanax and Vicodin pills I have left, along with an ample amount of hard liquor."
 
BigCat said:
Virgin killer Elliot Rodger's 'Xanax addiction made him withdrawn and anxious in days before his murderous rampage'

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ous-days-murderous-rampage.html#ixzz33gSXmQQD
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If I recall reading his manifesto, he said this from page 109,

I had to wait a few hours for them to prepare the laptop for me, and while I waited I decided to go to the shooting range in Oxnard. I had the knowledge, in the back of my mind, that the Day of Retribution was very possible now. Going to the shooting range while I waited for my laptop gave me the perfect opportunity to gain some initial training in shooting guns, which will be the main weapons I use as vengeance against my enemies when the Day of Retribution ultimately comes to pass. I walked into the range, rented a handgun from the ugly old redneck cashier, and started to practice shooting at paper targets. As I fired my first few rounds, I felt so sick to the stomach. I questioned my whole life, and I looked at the gun in front of me and asked myself “What am I doing here? How could things have led to this?” I couldn’t believe my life was actually turning out this way. There I was, practicing shooting with real guns because I had a plan to carry out a massacre. Why did things have to be this way, I silently questioned myself as I looked at the handgun I was holding in front of me. I paid my fee and left the range within minutes, feeling as if I was going to be sick. I spent the rest of the waiting period at the Coffee Bean in Oxnard, where I sat by myself feeling absolutely disgusted. My whole world was twisted.

I do not think Xanax pill had anything to do with it. He clearly planned the crime for more than a year.
 
I notice that some people who knew Elliot Rodger, Jared Loughner, and Seung-Hui thought they might be a rampage killer. However, there are no known accounts of people thinking that Adam Lanza and James Holmes would be a rampage killer. Holmes did show red flags prior the massacre.

Rodger, Loughner, and Cho had run-ins with the police and had red flags. Lanza was investigated by the FBI for possibly hacking servers. Other than that, his condition raised red flags. As for Holmes, there were red flags raised about him.
 
ATasteOfHoney said:
The irony of the now-rarely-prescribed Valium is this: Xanax (for those of you that get my drift....wink, wink).


The dreaded "Mother's little helper" is like tic tac candy compared to the stuff they dispense out like water today. Iykwim?
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My Dear Mega Sleuths:

I've returned... been some buzzing going on... about the bike. How the evening photos reveal no bicycle... and the morning photos reveal a plant. The theory behind it is sub-par, but I could see them putting the bike "on top." This means:

HYPOTHETICAL

The bike is actually 100 yards away, but it is planted next to the car - for optics... another case if insulting our intelligence.
(e.g.: they won't be able to really get behind a gun grab unless they see the bike, is the idea)

Do I believe this ?
What do you think? Here's the you tube on it :

Proof Police Staged Elliot Rodger Crime Scene - YouTube
Who knows... sad.


In other news, looking forward to catching up. I can only imagine.

We know he had no talent, outside of WOW and writing. The girl who survived, after getting shot five times, that's a miracle. Bless her... she is special.

Luv ya,

The Gajonka
 
ATasteOfHoney said:
The irony of the now-rarely-prescribed Valium is this: Xanax (for those of you that get my drift....wink, wink).


The dreaded "Mother's little helper" is like tic tac candy compared to the stuff they dispense out like water today. Iykwim?
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I enjoyed the interview with "simon" the Brit. He was informative.
 
THAT drug is widely abused-and addictive big time!!

Question : Throughout the writings was alcohol mentioned a lot ?
 
gajonka said:
I enjoyed the interview with "simon" the Brit. He was informative.
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I did too, and it appeared as if he was not going to violate his friends (parents) by going on worldwide tv and acknowledging their son mental problems.Like boundaries- its up to them to release what they want to/ Respect.

I just learned about the Vicodin- thanx. So we do need autopsy - what befuddles is why media has not "asked" for any results. that IMO is just "odd".

In a crime, can the families refuse to have their deceased undergo one? Maybe all the families refused - could they?
 
CARIIS said:
I did too, and it appeared as if he was not going to violate his friends (parents) by going on worldwide tv and acknowledging their son mental problems.Like boundaries- its up to them to release what they want to/ Respect.

I just learned about the Vicodin- thanx. So we do need autopsy - what befuddles is why media has not "asked" for any results. that IMO is just "odd".

In a crime, can the families refuse to have their deceased undergo one? Maybe all the families refused - could they?
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Yes, in his life story - his plan was to take all of his vikes and his xannys- jst before shooting himself- as that would surely kill him.... he writes... it's like... oh boy, he must have had a lot.
 
I don't think anyone predicted any of them would be rampage killers. Now some people who met him when he was 5 say "if I had to guess who would do this, it would be him." While I can believe he displayed unsettling behavior at a young age, I do not think they ever actually entertained that thought until it happened. Loughner's parents had kicked him out, I believe, so maybe they had an inkling. But clearly the family members of these people didn't believe they were sadistic murderers, whether people view them as ignorant or not. Clearly his roommates and the other person in that apartment didn't think ER would go on a murder spree, and neither did his parents. Maybe the people who were present for his balcony incident. Very, very few people are predicted to be rampage killers. And if we tried, I can't even imagine the amount of people we would have to lock up to be reasonably sure this wouldn't happen again, especially because the clearest objective indicator is access to guns. A person can be a total nut, but they can't go on a rampage shooting until they have a gun. Most people can have guns and never develop any of the issues that lead to rampage shootings - for practicality reasons, I do not support increased gun control laws in terms of addressing this specific type of situation because I do not believe they can help to the extent that they can be legally and politically implemented. People keep saying look at the whole picture for ER - but we need actual criteria to take action. The whole picture is very hard to come by in advance and is largely pieced together in hindsight. I think most people in here, even if they are not pro-gun control, do want people who seem nutty to be off the streets once it's become clear they've acquired guns and are not just being socially awkward and pissed off in their rooms, like huge amounts of young people are. But that system risks a whole lot of people getting their guns taken away after any incident of abnormal behavior, which would essentially mean people would have to demonstrate a completely stable personality and undergo a full background to get a weapon. That would be impossible and unconstitutional, and I think people would be surprised by how few make the cut.
 
HMSHood said:
I notice that some people who knew Elliot Rodger, Jared Loughner, and Seung-Hui thought they might be a rampage killer. However, there are no known accounts of people thinking that Adam Lanza and James Holmes would be a rampage killer. Holmes did show red flags prior the massacre.

Rodger, Loughner, and Cho had run-ins with the police and had red flags. Lanza was investigated by the FBI for possibly hacking servers. Other than that, his condition raised red flags. As for Holmes, there were red flags raised about him.
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Lanza was sitting in his mother's basement most of the time. People just never got a chance to know him to figure out he was going to be a rampage killer. But there were some red flags about him as well, such as violent writings when he was a child and still went to school.
 
CARIIS said:
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See links below for everything that follows![/FONT]

Psyc meds tend to get clumped together. They are different. Stuff like Xanax , Ativan treat the symptoms of mental illness (anxiety/insomnia). Think aspirin for headache – it is not addressing the reason for the headache , only the symptom of “pain”.

My hunch here is the drug class you are referring (benzodiazepines / barbiturates.(Xanax, Ativan etc.). These classification of drugs do have tolerance issues (need more to get same effect) and withdrawal ( body craving as the drug leaves your system). Think alcohol – hangover is withdrawal – alcohol leaving body basically.


For lack of a better term, the "pure” psych meds (illness itself) -antidepressants, anti-psychotics, (Paxil , Zoloft etc. etc.) typically do not have tolerance and withdrawal issues in the pure sense of “addiction” need more and more.


The antipsychotics/antidepressants are attempting to alter the differing illnesses themselves (depression/psychosis/bipolar) not focusing directly or only on symptoms by altering neurotransmitters in the individuals brain. There are 4 main neurotransmitters associated with mental illness (there are others but the main 4 are , DopamineEpinephrine Serotonin and Norepineine.

Mental illness basically (again complicated but basically!) is a result of differing levels of the 4 . Some excite the person. Some slow the person down (basically!) “They regulate” the brain and body The reason why there is so much trial and error (and awful results) with a lot of them (the ones attempting to address the illness itself not the symptoms) is because docs are guessing basically (there are basic starting points!) what the levels are at the start. (Again basically!)

All of them increase or decrease neurotransmitters levels. BUT the problem is if the client is thrown an antidepressant which increases an already high neurotransmitter – problems. Some try to decrease some. Again , if the level is already low, and the drug thrown at the patient lowers the one that is low already -- problem again.

That is why you see so many with endless lists of Rx history in mental health.. The only way they do it now is to try different ones and wait and see if it makes one feel like crap, or increases negative symptopns.!

Now the real sad part about this (controversial) is neurotransmitter testing is starting to become better. (Think insulin/glucose)Think of how magnificent (even if not an exact science ) if the person prescribing has an idea of which is elevated, which are normative and which ones deficient, at least there would be a much better starting point. That’s western medicine, big pharm ($).

Some addictions have direct withdrawal profiles (mental or physical withdrawal), which if not addressed can be fatal (alcohol/ barbiturates). Interestingly, if a heroin addict came to an ER for withdrawal(not overdoes) and an alcoholic came in for withdrawal the alcoholic would be admitted instantly (alcohol withdrawal can kill physically). Heroin withdrawal wont.. Overdoes versus withdrawal are different things!

IMO

Folks tend to “like” the ones that relieve the symptom (Xanax etc.). However the ones attempting to address the illness directly are more problematic and medication non-compliance with these is MUCH higher.

And think about it. If your anxious, and you take Xanax and you feel less anxious in an hour that is rewarding. BUT that class needs more, over time to get the same result.

But if you are given an antidepressant/ antipsychotic and you start to feel worse – you’re not going to want to take them. Throw in the fact that if one has tried three different ones in the past and had horrible experience each time there is a unwieldiness to try another one. Positive or negative reinforcement!

Xanex- lots abuse! It has sedative qualities-- the liklhood of someone going out of control on Xanex, alone, is low !

IMO
Don’t know if that helps any!

http://www.trentonian.com/lifestyle/20140401/heroin-addicts-face-barriers-to-treatment
http://natashatracy.com/medicationtype/psych-meds-addictive-antipsychotics/)
http://quizlet.com/6847241/major-neurotransmitters-and-their-functions-flash-cards/
http://www.whyneuroscience.com/
http://www.health.harvard.edu/newsletters/Harvard_Womens_Health_Watch/2010/November/going-off-antidepressants
http://chealth.canoe.ca/drug_info_details.asp?brand_name_id=333
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What a great post! Thank you! I have taken zanax, years ago, found it did nothing for me and stopped within 3 months. I currently take a benzo, clonazapam and respiridone an antipsychotic. I have been on benzos for 3 years with no tolerance issues. Same dosage. Tried going off respiridone and had bad withdrawals, if you check out other forums about meds there are personal stories there about that. Then tried an anti-depressant, sent me into mania! Back to respiridone I went! Everything is good, now. Balanced and well. :)

Now, as for ER, was it prescribed? Was he taking it as prescribed? Zanax, in my experience, if taken as prescribed, wasn't a heavy drug. Maybe my dosage was small, I cannot recall.

But you are so right. It really can be a rollercoaster to get the right combo.
 
Paladine said:
What a great post! Thank you! I have taken zanax, years ago, found it did nothing for me and stopped within 3 months. I currently take a benzo, clonazapam and respiridone an antipsychotic. I have been on benzos for 3 years with no tolerance issues. Same dosage. Tried going off respiridone and had bad withdrawals, if you check out other forums about meds there are personal stories there about that. Then tried an anti-depressant, sent me into mania! Back to respiridone I went! Everything is good, now. Balanced and well. :)

Now, as for ER, was it prescribed? Was he taking it as prescribed? Zanax, in my experience, if taken as prescribed, wasn't a heavy drug. Maybe my dosage was small, I cannot recall.

But you are so right. It really can be a rollercoaster to get the right combo.
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Same - it is a mess. I take sedatives every night to sleep, and many doctors are hugely opposed to this, as are people I know. They assume it means addiction and must be unnecessary. Since infancy I have experienced insomnia virtually every night of my life regardless of my lifestyle, and people still tell me things like "drink warm milk" and "exercise more." And the antidepressant stuff - one after another prescribed because those are the meds I "should" be on - none has worked. One made me so tired I lay on the couch 24/7 but still could not sleep! For me, sleep is not generally connected to tiredness - it's like my brain can't figure out how to connect to sleep, no matter how tired it is. I will be totally exhausted, but I just keep thinking. I haven't had to increase my dose much and have had amazing results, but I constantly feel guilty because people judge taking controlled meds, and I have to worry that some day they will be taken away suddenly and I will withdraw, although I haven't yet had any issues with that. People rant about how easy it is to fix things with meds, or how dangerous meds are. It's different for everyone. My alternative can be to stay up for days until I snap and end up basically hallucinating, but no one believes I "need" the medication until I've gone totally nuts, which thankfully I've been able to stop ahead of time. It's a terrible quandry. Until someone has deteriorated significantly, no one believes they "need" heavy meds, and then you have the people who think antidepressants make everyone go insane and no one should take any meds, which is ridiculous. It really is not as easy as people think to stabilize. It's a guessing game.
 
I've had experience with withdrawal from antidepressants too as have others I know--for me it was Paxil--ugh, trying to get off of that made me feel so sick. I just tapered off really slowly. But I have sense learned that this is not the same kind of addiction withdrawal that doctors mean when they say a med is addictive-- I don't really understand the difference but apparently there is one. So, even though you can feel sick trying to get off an antidepressant, that doesn't mean that an SSRI is addictive in the true medical sense. Maybe Cariis can explain this?
 
song22 said:
I've had experience with withdrawal from antidepressants too as have others I know--for me it was Paxil--ugh, trying to get off of that made me feel so sick. I just tapered off really slowly. But I have sense learned that this is not the same kind of addiction withdrawal that doctors mean when they say a med is addictive-- I don't really understand the difference but apparently there is one. So, even though you can feel sick trying to get off an antidepressant, that doesn't mean that an SSRI is addictive in the true medical sense. Maybe Cariis can explain this?
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Wow - I cannot believe how quiet this thread has gotten. IS there another ER thread I don't know about - and this is the decoy thread to keep me isolated? (smile)
 
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