CA - Hannah,16,Devonte,15,&Ciera Hart,12 (fnd deceased),Mendocino Cty,26 Mar 2018 #6

Discussion in '2010's Missing' started by cybervampira, Mar 28, 2018.

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  1. Poppyflower

    Poppyflower Well-Known Member

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    As someone who has attended *many* dead, phish, rainbow gatherings, drum circles, festivals, other shows...I am one of those people who rarely did drugs, I didn´t smoke pot or drink. I was there for the music and my people. There were many like me. It isn´t a requirement. I´ve gone with friends to hard rock shows and have witnessed more ¨scary drunks¨ than at hippy shows. This is just my experience but I traveled around the country for years, sold my wares and was immersed in my sub-culture. I hope posting about my experiences will help others to see that no matter what type of festival or all day show you go to- there are good and bad people there. Hard rock, metal, punk, rock, hippy, etc. It is just like any other group of people. Personally, I find alcohol to be way more scary.
     


  2. Starkville

    Starkville Well-Known Member

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    Just wondering about Jen’s demeanor in the last days/hours.

    It’s said that sometimes a depressed and suicidal person will be happy shortly before they end their life. It’s because they have made peace with their decision to die, and their suffering is ending soon. They feel a paradoxical happiness.

    I feel like knowing her demeanor would be a clue as to whether she had planned her cliff dive well before, or if it were more a “reaction”. I’m not articulating this well, and I hope I’m not offending anyone.
     
  3. Auntie Cipation

    Auntie Cipation Context Matters.

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    I believe the annual Rainbow Gathering is always over the 4th of July. If there are smaller local gatherings in addition, I'm not aware of that.
     
  4. bears10

    bears10 Well-Known Member

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    My only issue with the kids being safe and sound with off the grid friends, is why would JH and SH spare the lives of the two kids who have tried to run away/reach out to neighbors for help?
     
  5. Silver~Bell

    Silver~Bell Well-Known Member

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    No, 88 ft/sec is at speed.

    I forgot the adoption money!

    Sent from my QTAQZ3 using Tapatalk
     
  6. MrsEmmaPeel

    MrsEmmaPeel Well-Known Member

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    I can understand that. If the two refused to go. If there was a stand off. They couldn't force them to join the family. However, I find it harder to understand Devonte standing up to them, given his role in the family. If the two ran off in fear for their lives and they're not with safe people in Mendocino, then how would they know it was safe to come out? Who would they approach? Big fear is a powerful motivator.
     
  7. dixiegirl1035

    dixiegirl1035 I will do it, but I won't like it

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    I thought I remembered that they could not identify the body because they could not find any dental records from any dentist? How can you have a retainer if you have not been to the dentist?
     
  8. Silver~Bell

    Silver~Bell Well-Known Member

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    Could they have taken the opportunity when Sarah was at work AND Jen was gone (remember Jen drove up right after CPS left, and later Sarah "tore" into the driveway) to have left??? And so they loaded up the others and took off without Hannah and Devonte???

    Sent from my QTAQZ3 using Tapatalk
     
  9. LeighB

    LeighB Member

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    This is interesting to me, since I just read a study published in the New York Times that showed that, when raised in wealthy households, black boys will stay wealthy far less often than white boys, even though black girls will stay wealthy just as often as white girls.

    https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2018/03/19/upshot/race-class-white-and-black-men.html

    "Other studies show that boys, across races, are more sensitive than girls to disadvantages like growing up in poverty or facing discrimination. While black women also face negative effects of racism, black men often experience racial discrimination differently. As early as preschool, they are more likely to be disciplined in school. They are pulled over or detained and searched by police officers more often.

    “It’s not just being black but being male that has been hyper-stereotyped in this negative way, in which we’ve made black men scary, intimidating, with a propensity toward violence,” said Noelle Hurd, a psychology professor at the University of Virginia."
     
  10. HeidiTX232

    HeidiTX232 Member

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    Generally, I would have thought they wouldn’t have left without all the kids. But I could see something like this. If they didn’t find them in a few hours, they may have felt they wouldn’t. And as if whatever made them leave so suddenly wasn’t enough, now they have two who could already be at the police station. Or maybe they thought they’d die out there and there is no way to explain losing two kids (and who would believe them once the other stuff came to surface?).

    But I do think the kids would have surfaced by now. And even off-the-grid people would have tried to contact the Harts or LE well before now. Who just keeps two kids?
     
  11. LeighB

    LeighB Member

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    I have no idea what happened, naturally, but just thought I'd throw out there that it's quite possible to travel with gas cans and not have them fill the car with noxious fumes. I've done it.

    Again throwing personal experience into the mix of speculation: I have 6 children, and have had a house that cost the same as theirs is listed at (mid-300k), and if I had had 1900/mo in supplemental income, could easily have paid most of the mortgage with that and (combined with the SNAP/EBT they almost certainly qualified for) taken care of the rest of household expenses with a salary from retail.

    Whether they did, I have no idea.
     
  12. Silver~Bell

    Silver~Bell Well-Known Member

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    You can buy retainers, partials, even dentures online!

    Sent from my QTAQZ3 using Tapatalk
     
  13. MrsEmmaPeel

    MrsEmmaPeel Well-Known Member

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    From my experience doing tons and tons of genealogy, a funeral home may issue a statement made of facts from the internet or Ancestry.com if no other obituary is offered. They also might do this if they had performed a cremation, unless family had requested no information be posted. I've encountered that in my own family when someone was cremated after a crime. It's just part of the online practice of funeral homes. It's possible that the funeral home did this as usual with no grasp of how much scrutiny there is on the family.
     
  14. MrsEmmaPeel

    MrsEmmaPeel Well-Known Member

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    If anyone does, it's people off the grid in the Emerald Triangle. It is a different world as others here have attested.
     
  15. HeidiTX232

    HeidiTX232 Member

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    Generally, it is easier to foster or adopt another child once you’ve “successfully” done so. For example, if I called my agency today and said we wanted another child, I’d likely get one really quickly even though we already have a handful of kids, some with “issues.” We have proved our ability to handle children with histories so would be more desirable.

    Sometimes this is a huge issue. Caseworkers will go against what they believe is best for a child/set because of it. For example, we were chosen for a child who it was determined would be best with no other children. But we had kids! But they needed someone very experienced who could deal with certain behaviors most people wouldn’t dream of considering. But we had kids (and not just one or two!). Additionally, the fact that we HAD such experience (ongoing) may should not have been in our favor either. Having one or two kids with extreme needs may mean that an additional child should NOT have those particular needs though willingness and experience would be helpful.

    (Eta: we did not accept placement of the above child. She has not yet gotten a home, unfortunately.)

    I’m not sure how the Harts got the second set after a criminal child abuse conviction (and most people who abuse kids don’t have criminal convictions even if they end up losing their children over it). But I’m positive that having experience as adoptive parents to kids with histories helped. They were considered “successful.”
     
  16. rosemadderlake

    rosemadderlake Well-Known Member

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    Because these two would book it, run for help at any point along the way, uncontrollable, two minds as one Devonte and Hannah are even more unpredictable? I'm still wondering about Naselle Wa. Something happened between CPS and that 3am text. Also, J&S were well connected to their community for decades. There is more than one tablet or phone that is in the ocean...

    Thoughts run from bury the bodies elsewhere, kids took off from their home, to drop two kids under pretense of Sarah needs to go to the doctor, we'll be back... And then radio silence.

    As they drove to think, make a plan, Jen might not have had it in her to kill Devonte if she was really connected to him? Maybe he and Hannah were really close, too. Devonte was freaking out trying to protect her?

    Just some thoughts...
     
  17. HeidiTX232

    HeidiTX232 Member

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    Grrrr

    Every state offers a subsidy for children considered special needs. Some states offer a subsidy for all kids adopted through the state. Subsidy may include a monetary amount monthly, medical, college, case management services, extra help for therapy/camp/etc.

    It is complex, but people aren’t getting rich adopting kids. Sure, rarely, someone doesn’t provide for the children so it isn’t costing tthem. But it’s rare. Most of us are using every dime plus some to provide every opportunity for our children.
     
  18. Breezie

    Breezie Well-Known Member

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    https://people.com/crime/utah-parents-murder-suicide-mom-thought-terminal-cancer/

    What happened with the Hart’s seemed like such a rare event, yet today there is a sad article about a mom who thought she had cancer and did not want to be separated from her family so she convinced her husband to go along with her plan.

    Jen went downhill after the move to Woodland. This family had just made an even bigger move from Europe to the US when the mom started researching cancer. There are a few other similarities as well.
     
  19. HeidiTX232

    HeidiTX232 Member

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    I am positive they didn’t qualify for welfare benefits. At $53k, they would barely qualify for Earned Income Credit so even there wouldn’t have gotten food stamps. Then add the adoption subsidy. Definitely wouldn’t qualify.

    (Adoption subsidy is not taxed but is considered in regards to welfare benefits, buying houses, etc).
     
  20. Breamworthy

    Breamworthy Active Member

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    I think this is possible if the decision to end everything hadn't been made yet.

    They might need to get rid of the two kids who were drawing attention and who were less likely to cooperate with a cover up in CPS interviews. if they hadn't yet reached a full state of panic or mental break, the first thought would not be to murder these children, but to stash them somewhere. After doing this, perhaps the other children became less compliant, or reality set in in some other way on the drive home and they realIzed there was no way to make the plan work.
     
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