Deceased/Not Found CA - Sierra LaMar, 15, Morgan Hill, 16 March 2012 #19 *A. Garcia-Torres guilty*

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cluciano63

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I don't think we know for sure that dogs did not hit inside his car, or about any other evidence that LE may have found. The only thing they said they did not find was Sierra's blood...however for instance if her DNA was found in his trunk, that would be more circumstantial evidence. They may have lots of bits and pieces; when they spoke about her not using social media, I felt that this was the only part they were willing to share at that point.
 

Annie1004

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JMO and MOO ... I stated that they did not have "strong evidence" -- even though they claim to ...

There is NO evidence of a "crime scene" and NO evdience of "blood" and NO evidence of an HRD "hit" and NO "body" ...

Now, IF they had evidence of a "crime scene", "blood evidence", and even an HRD "hit", I would not be as "skeptical" as to the evidence ...

But DNA evidence alone is NOT enough IMO as DNA evidence IS "circumstantial evidence" ...

In addition to that, labs do make mistakes ... see the info from my previous post :

From the Nothern California Innocence Project :

snippets from : http://law.scu.edu/ncip/File/NCIP_052207_Quadco.pdf

Since our last newsletter in September, the Northern California Innocence Project at Santa Clara Law has helped exonerate two more wrongly convicted people: Jeffrey Rodriguez and Kenneth Foley.

... [more details of case included in article]

When the district attorney’s office ordered the jeans retested, the results
proved there was no oil on Rodriguez’s pants, discrediting the testimony of the Santa Clara Crime Lab criminalist. Based on the new evidence, the Santa Clara County district attorney dismissed the charges, and Rodriguez was released on February 5.

This case was included in the 2006 San Jose Mercury News series Tainted
Trials, Stolen Justice, which highlighted wrongful convictions and other problems in the in Santa Clara County criminal justice system.



Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - CA **arrest**CA - Sierra Lamar, 15, Santa Clara County, 16 March 2012 #18

:moo:
I assure you, the DA has enough evidence for a murder conviction. I am letting them do their jobs because they know a heck of a lot more than we do.
 

Annie1004

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Sadly, many are locked up and convicted of crimes with little to no proof. It's not like it DOESN'T happen.
That seldom occurs; alternatively, there are a lot out there who received slaps on their wrists only to re-offend later.
 

TxLady2

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Yes, just a few months ago they were looking for a very popular DJ named Mike Grefner, who went missing in Whistler, B.C. Canada. The found him a month or so later in an area they had checked quite thoroughly. It's hard work.

I participated in one of the searches for Sierra, and I was a quite annoyed at how quickly everyone moved through the search area. "Hurry, we have alot of ground to cover today!" I kept saying we should slow down and only cover a small area if that's what it took to check it thoroughly. My concerns went unheeded. I can tell you that the areas my group searched that day had 10,000 places she could have been that we didn't have time to look in to. In particular, we were given permission to search a commercial farm. There were stacks and stacks and stacks and stacks and stacks of crates, and oil drums, and....well you get the message. As I searched I was petrified every time I looked in one of those drums and crates for what I might find...but I kept looking. But it was just me, and no one else on the search Team seemed to want to be as detailed as I was being. It was so very frustrating, and I felt so powerless.
I hope my search experience isn't representative of the larger search efforts. If it is, then I can certainly understand why she hasn't been found. SEARCH PARTIES...SLOW DOWN. BE THOROUGH.

Thank you for helping search!!

Sadly, many times bodies are found in areas that have already been searched, because of the things you mentioned above. Even when receiving a quick training session, most people just don't know how to do a thorough search, or what to look for. They could literally walk right over someone's remains and not know it. Sometimes a rancher out inspecting his property, or a hunter will stumble upon the remains.

I hope they offer him a sweet deal to tell them what he did with her, and then once she's found, tell him...."oops... we lied." To someone as young as he is, even life in prison has to be a pretty bleak prospect.
 

stillwatersc

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JMO and MOO ... I stated that they did not have "strong evidence" -- even though they claim to ...

There is NO evidence of a "crime scene" and NO evdience of "blood" and NO evidence of an HRD "hit" and NO "body" ...

Now, IF they had evidence of a "crime scene", "blood evidence", and even an HRD "hit", I would not be as "skeptical" as to the evidence ...

Until the trial, we have no idea if they have this evidence.
 

cocomod

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Remember a darling little girl that was found in the woods? Even though the jury did not convict even though there was a body, most of the public are convinved who "did it". I think that circumstantial evidence can really tell the tale - even if it is just a "behind the scenes look" at the perps actions and locations. DNA of SL in HIS car and HIS DNA on her belongings are a strong indicator to me that they have their man. JMHO
 

cocomod

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Until the trial, we have no idea if they have this evidence.

I completely agree!! Sometimes I have been completely shocked at the slam dunk cases with tons of evidence that was not know prior to a trial.
 

dog.gone.cute

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Circumstantial evidence is often stronger than direct evidence. I was at the Santa Clara County Crime Lab last year, and it is state-of-the-art now!


:seeya: Thanks for this update on the crime lab ... I am glad to hear there has been improvements !
 

dog.gone.cute

Kyron Horman - Missing Since 6-4-10
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:moo:
r u trying to defend Antolin? I don't understand your intentions


:seeya: I am not "defending" him ... who knows, he may have done it, but then again, he may not have done it ...

:twocents: I have followed this case from the beginning and something is not "adding up" IMO ...
 

oceanblueeyes

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:moo:


:seeya: I am not "defending" him ... who knows, he may have done it, but then again, he may not have done it ...

:twocents: I have followed this case from the beginning and something is not "adding up" IMO ...

May I ask what is not adding up for you, d.g.c.?

imo
 

kemo

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In California, the DA must provide the defense with all evidence it has against the defendant. There can be no "surprises" at the trial. Since everyone following the case in the papers or TV is a potential juror, the DA wants the general public to assume, going into the trial that they "got their man". While the Sheriff or the DA may not lay out the case exactly as they will present it at trial, it is safe to assume that the public will pretty well now what evidence they have.

The big advantage the prosecution has going into trial is that jurors don't usually give "the benefit of the doubt" to someone accused of a horrific crime against a child even though the judge’s instructions will be to do just that. There have been some high profile cases when defendants were convicted with completely inadequate evidence. (Think about the West Memphis Three).
 

Tuba

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We can bear in mind, while we're waiting for a July plea, that Det. Sgt. Troy Hoefling transferred his 2009 assault material to the district attorney & in so doing projected that an assault charge against A.G.-T. may be prosecuted first.
http://abclocal.go.com/wabc/story?section=news/local/south_bay&id=8683421
Morgan Hill police have parking lot surveillance video as items in the assault cases.

Sheriff Laurie Smith told us the department has both direct and circumstantial evidence going forward in the LaMar case. Some of the direct evidence is video, some skin fragments such as might be found under nails or in folds of cloth. She has also referred to Laguna & Sta. Teresa shed as a crime scene. There is, of course, evidence we can't even guess at. By alluding to the direct evidence, in no way am I diminishing the amount or value of circumstantial evidence in the sheriffs' possession and custody.
 

GrainneDhu

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That seldom occurs; alternatively, there are a lot out there who received slaps on their wrists only to re-offend later.

Depending on the study you look at, there are between 45,000 and 100,000 wrongfully convicted people in prison right now.
 

sherbetjello

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That seldom occurs; alternatively, there are a lot out there who received slaps on their wrists only to re-offend later.

I don't want to get o/t, but seldom is too many. My point was that it's not like we have a perfect justice system (Casey Anthony). I am just saying, there is not a lot of proof, at least what the public has been told, to hang this dude just yet.

And then, there are the stories of people going down from crimes, dying for them, to then be proven innocent a day late.

Not a personal attack -- just the reality of what how I see things.

It's totally okay to agree to disagree here.


r u trying to defend Antolin? I don't understand your intentions


Now, that sounded like an attack. I never stated I defended him, did I? Don't believe I did, because where I stand, there is not enough information for me to see, think logically, then process to convict him - without a reasonable doubt. This dude is getting hung in public, and it's a spectacle that deep down isn't too enjoyable to watch as an American, hope you can understand that. We ALL have the right to a FAIR trial. You can have your opinion of him being guilty, but do not mistake my words as defending him -- they apply to all people on, or going, to trial.

[Please see above statement as how it can be flawed in more ways than one. - my original statement.]
 

Amster

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I don't want to get o/t, but seldom is too many. My point was that it's not like we have a perfect justice system (Casey Anthony). I am just saying, there is not a lot of proof, at least what the public has been told, to hang this dude just yet.

And then, there are the stories of people going down from crimes, dying for them, to then be proven innocent a day late.

Not a personal attack -- just the reality of what how I see things.

It's totally okay to agree to disagree here.





Now, that sounded like an attack. I never stated I defended him, did I? Don't believe I did, because where I stand, there is not enough information for me to see, think logically, then process to convict him - without a reasonable doubt. This dude is getting hung in public, and it's a spectacle that deep down isn't too enjoyable to watch as an American, hope you can understand that. We ALL have the right to a FAIR trial. You can have your opinion of him being guilty, but do not mistake my words as defending him -- they apply to all people on, or going, to trial.

[Please see above statement as how it can be flawed in more ways than one. - my original statement.]

I don't believe the post you are referring to about "defending him" was a post to you......

And, are you claiming that there are people who have been executed who were later proved innocent? If so, link please.
 

rosesfromangels

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I don't want to get o/t, but seldom is too many. My point was that it's not like we have a perfect justice system (Casey Anthony). I am just saying, there is not a lot of proof, at least what the public has been told, to hang this dude just yet.

And then, there are the stories of people going down from crimes, dying for them, to then be proven innocent a day late.

Not a personal attack -- just the reality of what how I see things.

It's totally okay to agree to disagree here.





Now, that sounded like an attack. I never stated I defended him, did I? Don't believe I did, because where I stand, there is not enough information for me to see, think logically, then process to convict him - without a reasonable doubt. This dude is getting hung in public, and it's a spectacle that deep down isn't too enjoyable to watch as an American, hope you can understand that. We ALL have the right to a FAIR trial. You can have your opinion of him being guilty, but do not mistake my words as defending him -- they apply to all people on, or going, to trial.

[Please see above statement as how it can be flawed in more ways than one. - my original statement.]

The Santa Clara District Attorney would not have arrested the Accused unless they had a mountain of evidence against him. Most especially without a body. The DA's office in Santa Clara is extremely sophisticated; you will see this in action during the trial.
 

ozazure

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So the next court date, he enters a plea ... what happens then? What is the next step?

What is happening between the prosecutors and defence now, is the defence being given information which helps them advise how he should plead? Could they be doing a deal with him now, like request no death penalty etc if he pleads guilty or recommend another kind of sentence?
 

dog.gone.cute

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May I ask what is not adding up for you, d.g.c.?

imo


:seeya: Good Morning,

Several things just do not add up for me ... the statements and facts that were released in the beginning IMO do not match up with the "surprise" arrest of Antolin ... JMO and MOO !

In order to post my thoughts with appropriate links for back-up, I am in the process of re-reading the info in the Timeline, the links, etc ... So when I finish, I will post my :twocents: -- fwiw -- LOL !

Again, I am not defending this dude ... he may have did it and if so, should be held responsible with the max punishment ...

JMO and MOO
 

Niner

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respectfully snipped
Here is an update on the "Sketch" that everyone thought was Antolin :waitasec:

snipped from : http://www.gilroydispatch.com/news/...cle_86ffd0fc-b1a8-11e1-b326-0019bb30f31a.html

The Santa Clara County Sheriff’s Office is not investigating a possible link between a sketch of a man who tried to seduce a 10-year-old Gilroy girl in July 2011 and Sierra LaMar’s alleged kidnapper, but Gilroy Police already have.

According to GPD, an incident involving a Hispanic male who allegedly attempted to lure the girl into his car July 26, 2011 has drawn recent attention from the community, as some have said the drawing of the suspect released by police looks similar to Antolin Garcia Torres, the murder suspect tied to Sierra’s disappeance.

Okay - question - can they - GPD or even MHPD show this little girl, now 11 years old a group of pictures - one being Antolin - and see if she can pick him out of a line up?? I have read that children are better eye witnesses than adults - !!
 

Niner

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I assure you, the DA has enough evidence for a murder conviction. I am letting them do their jobs because they know a heck of a lot more than we do.

:thumb: Totally agree! It's not like California is like Florida with their Sunshine Laws. I wish it were - we would know a LOT more than we do now! I believe the prosecutors have their ducks in a row if they arrested him so quickly! :rocker:
 
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