CANADA Canada - Audrey Gleave, 73, Ancaster ON, 30 Dec 2010 #9

Discussion in 'Cold Cases' started by Salem, Jan 12, 2013.

  1. LambChop

    LambChop Former Member

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    It's all in threads #1, 2 and 3. Most of the information is from postings from y'all. Since semen was mentioned in many of the posts that would indicate it was not "touch" DNA LE was having tested but DNA specific to the crime. I have to rely on posts that have been posted at time because there is very little information anywhere else. If it all were posted at the time, I'm assuming it is correct.
     
  2. Paragirl

    Paragirl If we don't change direction soon, we'll end up wh

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    LC can you please link to some of those posts? This is the first I've heard any mention of semen and a search turned up nothing but a few generalized speculative discussions about what IF there was semen. I'm definitely interested to know if there was semen collected!!!

    Hamilton Police Supt. Bill Stewart said the forensic evidence didn’t come back with the “conclusive results we were hoping for.” He wouldn’t comment when asked if that means there wasn’t any DNA linking the suspect to the scene. “I can’t go there, what that evidence was, because it’s part of the case and it’s still an open case,” Stewart said. Scott’s lawyer, Charles Spettigue, said police had no DNA. “We’re been poring through mountains of disclosure ... and the police have been flailing about trying to find some evidence to theoretically carry on with this,” he said. “The simple reality is they never had any evidence. They have no DNA, they have no-nothing.”

    http://www.torontosun.com/2011/06/03/charge-dropped-in-killing-of-exteacher
     
  3. LambChop

    LambChop Former Member

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    See quote above

    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...r-viciously-murdered-in-home-Ancaster-Ontario

    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...viciously-murdered-in-home-Ancaster-Ontario-2

    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...viciously-murdered-in-home-Ancaster-Ontario-3

    A post by No Stone Unburned in Thread 2, #821 discusses semen so I think there was some discussions going on at the time that this was what was being tested. Some of the posts back in 2011 are very interesting. I just don't have time to read them all but I will keep checking back.

    Anyone know if CLS' attorney ever filed that lawsuit?
     
  4. Paragirl

    Paragirl If we don't change direction soon, we'll end up wh

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    Spettigue: The returns on the initial DNA cleared David, they didn’t link him in any way shape or form.
    Reporter: Spettigue says if it was that horrific it would take a lot of physical effort to attack someone in that manner…
    Spettigue: …and it seems highly unlikely that anybody could do that without leaving DNA behind, or alternatively leaving the crime scene with some of the victim’s DNA.

    http://www.chch.com/gleaves-neighbours-wondering-what-now/

    BBM - does this mean there IS DNA? If so, it didn't match DLS. So why would LE go back and revisit other anonymous POIs after DLS was released, and the results of the "forensic testing" came back, if said evidence belonged to an "unknown suspect"?
     
  5. Paragirl

    Paragirl If we don't change direction soon, we'll end up wh

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  6. sillybilly

    sillybilly WS Administrator Staff Member Administrator Moderator

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    <rsbm>

    Yabut ... as there are so few people who were ever in Audrey's home, the handyman's DNA would have been all over the house so there is no way to include or exclude that person based on DNA alone. A polygraph would have been an extra investigative tool to use in that particular circumstance. IIRC, he also said that the 911 dispatcher asked him to feel for a pulse, and he did so and that would account for his DNA being found on Audrey's body when he found her in the garage.
     
  7. sillybilly

    sillybilly WS Administrator Staff Member Administrator Moderator

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    Catching up so sorry if answered. No mass collection that we've heard of, but I do recall that PK told us his DNA was collected (and shoes measured, car searched, etc).

    (I'd link, but I don't know why I can't find his posts using the search feature, but I'm having that problem a lot with the new format for some reason)
     
  8. sillybilly

    sillybilly WS Administrator Staff Member Administrator Moderator

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    I did a search for the word "semen" on each of the pages you linked to LambChop and didn't find it. Is it possible that you are thinking because some articles referred to it as a sexual attack that it would be a given that evidence found included semen? FWIW, LE said it was an exceptionally brutal attack with "a sexual component" (so not necessarily what we might think of as the typical rape / sexual assault):

    from:
    http://webcache.googleusercontent.c...hbours-are-anxious/+&cd=3&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ca

    It was also said that another weapon had been used, so we are left to wonder if that second weapon somehow relates to the "sexual component" (which again might indicate this was not a conventional assault which could leave semen at the scene):

    from:
    http://webcache.googleusercontent.c...o-is-audrey-gleave/+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ca

     
  9. sillybilly

    sillybilly WS Administrator Staff Member Administrator Moderator

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    BUT that's not a direct quote attributable to Spettigue. The confusion lies in Spettigue's original quote:

    from:
    http://webcache.googleusercontent.c...illing-of-exteacher+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ca

    Throughout the various threads, posters kept referring to LE saying Scott's DNA was not a match, when we constantly had to correct that by re-stating that LE said the "forensic evidence" didn't match.

    So we now have Spettigue saying "The returns on the initial DNA cleared David" when he previously said "They have no DNA ...". Thus our conundrum is, have the reporter(s) and Spettigue also mis-spoken by referring to DNA rather than "forensic evidence"?
     
  10. FromGermany

    FromGermany Well-Known Member

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    IF the murder has been a personal act to Audrey (to take revenge, to steal only from her etc.), then maybe the perp/s will never be criminal in the future and so he/they will never be caught - what a success for the perp/s.
     
  11. FromGermany

    FromGermany Well-Known Member

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    I don't know Audrey and her sense of humour. I would have less suspected, that she could laugh at herself. :smile:

    PK, LV and even the divorced ex-husband have told something odd and sort of tactless about Audrey after her death. Why just these people? I don't understand ....
     
  12. No_Stone_Unturned

    No_Stone_Unturned New Member

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    As dotr said, I also want to know where the mess was after Audrey's murder. The person who found the body said it wasn't too bad (paraphrasing) while a seasoned detective said it was the worst crime scene in his many years on the job (paraphrasing).

    I suggested this earlier - was Audrey killed elsewhere and then her body was placed in the garage complete with coat and shoes? But that would presume the killer drove her body back in her own Camaro and also knew how to close the garage doors. Or, the killer used his own vehicle to transport the dead body back to the garage. But again - how did the killer manage to close the garage door?

    There must be a good reason why LE hauled away the Camaro. And we haven't heard about that car since!

    :dunno:
     
  13. Pink Panther

    Pink Panther Active Member

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    I'm having this problem as well. In fact, if I search "Audrey Gleave" through websleuths it tells me there is no file for it. If I search through google, I invariably get thread #7 or lower. It's very frustrating to not be able to find this link (#9)!
     
  14. Paragirl

    Paragirl If we don't change direction soon, we'll end up wh

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    Yet, at the same time, PK also stated that the 'sexual component' was 'obvious'.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  15. dotr

    dotr Well-Known Member

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  16. No_Stone_Unturned

    No_Stone_Unturned New Member

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    From dotr's post above:

    Reminder about Audrey's bench and routine..

    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...07#post6999607


    Thanks! So that sort of dismisses a stranger entering the garage to take Audrey away to murder her.

    I'm convinced Audrey was murdered inside her house and she was murdered by someone she knew/allowed to enter her home.
     
  17. colette

    colette Well-Known Member

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    I thought LE talked about the sexual component not PK. I thought PK thought Audrey was deceased but didn't see anything gross or unusual when he found her. He may have seen that she was deceased due to skin discoloring and immediately looked away and left to call LE.
     
  18. bessie

    bessie Administrator Staff Member Administrator Moderator

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    Still no named suspect.

    Who killed Audrey Gleave?
    Aug 22, 2015
    By Jon Wells - Hamilton Spectator

    [...]
    Audrey Gleave lived alone in the house for 37 years. The retired high school teacher had two German Shepherds she always kept at her side. The dogs were inside the house and unable to save her when she was murdered in cold loublood in the garage, just over a month short of her 74th birthday.

    Her ashes were buried four summers ago.

    [...]
    Gleave's murder is not considered a cold case, Abrams says, because it is an active investigation.
    Detectives keep tabs on "people of interest" and explore tips. But the case shares resources with others, and there are days it gets pushed to the backburner.

    [...]
    In the early hours of the investigation, police hypothesized her murder had been random, by a stranger, and residents in Lynden should therefore be vigilant.

    But Det. Angela Abrams says Gleave was targeted &#8212; which stands to reason, given the relative isolation of where she lived and how careful she was about letting anyone close to her. She was a creature of habit: the times when she checked her computer, the hours she slept, coming and going from the house with her dogs. "It was not random," says Abrams. "She would have known who it was."

    [...]
    Police had said Gleave was sexually assaulted &#8212; a detective told reporters there was a "sexual component" to the crime. Emergency response workers first on the scene believed that was true. Phil Kinsman said Gleave's stretchy pants were torn when he found her.

    But Abrams says there is no hard evidence Gleave was sexually assaulted. How could interpretations be so different?
    One reason is that the killer may have staged the crime scene. At least one Hamilton detective who worked the case in the past believed the killer tried to lead them down the wrong path.

    (much more at the link)
     
  19. colette

    colette Well-Known Member

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    Good article Bessie. It is so sad that Audrey's murder has not been solved. Too bad the killer didn't leave some DNA at the scene. It seems like there might have been some touch DNA in the ripped stretch pants, he must have been wearing gloves.
     
  20. sillybilly

    sillybilly WS Administrator Staff Member Administrator Moderator

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    We're still here Audrey !!
     

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