CANADA Canada - Marianne Schuett, 10, Kilbride, Ont, 27 April 1967

Discussion in '1960's Missing' started by Richard, May 7, 2007.

  1. dotr

    dotr Well-Known Member

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    Lovely sentiment Bobbi Pearl, thank you.
     
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  2. Bobbi Pearl

    Bobbi Pearl Well-Known Member

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    You are very good at noticing that detail.

    here is another report and it states no bones found:

    "By the end of the weekend, three areas at the site were verified to contain the smell of human decomposition by the cadaver dogs, and 20 to 30 soil samples were taken for testing. No bone fragments were found."

    BEHIND THE CRIMES: Investigators conduct forensic dig in hunt for girl missing since 1967
     
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  3. The 'Wood

    The 'Wood Member

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    Yeah that is a bad article/writing. Professional news reports don't say "It was reported..", they NAME the source. The canoe article is better and looks more promising too!
     
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  4. The 'Wood

    The 'Wood Member

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    I see now I set aside a paper copy of the Star/Metroland article that Deugirtni posted a link to and others have posted links to. Sounds definitely like there are human remains there. Hopefully the soil samples turn up something useful.
     
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  5. dotr

    dotr Well-Known Member

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    BEHIND THE CRIMES: Investigators conduct forensic dig in hunt for girl missing since 1967
    [​IMG]

    BEHIND THE CRIMES: Investigators conduct forensic dig in hunt for girl missing since 1967
    'Somebody’s family member is coming back to them — we just don’t know whose yet'
    Melanie Hennessey
    InsideHalton.com
    September 16, 2021 rbbm.
    ''Ella carefully sniffed a pile of soil, working hard to detect any scent of human decomposition. The highly trained cadaver dog is part of a larger team that was on the ground earlier this month in rural Acton, searching for traces of Marianne Schuett, a 10-year-old Kilbride girl who was abducted on her way home from school in 1967.''

    ''It didn’t take Ella long to find what she was looking for. She sat down beside the soil and barked excitedly — her method of indicating that she discovered the human scent she’s trained to pick up. The forensic dig team clapped and cheered.''

    “That’s what we were hoping was going to happen. The dog has picked up the scent of human decomposition,” said Linda Gillis Davidson, a former RCMP inspector who headed up the search with retired Peel police forensics investigator Gord Collins.

    "Through the soil samples, we will be able to find DNA. Somebody’s family member is coming back to them — we just don’t know whose yet. We’re hoping it’s Marianne because the evidence brought us here."

    By the end of the weekend, three areas at the site were verified to contain the smell of human decomposition by the cadaver dogs, and 20 to 30 soil samples were taken for testing. No bone fragments were found.''
    Results from the lab are expected in three to six weeks. If the DNA found doesn't point to Marianne, Gillis Davidson said she and Collins will look to other missing person cases in the area to hopefully find a match''
    [​IMG]

    Forensic anthropologists and volunteers search a wooded area in Halton Hills for any trace of Marianne Schuett, who disappeared in 1967. The Sept. 11 effort was led by two retired police investigators. - Graham Paine/Metroland

    ''Results from the lab are expected in three to six weeks. If the DNA found doesn't point to Marianne, Gillis Davidson said she and Collins will look to other missing person cases in the area to hopefully find a match.''
     
  6. After 54 years, would they expect to find bone fragments or is it normal that those were not found?
     
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  7. Doeologist

    Doeologist Well-Known Member

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    I read that bones can disappear in 20 years with shallow burial in acidic soil. I believe the soil on the Bruce Trail is acidic although there’s lime there which would neutralize the acid.

    Skeletonization Wikipedia
     
  8. musicaljoke

    musicaljoke Well-Known Member

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  9. Does anyone know, what is the dog smelling? After 54 years, if the hardest parts are no longer there, is anything at all still there? Would rain, snow, etc. have washed everything away? It’s truly amazing if after all these years, there is still something viable left for the dog to sniff and for labs to test for DNA.
     
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  10. Doeologist

    Doeologist Well-Known Member

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    I remember studying about cadaver dogs and watching the search for more Manson bodies. Rain and water will just move the latent residue or "cadaverine" downhill from where the body decomposed.
     
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  11. Doeologist

    Doeologist Well-Known Member

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    Shale and sandstone is usually acidic, according to this link, but it could go either way.

    P.S. I was contacted by someone connected to Steel Workers. Let me make a correction about the main suspect's occupation. He was a machinist and not a steel worker. (I happen to have been in a machinist union.)
     
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  12. Has there been an update anywhere about what was found?
     
  13. Richard

    Richard Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]
    Marianne Schuett, age 10
    Missing since 27 April 1967
     
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  14. Bobbi Pearl

    Bobbi Pearl Well-Known Member

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    dotr kindly provided us with this Media report and link on September 16th:

    BEHIND THE CRIMES: Investigators conduct forensic dig in hunt for girl missing since 1967

    ''Results from the lab are expected in three to six weeks. If the DNA found doesn't point to Marianne, Gillis Davidson said she and Collins will look to other missing person cases in the area to hopefully find a match.''

    If the results estimate is accurate we are in the "7th" week so truly hope we hear some news soon.
     
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  15. Bobbi Pearl

    Bobbi Pearl Well-Known Member

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    We are well past the estimated timeline, I truly hope that the labs processing DNA are not this backed up and it is not completed testing yet.

    Questions come to mind:

    If the tests are complete, and they have her DNA:
    • will the retired detectives release any information on this subject?
    • will this information be handed off to active police detectives and we will not know anything until they release any specifics?
    • then will this be enough information to release the bastard's name who killed her! Or do they need to further investigate?
    • do they have the suspected killer who committed suicide's DNA or family DNA?
    • did they find any other DNA with hers?
    If the tests are complete, and they have someone else's DNA not Marianne's:
    • will the retired detectives release any information on this subject?
    • will this information be handed off to active police detectives and we will not know anything until they release any specifics?
    How long did the process take on the Christine Jessop case?
    it took a long time and work, these are the steps they took in her case:

    “We had one match (a family name) from the maternal side, one from the paternal side.”

    Figuring out the rest involved plenty of leg work, including three police genealogists scouring open-source data such as old newspapers and death reports, to build a family tree.

    “We started with about 33,000 people in the (family) tree, (the genealogists) whittled it down to about 5,000 people,” Smith added.

    Then investigators were given access to another “DNA clearinghouse,” named GEDmatch, which includes samples from websites including 23andMe and Ancestry.com.

    This narrowed the field of matches from 5,000 to 100, including second and third cousins, Smith said.

    (Source: 'Fortuitous': Probe into Christine Jessop's killer Calvin Hoover went wrong until it went right)
     
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  16. dotr

    dotr Well-Known Member

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    rbbm.
    https://archive.macleans.ca/article/1968/1/1/a-little-girl-is-missing
    January 1 1968 EARL McRAE
    ''Ten minutes after she left the school, two homeward-bound workers from the nearby American Motors plant were driving west on Kilbride Road, near Marianne’s house. Slowing down at the Panton Street intersection near the school, they noticed a small, wellpolished, dark-blue station wagon parked on the shoulder of Kilbride Road. There was a middle-aged man at the wheel, and he was talking out his window to a small girl in a red car coat.''

    ''As their car passed, Bodz continued to watch through the rear-view mirror. When he was several yards past, he saw the girl walk around behind the stranger’s car — it was later identified as a Renault station wagon—and open the door on the passenger side''

    ''The only tangible clue was the discovery, the day after the girl’s disappearance, of one of Marianne’s running shoes, with its lace missing, on a roadside 12 miles northeast of Kilbride.''

    ''At the urging of a newspaper reporter, Mr. and Mrs. Schuett got in touch with Gerard Croiset, a Dutch clairvoyant with an impressive record of finding missing children. They mailed him roadmaps of the area, and Croiset sent them back with several areas circled. But when searchers combed the spots Croiset had marked on the map, they found no trace of the missing girl.''

    ''Bodz describes the man as being in his late 40s or early 50s. He was clean-shaven and fair-complexioned. Bodz is certain he recalls the man wearing glasses with light rims, and is sure he was wearing a light-colored canvas hat with a dark band.''

    ''Late last year, when this story was being prepared, the Schuetts asked
    Maclean’s to print an appeal to Marianne’s abductor, wherever he is: “We beg you with all our heart to phone or write us a few words to tell us where she is. We promise on everything we hold dear we will not show the police your letter or tell them of your call. If Marianne is alive, let her go, and tell us where we can find her. If she is dead, let us know where we can find her. We will never identify you no matter what has happened. It is too terrible not knowing. Please phone us or write to us. Her brothers can’t go on not knowing where she is and our hearts are breaking. We have to know. Please be merciful and let our prayers be answered.”
     
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  17. Doeologist

    Doeologist Well-Known Member

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    I was updated by email, as a “standby” volunteer. The results from a University lab aren’t in yet. They are waiting on pins and needles like everyone else.

    The email confirmed that the acidity of the soil, time and Marianne’s youthful age, is probably what prevented any solid remains like bones from being found. They are now going to look at a third site and believe that any DNA from the first two sites are likely two different people because of the distance between them.
     
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  18. Richard

    Richard Well-Known Member

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    Regardless of the type of soil a body is buried in, and what form the remains have taken, if the site is undisturbed, the grave can be detected. This can be done in a number of different ways.

    Even after two hundred years or more, there is still a "magnetic" anomaly present where the body was buried. Not magnetic in the sense of the properties of ferris metal, but a clear difference in the surrounding area.
     
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  19. Bobbi Pearl

    Bobbi Pearl Well-Known Member

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    Thank you for sharing.

    A 3rd site? where did this surface from, new information? who do they think the 3rd site could hold remains of?

    Your sentence reads that DNA from 1st 2 sites - Does that mean they have returned and taken samples from the 2nd site already? did they find soil only again or any bone fragments with the 2nd site? It was mentioned they thought the site beside the one thought to be MS could be Cameron March.

    Looking forward to when you have updates for us again Doeologist!

    Thanks again for the intel.
     
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2021
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  20. Doeologist

    Doeologist Well-Known Member

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    Facebook posts that they went to get Marianne's relative's DNA samples at the end of September or the beginning of October. That's almost 3 weeks after the first dig on Sept 11/12. So it's not overly delayed yet. All they found was soil with presumably cadaverine, which hopefully contains workable DNA

    I think all the sites were from the original information -- the multiple sightings of the vehicle and the tip from an inmate. I'm assuming that's the inmate who said he was shown Marianne's body the year after the crime. That site, I know is about a mile and a half south of the quarry limit. I can't make sense of the information myself. Only they would know if the inmate knew the main suspect.
     
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