Canadian hostage, wife & children freed from Afghanistan, husband arrested for abuse, Oct 2017 #3

[mikkismom]

According to NYT, the have been released. I don't know how to link.

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Thread #1
Thread #2

 

[Lilibet]

According to NYT, the have been released. I don't know how to link.

Sent from my VS501 using Tapatalk

Great news!

Here are some links...

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/12/...d-family-held-for-5-years-in-afghanistan.html

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...amily-freed-terrorists-afghanistan/756967001/

http://www.wmur.com/article/hostages-freed-taliban-afghanistan/12835793

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2017/1...an-family-freed-from-afghanistan-captors.html

 

[nuff]

From the CBC News article on Doody's decision: "In handing down his early decisions, Doody said that while Boyle's controlling behaviour made Coleman angry, frustrated and upset, it did not make her fear for her safety."

On the charge of criminal harassment, if her flight from Boyle in the middle of a cold winter night, underdressed for the weather, was not direct evidence of fear, what on earth was it?

 

[bears10]

Boyle and Coleman were married during a lengthy trip to South America. A year later they travelled to Russia and surrounding areas.

At what point in the relationship was she brainwashed?

A timeline of events for Joshua Boyle, Caitlan Coleman and their family

According to the courts, Coleman was not a credible witness.

"Judge Peter Doody said he did not find Boyle credible or Coleman reliable, and so could not make a finding of guilt.

“This was really, in large part, a ‘he said, she said’ – there was very, very little confirmatory evidence,” Greenspon told Reuters. “And ultimately, (the judge) didn’t believe Caitlan and he had many doubts about Josh’s testimony.”​

Canada judge dismisses assault charges against former Taliban hostage - SRN News

I’m not going to even entertain this anymore. You early believe Joshua Boyle is a good guy and Caitlan is a villain. I’ve read about this case on multiple sites, and the only place where people support JB is on websleuths. Odd.

 

[nuff]

Ex-Taliban hostage cleared of all charges in sexual assault trial

The best synopsis of the case, the verdict and the issues I've found.

 

[Stunned]

I was responding to comments about hiding the children and avoiding responding to custody and visitation schedules.

The children have the right to spend time with their father, and it is in the best interests of children to know both parents.

The children were removed from Canada after the mother made accusations against the father. The father has been found not guilty on all 19 counts. That means that the reason for taking the children out of Canada no longer exists. In some sense, that puts both parents on equal footing regarding which of the questionable parents is best for the children.

I was responding to comments about hiding the children and avoiding responding to custody and visitation schedules.

The children have the right to spend time with their father, and it is in the best interests of children to know both parents.

The children were removed from Canada after the mother made accusations against the father. The father has been found not guilty on all 19 counts. That means that the reason for taking the children out of Canada no longer exists. In some sense, that puts both parents on equal footing regarding which of the questionable parents is best for the children.

I don’t really care what the courts decided. I think he is a very ill man. I would not let another child around. When I think what some people do to finally win the custody thing, I shudder.

 

[human]

How does custody work with two countries? Where would it be decided?

Does they each need a US and a Canadian attorney? I cannot even fathom the cost of something like that.

perhaps he does not even want the children. Unless he finds another woman, I cannot see that he would be interested in the attention and work children would need.

after all, he has a book to write

 

[Stunned]

How does custody work with two countries? Where would it be decided?

Does they each need a US and a Canadian attorney? I cannot even fathom the cost of something like that.

perhaps he does not even want the children. Unless he finds another woman, I cannot see that he would be interested in the attention and work children would need.

after all, he has a book to write

Oh he will want what he deems as his property!

 

[Medstudies]

I don’t really care what the courts decided. I think he is a very ill man. I would not let another child around. When I think what some people do to finally win the custody thing, I shudder.

And when I consider she was forced to undergo at least one abortion and having another baby girl murdered while in custody ... because apparently he couldn’t keep it in his pants... exactly what you said later. “Property”.

MOO- he was part of her abuse while held hostage.

 

[human]

Oh he will want what he deems as his property!

There are plenty of men who look at women and children as property but they abandon the property.

Too much hassle, I feel. He is about his needs and I don’t see having the hassle of so many children as fitting in with his lifestyle now that he does not have a slave

 

[otto]

From the CBC News article on Doody's decision: "In handing down his early decisions, Doody said that while Boyle's controlling behaviour made Coleman angry, frustrated and upset, it did not make her fear for her safety."

On the charge of criminal harassment, if her flight from Boyle in the middle of a cold winter night, underdressed for the weather, was not direct evidence of fear, what on earth was it?

It was making a strong emotional statement to lay the foundation for making false allegations in order to obtain custody of the children and take them out of the country.

 

[otto]

I’m not going to even entertain this anymore. You early believe Joshua Boyle is a good guy and Caitlan is a villain. I’ve read about this case on multiple sites, and the only place where people support JB is on websleuths. Odd.

There is no doubt, given the verdict and summary remarks, that neither of these parents can tell the truth. Neither of them is "a good guy."

They both wanted custody and they wanted to live in different countries. She alleged 18 counts of abuse to secure temporary custody and permission to take the children out of the country. That reason to grant her temporary custody no longer exists, so there is no good reason to deprive the children of a relationship with both parents.

 

[otto]

How does custody work with two countries? Where would it be decided?

Does they each need a US and a Canadian attorney? I cannot even fathom the cost of something like that.

perhaps he does not even want the children. Unless he finds another woman, I cannot see that he would be interested in the attention and work children would need.

after all, he has a book to write

The custody issue was opened in Canada, so one would expect that the custody issue has to be continued in Canada. If the case is heard in Canada, they both need Canadian lawyers.

However, I have no doubt that Coleman will seek to have the custody issue transferred to the USA. Boyle has some reason for not wanting to go to the USA, so that may be enough to keep the custody issue in Canada.

I'm curious to see how it unfolds in terms of international custody and jurisdiction.

 

[Lilibet]

Ex-Taliban hostage cleared of all charges in sexual assault trial

The best synopsis of the case, the verdict and the issues I've found.

From the linked article: Doody also expressed concern over Coleman’s reliability as a witness. She was diagnosed with PTSD following her time as a hostage and testified that she suffered from blackouts and “fits” of anxiety.

The judge cautioned that mental health issues do not make a witness unreliable, but nonetheless flagged her “memory issues”, saying they “raise concerns about her ability to accurately recall the events at issue … and whether the events described took place”.

Rhetorical question: Why is a traumatized woman required to have “consistent” recall of the details of sexual assault and other abuse, but a man is not held to the same standard? Remind me to take contemporaneous notes if I am ever a victim. /sarcasm

Yes, I do understand the need to establish guilt beyond a “reasonable doubt” and that the burden of proof is on the accuser. And I do know that there are men who have been falsely accused. But it seems that, in general, accused men are favored either in verdicts or sentencing (Brock Turner, anyone?).

I can’t help wondering if Caitlyn’s ill-advised press interviews against the judge’s orders were a factor in the verdict.

I hope Caitlyn has the means and the energy to protect herself and her children from further manipulation and abuse by Joshua Boyle and continue to heal, for her sake and for the sake of her children.

 

[bears10]

How does custody work with two countries? Where would it be decided?

Does they each need a US and a Canadian attorney? I cannot even fathom the cost of something like that.

perhaps he does not even want the children. Unless he finds another woman, I cannot see that he would be interested in the attention and work children would need.

after all, he has a book to write

I agree that he probably doesn't want the responsibility, but that's what mommy and daddy are for. I am sure he would have his parents do the heavy lifting.

I think he will be vindictive during the custody case. It gives him a great opportunity to continue inflicting pain and stress on CC. Plus, he has way too much pride to go down without a fight. Often times, messy custody battles aren't even about the kids. Instead, the real motive is to hurt the other parent and "win". I picture JB as one of those parents that will make the custody case about himself, and getting "revenge" on CC.

 

[otto]

From the linked article: Doody also expressed concern over Coleman’s reliability as a witness. She was diagnosed with PTSD following her time as a hostage and testified that she suffered from blackouts and “fits” of anxiety.

The judge cautioned that mental health issues do not make a witness unreliable, but nonetheless flagged her “memory issues”, saying they “raise concerns about her ability to accurately recall the events at issue … and whether the events described took place”.

Rhetorical question: Why is a traumatized woman required to have “consistent” recall of the details of sexual assault and other abuse, but a man is not held to the same standard? Remind me to take contemporaneous notes if I am ever a victim. /sarcasm

Yes, I do understand the need to establish guilt beyond a “reasonable doubt” and that the burden of proof is on the accuser. And I do know that there are men who have been falsely accused. But it seems that, in general, accused men are favored either in verdicts or sentencing (Brock Turner, anyone?).

I can’t help wondering if Caitlyn’s ill-advised press interviews against the judge’s orders were a factor in the verdict.

I hope Caitlyn has the means and the energy to protect herself and her children from further manipulation and abuse by Joshua Boyle and continue to heal, for her sake and for the sake of her children.

They were both traumatized, and they both continue to experience PTSD from their 5 years of captivity. Coleman is not the victim of Boyle, Coleman and Boyle were victims of terrorists.

Although Coleman made false allegations against Boyle at the time that custody was an issue, neither of them was normal. This should never have been handled as it was.

 

[otto]

I agree that he probably doesn't want the responsibility, but that's what mommy and daddy are for. I am sure he would have his parents do the heavy lifting.

I think he will be vindictive during the custody case. It gives him a great opportunity to continue inflicting pain and stress on CC. Plus, he has way too much pride to go down without a fight. Often times, messy custody battles aren't even about the kids. Instead, the real motive is to hurt the other parent and "win". I picture JB as one of those parents that will make the custody case about himself, and getting "revenge" on CC.

Coleman certainly did her best to inflict pain and stress on Boyle! He has been deprived of his children, saddled with huge legal bills and his reputation has been damaged even though he is not guilty on all counts.

 

[Stunned]

I agree that he probably doesn't want the responsibility, but that's what mommy and daddy are for. I am sure he would have his parents do the heavy lifting.

I think he will be vindictive during the custody case. It gives him a great opportunity to continue inflicting pain and stress on CC. Plus, he has way too much pride to go down without a fight. Often times, messy custody battles aren't even about the kids. Instead, the real motive is to hurt the other parent and "win". I picture JB as one of those parents that will make the custody case about himself, and getting "revenge" on CC.

100% agree with this post.She might have issues, but I don’t think they are anything close to his. He scares me.

 

[otto]

100% agree with this post.She might have issues, but I don’t think they are anything close to his. He scares me.

In this modern era, men and women in the USA and Canada are equal in all ways. The couple travelled together in South America for several months. They were married. They returned home for some time and then made plans to travel to Russia. Both parties had equal opportunity to get married, remain married, continue to travel or remain at home. They made their choices. They travelled to unsafe places and were ultimately kidnapped and held captive for 5 years. They coped as well as they could during their captivity.

When they were released, neither of them were normal. They failed to establish a normal life for themselves and their children after returning to Canada.

Custody became an issue and, at that moment, 19 allegations of abuse and violence were made. All 19 counts, including one from an independent party, have been investigated and dismissed.

I'm surprised that even though we know the facts, and we know that Coleman's claims cannot be believed, there's a tendency to assume that Coleman is truthful and the justice system is corrupt.

 

[Lilibet]

Coleman certainly did her best to inflict pain and stress on Boyle! He has been deprived of his children, saddled with huge legal bills and his reputation has been damaged even though he is not guilty on all counts.

I think we can all agree that a ”not guilty” verdict does not mean Boyle is “innocent” of the charges. It simply means that the judge did not believe there was enough evidence to find him guilty. There is certainly no evidence that he is a poor, pitiful victim of a conniving, lying woman “who did her best to inflict pain and stress on Boyle.”