Australia Claremont Serial Killer, 1996 - 1997, Perth, Western Australia - #2

Discussion in 'Serial Killers' started by Aberline_1979, Sep 25, 2013.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. ExcaliburX

    ExcaliburX Former Member

    Messages:
    46
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    All very true IF you believe he only had suspicions later and didn't know the whole deal and/or wasnt involved from the start.

    http://www.bigfooty.com/forum/threads/claremont-serial-killings.985161/page-96#post-37393206

    I don't and doubt he actually contacted plod until after he had a falling out with the others and started covering himself with the stat decs and claims about the suspicious alibi and Freo site - knowing with his record he may end up the sole fall guy.

    The Freo story sounds like BS.

    And also in not mentioning his Myaree address - which given the fire and his deception over it on BF should be a focus of attention.
     


  2. Bartholemeus

    Bartholemeus Former Member

    Messages:
    1,498
    Likes Received:
    21
    Trophy Points:
    0
    The dog hairs found on GR's body - that's a massive stretch to suggest it might be Droc. A lot of people have dogs.

    No idea on victim gender and age. I'm certainly curious though. But think it's a stretch that there is any link to GR.

    The wake vid is 45 minutes long. I haven't sat through the whole thing. Does it say he was locked up from dot to 31, or does he was incarcerated until 31 but meaning "he got out of Freo jail at 31".

    My read on the nocturnal activities with John is that they were grafting/stealing. One woman mentions moving stuff from "here" to "there" and I took that as meaning they were stealing things from others and moving them to someone else (their homes, a porn shop, fence etc)

    In the March 10 posts all I see is gibberish. It doesn't help that Droc quoted himself all the time but was addressing something someone else said.


    I think the whole Droc story is a good read but I think it's fanciful. Could he have been the CSK? It's possible his whole dealings with police were designed to pre-empt an excuse to involvement, but I doubt that too.
     
  3. ExcaliburX

    ExcaliburX Former Member

    Messages:
    46
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Many people have dogs.

    Only one with a dog (in fact a puppy at the time of the abduction and murder), a convicted sex offender on minors no less, made online claims his ex-mates in a cortina station wagon were potentially involved in the GR case.

    17 years later mind you - and also speculating about the cause of death.

    You might recall Droc made zero admissions about any personal involvement despite all he claimed to know pre and post his "suspicions" - and did plenty of deflecting onto his former cohort of friends.

    If his previous crimes involved male children the dog hair aspect may very well be relevant.

    As for the "nocturnal activities" being graft/theft, they would assume that wouldn't they? These are the very upstanding people after all who took him in after prison and supported him. They wouldn't be saying he was out hunting for victims.

    PS: creepy man continues his YouTube madness. Why?
     
  4. billywhizz

    billywhizz Member

    Messages:
    330
    Likes Received:
    8
    Trophy Points:
    16
    The stat decs are arse covering I think.

    Why else do you need stat decs done up proving you gave information to the police?

    I guarantee not one other person who gave information about the CSK then went and got a stat dec done up

    Combine this with his 11 year hiatus on his crusade.. which was taken up again in 2011 when the new detectives started working on the case. All along claims of 'poor me, I keep getting dragged back into this by media, police etc' - WHEN he was the one that set up the blog in 2011 alerting people to the fact it was TT. No one (ie. users on CSK forums) would ever have known anything about any of this if he never set up that blog in the first place. No sympathy for victims, victims families was ever given. It was all about how tough life had been for him since he reported TT back in 1997.

    No one ever saw his 100 page file.. All we saw was dribs and drabs eeked out over a few months. Most of them were letters asking why no one had received his information - but we never saw proof of the original information that was sent. Final act was a letter written to TT in which Droc asks him about a hundred questions. Was he actually expecting a reply?

    His memorial vid at the church - it has members of the church claiming to have covered for Noel when police came around looking for him. WTF? One guy even claims to have put up a bond/bail of $10,000 (20 years ago - obscene amount of money) for him. Again, WTF? And why?
     
  5. Itsasmallworldafter

    Itsasmallworldafter Former Member

    Messages:
    44
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I started to watch the vid watched about 10 mins of it , it was beyond cretinism
     
  6. Bartholemeus

    Bartholemeus Former Member

    Messages:
    1,498
    Likes Received:
    21
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I've all but ruled out Drocs story as is on the basis;

    1. I think police investigated it back in 1998/1999 (although this is the precise time they their cross hairs on LW and we know Caporn and WAPOL have a documented history of ignoring evidence that doesn't fit their line of inquiry)
    2. There's a few holes in Droc's story. I think he's been a bit liberal with the truth and stretched it match his theory
    3. Droc has shown a propensity to make irrational links. That doesn't mean those links don't exist, but he's made a few and once you start making dubious links on top of other dubious links the chance of error multiplies


    What I haven't yet all but ruled out is Droc being involved with TT and using this allegations as a pre-emptive strike to distance himself from involvement should he and TT come under serious scrutiny. Bear in mind there is documentation of Droc using this strategy previously;

    At 15:25 in Droc's wake video one of his friends relates a story and Droc and his mate out on the graft one night with a heap of stolen gear in the back of their ute. A cop car sees them and slows down so Droc pre-empts a potential bust by pulling over and waving the cop over and saying he had a flat tire and wanted a push.

    The stat decs

    It's certainly possible that he had the stat decs made up so there was documented proof that he had approached the police about TT. But he already had letters from the police Commissioner saying they had received his claims and had investigated them.

    The time lines for approaching police

    Droc claims he called the Macro hotline 4 times in the weeks after the CG abduction. We don't know if this is true or not. We also don't know if police have those records or not. Droc claims he sent a written statement in November 1997 (8 months after the CG murder). Police claim they are unaware of this. We don't know whether Droc ever sent it, or Macro lost it, or Macro discarded and concealed it. So potentially Droc may not have contacted Macro until as late as November 1997 or December 1998 and fabricated the earlier contact to cover his ass.

    Problems with the timelines

    LW was under surveillance from approximately October 1997 (and possibly earlier). The LW sting was in April 1998 and I believe this was leaked to the media almost immediately after. If Droc did send them that letter in November 1997 then why would he follow up in December 1998 when LW had better odds od being the CSK than Nat Fyfe has of winning this year's Brownlow? Maybe just to get some form of written proof in case the tide changes? But then he got his proof in the form of multiple letters by the commissioner acknowedging they got his info, had investigated it, and had disregarded it. There'd also be no reason to then go on with a stat dec after all that either.

    If we assume Droc is crafty enough to plant some mitigating evidence before the fact "what do you mean, I told you guys TT was the CSK and you didn't believe me, here's letters from the commissioner and a stat dec" then we must assume he's also smart enough to get his evidence and walk away given LW was white hot. He hammered them not stop with phone calls and letters and had 2 highly esteemed professionals approach the commissioner on his behalf.

    I think it's more likely Droc genuinely thought TT was the CSK. Keep in mind that it appears Droc was in love with Michele but Michele seems to have been TT's girlfriend. Droc actually never comes out and says "Michele was TT's girlfriend" but he does let slip he used to hold all her belongings after they fought and that they fought before each of the murders. This may have tainted Droc's logic.


    A potential scenario

    Droc knows TT, as a taxi driver was called in to East Freo motor registry to speak to police as part of Macro's drive to speak to all Perth's 2,500 taxi drivers (May 1997). Approximately 4-5 months after the CG muder TT tells Droc and his GF that he has just been interviewed by Macro (this is in Droc's stat dec). Droc is spooked because he knows soon they will ask TT for DNA and at this stage the public generally assumes Macro has DNA. Droc decides on a pre-emptive plan to distance himself from TT. He decides to report TT so if TT is busted Droc can say "why would I be involved? I'm the one who dobbed him in". So Droc sends them a letter in November 1997. He fabricates that he made four calls to the Macro hotline.

    He hears nothing back and in April 1998 learns LW is numero uno suspect. But he wonders why he hasn't been contacted. He's shizzing himself so in December 1998 sends them the letter again by registered mail and make contact to get proof that he has made statements.

    Police then interview TT and it doesn't take long for TT to work out one of his co-conspirators has put his name up. TT asks Droc why and Drocs comes up with some lame excuse but they both know Droc was covering his own ass. TT insists that Droc now drop a heap of red herrings that don't add up so police dismiss his story.

    Droc tells police about snuff movies and the cellar and a few other things that don't add up. Police dismiss it, especially since they have a raging hard on for LW.

    Fast forward 10+ years later and a new taskforce is set up. They go through everything because they believe, somewhere something was missing and it was probably something unlikely. They get to Droc and decide they better have a closer look and interview him. Droc hasn't seen TT for years and goes back into survival mode and protectng himself first and writes the blog and approaches media identities.

    Droc gets asked to post on BF. He does so and starts his story off with TT being the main suspect (because he needs to be consistent with the story he has spruiked for years) and gradually shifts blame to Michele. The mentioning of TT's mates are also red herrings as the bringing up of Gerard Ross.

    TT realises his best course of action is to say nothing and carry on doing what he is an expert at (being creepy). Droc and TT briefly cross paths on FB. A private message is sent and they meet and decide the house at 235 Marmion has to go.

    Could it be Droc and TT and no one else? Could they be the guys in the Princess Rd Taxi (DM book says it happened in Bay View Tce)?


    IMO I highly doubt it but you never know.
     
  7. Bartholemeus

    Bartholemeus Former Member

    Messages:
    1,498
    Likes Received:
    21
    Trophy Points:
    0
    It needs to be mentioned that Droc agreed to drop his action against police regarding losing his statements but as soon as he found out LW was a suspect he contacted them and resumed his complaint.

    I don't think a guilty person who is a crafty criminal would do that. For me it is what it is; Droc suspected Mr Creepy was the CSK and became obsessessed with it to the point where he made links that weren't based on fact.
     
  8. Mel 1303

    Mel 1303 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    691
    Likes Received:
    1,074
    Trophy Points:
    93
    I have to agree- Droc sounds as though he truly believed that he knew what happened, and built the evidence around it, even if it did need a bit of bending at times. Reading some of his writing online, and listening to the memorial video, he comes across as a man who was always on a crusade. I feel quite sad for him after reading some of his online stuff- he sure was a complicated character.
     
  9. Itsasmallworldafter

    Itsasmallworldafter Former Member

    Messages:
    44
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Isn't a obmision a confession, to put yourself at the same location as others accused at the same time , knowing the peeps and making refrence to the victims , isn't that grounds to investigate ?
     
  10. Bartholemeus

    Bartholemeus Former Member

    Messages:
    1,498
    Likes Received:
    21
    Trophy Points:
    0
    By "obmission" do you mean "admission"?

    I thought you said you knew who the CSK's were and it wasn't any of this crew? Do I have that wrong?
     
  11. ExcaliburX

    ExcaliburX Former Member

    Messages:
    46
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    He went to extraordinary and inordinate lengths to seek vengeance on his ex mate (and then putting his other ex friends in the frame at the death) for stealing the woman of his dreams - if you believe nothing of his claims as you appear to indicate.

    And involved his powerful friends and supporters at their peril (with the risk of ruining their reputations) to achieve that vengeance.
     
  12. Bartholemeus

    Bartholemeus Former Member

    Messages:
    1,498
    Likes Received:
    21
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I never suggested he did the whole thing out of spiteful vengeance. I suggested he may have acted in a biased manner because of what happened. There's a fair difference.

    And I haven't ruled it out completely either. I just think it's unlikely.
     
  13. ExcaliburX

    ExcaliburX Former Member

    Messages:
    46
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Well said.

    Another question - if he was so convinced it was his ex mate (with no spite or vengeance involved) and he himself had no involvement, why didn't he report all his suspicions about the crew to police - including his later claims about GR, Brown and Govan - in 1998-1999?

    Exactly - why the 11 year hiatus?

    Why only vent all online after he himself has been interviewed and refused to provide a formal statement - where he could have outlined all his suspicions on the record if he was in fact blameless and genuine?

    What was the true motivation behind the actions and expanded claims in his final months?

    His friends reckon he was happy and lucid before he passed. Not insane, not delusional..

    Zero empathy from him in 400+ posts.

    Nor from the Russian creepoid who continues to plumb the depths.
     
  14. Itsasmallworldafter

    Itsasmallworldafter Former Member

    Messages:
    44
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    How did he die ? I wanna see a death cert
     
  15. Bartholemeus

    Bartholemeus Former Member

    Messages:
    1,498
    Likes Received:
    21
    Trophy Points:
    0
    He did report it. Sat with them for 90 minutes on May 10 1999 and told them the whole snuff theory.

    It's reasonable to think Brown, Govan and GR were after thoughts. He seemed to get more irrational as years went by.


    Maybe he moved on. The police set up that new task force in 2011 and approached him. That set him off again. Whether "set off" means started making genuine accusations again, or making accusations to cover his ass again is unknown.
    1. He did make a formal statement. Many times.
    2. He also approached media
    3. He only came to BF because someone invited him. He did make the blog though. His side of the story is he was frustrated no one would listen and he believes police were burying his claims.

    Remains to be seen

    H
    You don't have to be mentally unwell to get obsessed with something and make incorrect judgements
     
  16. ExcaliburX

    ExcaliburX Former Member

    Messages:
    46
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Three additional murders - pretty massive afterthoughts Bart.

    None of his friends thought him irrational. Highly regarded professional supporters to his allegations. Watch the video.

    <modsnip>
     
  17. MyLeftFoot

    MyLeftFoot Member

    Messages:
    212
    Likes Received:
    4
    Trophy Points:
    16

    Bartholemeus.....Do you know when in 2011 the new task force was set up?

    *Good posts BTW!
     
  18. Bartholemeus

    Bartholemeus Former Member

    Messages:
    1,498
    Likes Received:
    21
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Nope. Post by Billy:

    I found the link in BF thread to the article but link has taken down. I don't believe there are specific dates but it seems evident that the new team are having a fresh look.

    I would assume:

    1. They set up a priority list
    2. The LW and PW/SR investigations are probably quite thorough already so prioritised to investigate some of the other lower suspects first. Obviously Droc has been questioned. He says TT was questioned in 2011. How would he know this? The only way he'd know this are the taskforce interviewed him in depth about TT and relayed some of TT responses.

    I wonder:

    1. How in depth did they go into TT and Droc?
    2. Did they pick up the link with the house fire? And did they question both men over it?
    3. Did they go over the site with some heat seeking technology?
     
  19. Itsasmallworldafter

    Itsasmallworldafter Former Member

    Messages:
    44
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Shuks if someone was ringing my family up in the middle of the night and organising , meetings with police , it would start to ring alarm bells
     
  20. Bartholemeus

    Bartholemeus Former Member

    Messages:
    1,498
    Likes Received:
    21
    Trophy Points:
    0
    All the main suspects have done things that are alarming......

    Which is why they are suspects!
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page



  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice