CO CO - Fort Collins, WhtMale 174UMCO, 17-30, "P.I.L." Tattoo, Jul'97

Discussion in 'The Unidentified' started by starburst, Mar 5, 2011.

  1. starburst

    starburst New Member

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    I was just looking at this man that is unidentified in Colorado. Found dead a few months AFTER his Johnny's mom said he came to visit her. Supposedly she hasnt heard anything from him since..though if I were her, I would keep it secret too until I knew he was not in danger. Anyhow...I saw the unidentified picture first, then the pictures of Johhny and what struck me was the gap between the teeth. See if you think its possible. Would make sense that he was living a transient life if he really thought he was in danger.

    Possible Match: Johhny: (PHOTOS FROM JUSTICEFORJOHNNY.COM)

    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=13972&stc=1&d=1299312276

    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=13973&stc=1&d=1299312410

    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=13974&stc=1&d=1299312410

    THE UNIDENTIFIED PHOTO

    Case File 174UMCO THE DOE NETWORK

    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=13975&stc=1&d=1299312614


    ANY COMMENTS? Sorry I still cant stick the pictures in my post. Computer challenged.
     
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  3. starburst

    starburst New Member

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  4. katydid23

    katydid23 Verified Juanette

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    The pictures look really similar/ You might be on to something.
     
  5. CarlK90245

    CarlK90245 UID Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    Interesting - I see the resemblance, and the UID has red hair. There is nothing there that would be inconsistent.

    I see the mention of "evidence of good orthodontic work". Does that mean braces? I wouldn't think that he would have had braces while in captivity. But who knows what conditions he was living under (assuming that he was held in captivity and not killed immediately).

    I also see that the UID is in FBI NMPDD (i.e., CODIS). However, JG's NamUs page (DNA Section) indicates "Samples submitted - Tests not complete". If that is true, I find that astonishing given the notoriety of his case.

    BTW, here are the links
    Johnny Gosch
    NamUs https://www.findthemissing.org/cases/6131/0/
    DoeNetwork http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/160dmia.html
    Charley Project http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/g/gosch_john.html

    DoeNetwork Case 174UMCO
    http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/174umco.html

    ... and here is the side-by-side:

    [​IMG][​IMG]
     
  6. starburst

    starburst New Member

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    But, if he had orthodonics...John Doe..they would have fixed the gap in his teeth. I think he just had naturally good teeth. Some do.

    It would be amazing if things could be that simple. If not Johnny, I hope we find both soon.
     
  7. iconoclast

    iconoclast Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

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    The tattoos on his hand were the symbol for "Anarchy" and "Public Image," a band fronted by John Lydon who often claimed to be an anarchist. I'd like to know what were the "flags" mentioned.
     
  8. starburst

    starburst New Member

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    The flags were on a hat he had on. I looked at those initials also and agree with you on that.
     
  9. tatertot

    tatertot Member

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    I don't see any flag pins on the hat, even in the photo on NamUs, which is less grainy than the image on Doe Network. I think the question is whether the report is referring to actual rainbow-striped flag pins on his hat or whether there were other indications ("flags") that he was gay -- maybe something found in the truck with him?

    The UID was found a year before Matthew Shepard was killed about an hour away, though it's highly unlikely there's any connection between the two cases. If the UID was already transient I'm not sure if he'd want to call more attention to himself with jewelry that clearly identified him as a homosexual.
     
  10. carbuff

    carbuff Well-Known Member

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    Not necessarily. My son had braces on his rear teeth but not on the front. He had a considerable gap in his teen years which gradually closed on its own as he reached his 20's. A front gap like that isn't an orthodontic issue and a lot of guys would rather have the gap than the braces.
     
  11. webrocket

    webrocket New Member

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    I did not see a Namus link on this thread for this UID so here it is:

    https://identifyus.org/cases/454

    there are 7 rule outs, but Johnny Gosch is not one of them.
     
  12. webrocket

    webrocket New Member

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    this UID was discussed in a possible match thread. I wanted to set up a general discussionn thread for him:

    http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=130128&highlight=174UMCO

    here is the Namus link for the UID, described as being a WM, 18-30, with sandy colored hair and a hernia scar. had a slight gap between the first two teeth. deceased was found in Fort Collins, CO on July 12, 1992:

    https://identifyus.org/cases/454

    Doe Network describes hair as sandy or light brown:

    http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/174umco.html
     
  13. webrocket

    webrocket New Member

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    there was a missing boy, Reagan Uden, who was last seen in Lander, WY at age 10 in 1980, along with his brother and mother.

    https://www.findthemissing.org/cases/3970/6/

    Per Charley Project, they believe their mother is deceased but LE is uncertain about the fate of the boys.

    http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/u/uden_reagan.html

    Reagan had brown hair, a hernia scar and a gap between his front teeth.

    other demographics do not work as he was only 10 when he disappeared. he would have been about 22 at the time the UID died which is within the range estimated for him.
     
  14. iowa gurl

    iowa gurl New Member

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    This week it was announced through the media that the State of Iowa was discontinuing the "Cold Case Task Force" in Polk County. During the news report on NBC, they sited Johnny Gosch's kidnapping as well as a few other case, saying they did not have the money to continue this Task Force.
    Well it is news to the Johnny Gosch Foundation that there was a Cold Case Task Force, no one ever contacted Noreen or the Foundation regarding the case. I would suspect no one ever talked to the Martins or the Allen's either. The police in West Des Moines and the FBI have done prescious little since the case began but absolutely nothing in the past 14 years.
    It would have been nice if they had at least sent some kind of notice to the families of this Task Force being shut down so that they did not have to learn of it on a TV show.
    Could this just be another way of closing these kidnap cases forever so that it was as though "it never happened"?????? That would be my guess, since they have hounded Noreen for her DNA for the past two years and she declined to give it to them. We know they would have used it to claim some body in a morgue somewhere in the country, saying it was Johnny and closing the case. Noreen was advised by her attorney to decline to give her DNA to them for this reason. The police were upset when she refused to give it to them.
    Earlier in the year when a corpse was suspected to be Johnny in Colorado, the medical examiner called Noreen and said the WDMPD had sent Johnny's dental records. She also told Noreen that the "WDMPD were pressuring her to say it was Johnny's body". The examiner then stated that in the dental records there was a "tooth restoration" (filling) in a certain tooth. Noreen replied "your corpse is not Johnny, he had a tooth restoration but in a different tooth". There was dead silence on the phone and the examiner then said " oh so you have seen the dental records then"??? Noreen replied " oh yes I have a set of them and know for certain your corpse is not Johnny so you should ask yourself why would the WDMPD try to pressure you to say it is Johnny when they know full well it is not"?
    Following that phone call, Jim Rothstein contacted the medical examiner and also told her what has been going on in the Des Moines area concerning the cover up on the three kidnap cases.
    This is just part of the latest activity on this 29 year old case.

    Luke

    http://www.franklinfiles.net/t45559241/cold-case-task-force/
     
  15. webrocket

    webrocket New Member

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    if Johnny's mother refuses to give DNA thenit wouldn't surprise me that any task force would be shut down. if she's not cooperating, then I can see the state not wasting its resources on a long cold case.
     
  16. believe09

    believe09 Active Member

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    Thanks, Iowa-I think most of this post is better suited for the Johnny Gosch thread. I will copy it and post it there. Please continue any discussion regarding this on that thread. Thank you!

    Here is the link to Johnny's thread:

    Johnny Gosch Missing
     
  17. believe09

    believe09 Active Member

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    We will wait to see if there is an official rule out of this possibility.

    This is the first time I have visited this UID thread, I am sorry to say, and I think the likeness is very, very compelling.
     
  18. webrocket

    webrocket New Member

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    Johnny's Namus page now says "Sample submitted - Tests complete" for his DNA. not sure where they got it if his mother refused to provide a sample.

    in any event, if it exists and it has not matched then it is a rule out in all probability and might not be listed as such with the UID.
     
  19. Cappuccino

    Cappuccino Active Member

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    They probably got DNA off Johnny's father, or one of his siblings.
     
  20. Cubby

    Cubby fly the W!

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    If there is dna for both Johnny and the Doe, both reading submitted, tests complete, wouldn't that be an automatic rule out based on both being in Codis?
     
  21. webrocket

    webrocket New Member

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    I would tend to think so Cubby.
     

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