Deceased/Not Found CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #16 *ARREST*

Discussion in 'Missing Persons Discussion' started by GuyfromCanada, Dec 3, 2018.

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  1. MassGuy

    MassGuy The Monsters Ain’t the Ones Beneath the Bed

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    I agree. I also think that if an accomplice was the one to make that trip, he didn’t take her body with him.

    Most people aren’t going to be willing to but their freedom on the line, in order to move a body for someone else.

    So once we found out who took her phone, I think the answer to where she is will be clearer.

    If PF made that trip, then she very well could be in Idaho.

    If he didn’t, she’s still in Colorado.
     
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  2. CowboyCO

    CowboyCO Member

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    We haven't had significant snow in a couple of weeks. Sunny areas are bare and maybe a couple of inches in the shade (gullies and draws will always be shady due to trees). It's possible to have fire pits (and very common), but we've been under a lot of red flag warnings and burning restrictions. Nobody would let an authorized fire go unreported as we've had multiple big wildfires in the last 20 years.
     
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  3. Elizabeth Lavenza

    Elizabeth Lavenza Well-Known Member

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    Welcome to WS! Very good posts IMO.
     
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  4. NanZDrew

    NanZDrew Well-Known Member

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    I don't think a regular fire would very easily burn the bones...especially a skull.
     
  5. MassGuy

    MassGuy The Monsters Ain’t the Ones Beneath the Bed

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    It’s been done, but it requires time and effort.

    Steven Avery burned his victim.

    There’s always something left behind though.
     
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  6. susiQ

    susiQ Well-Known Member

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    I also think KB's body made it to the ranch and was moved again.
     
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  7. CowboyCO

    CowboyCO Member

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    I think burning is very unlikely. Florissant had a large forest fire this summer with homes destroyed and people evacuated. Any fire in these conditions would draw a lot of attention.
     
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  8. BuySellTrade

    BuySellTrade Well-Known Member

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    We are pretty much in agreement though you obviously know the specifics better than where I have never been. There are probably more than 1 or 2 people watching the Christmas tree cutting. As I related USFS employees did Christmas tree patrol where recreation or however Christmas tree duties are now budgeted/classified had people outside their normal jobs. Also the only "Rangers" in the USFS are one District Ranger per Ranger District and Ranger is the head administrator for an RD. The folks out patrolling are Recreation Technicians or LE or ??? Essentially never the District Ranger. I also agree highly likely to be observed by a local but there are probably more Feds lurking about, particularly at the time and place for thousands of tree cutters. The USFS pays attention to the Christmas tree cutting. My Dad's family had Federal grazing leases plus as noted I worked USFS and I grew up around horses and cattle (back in 50s and 60s but alfalfa and calves until the 1970s). My Dad had a 400 acre ranch, a NF inholding, with 25 acre and 8 acre patches of alfalfa. In the Fall he would buy at auction 15 to 30 calves who would subsist on alfalfa he did not sell on cutting and stored baled in pole barns for winter feed. The calves would be rotated through the winter via hot fence on about 60 acres including the alfalfa patches.

    Thank you for the local detail.
     
  9. CowboyCO

    CowboyCO Member

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    The area where Frazee lived is only about 1/2 mile off Hwy 24 and 60% of the property is forested. It's not a ranch like you would think of one out here in the West. It's just a 35-acre horse property. Their property is 60% forested with not a lot of graze available for livestock, so would likely have to supplement feed any livestock in the summer and probably 100 percent in the winter. There's a barn and corral on property and no natural sources of surface water.
     

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  10. susiQ

    susiQ Well-Known Member

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    Possible, but I just don't see that burying her at the ranch is necessary, besides it would be a little risky with his mom around? If he brought the body and baby K home, hung around for a bit with mom until baby went to bed and then told her he was going out for a beer with the guys? We know the murder was planned. He surely had an idea of where he wanted to dispose of the body. This scenario makes me think she's closer to home as he would have to be back in a few hours to not raise suspicion in his mother. 12 hrs to Idaho may be pushing it :) Of course, another scenario would be someone took her to Idaho with the phone. It is a puzzle and I wish we had just a few more pieces to work with here.
     
  11. Charlot123

    Charlot123 Well-Known Member

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    I read that murderers make trips to the body, to check whether it is still there. Perhaps it makes sense to find out where PF might usually go, even daily, without raising suspicions. Walk the dogs, train the dogs? I think whatever the place is, it should be pretty well-known to him. So if someone would see him going there, it would look perfectly commonplace.

    Even if he moved it, there still should be some traces.
     
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  12. jillianelaine

    jillianelaine Former Member

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    It might not reside with domestic issues. What are some of the other possibilities for him wanting her silenced? Did she witness something she should not have seen?
     
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  13. Charlot123

    Charlot123 Well-Known Member

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    Can I quote from your post, please?
    Here is my opinion. Our kids tend to get married much later in life than we did. If anything, from the biological point, perhaps it is too late, but economy dictates childbirth.

    I am not so sure abstinence till marriage is healthy, reasonable, or even works for everyone. (unless I did not understand your point, but I hope I did).

    What I think we absolutely need to teach our kids is how to protect themselves and their partners, from pregnancy, but maybe even more, from STDs, and everything affecting the lives of their posterity.

    But I agree that premarital counseling is a good idea.
     
  14. CowboyCO

    CowboyCO Member

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    Occam's Razor. Domestic is likely and common in these types of cases.
     
  15. Charlot123

    Charlot123 Well-Known Member

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    Very sorry for your friend. I hope she found happiness later.

    About KB and PF, it seems to me that we need verified insiders to post, but it ain’t gonna happen before the investigation is over. I think knowing more about them could help find her body, but today, we don’t know anything about their relationship, nor what kind of people they were. I can’t assume anything for the lack of information. I hope one day we know more.
     
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  16. Kapua

    Kapua Well-Known Member

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    IMHO, she's still in Colorado, but I have been wrong before and I wouldn't put anything past this guy. Hopefully, we will get some answers soon. What did LE find in ID? What did they learn from examining PF's red truck?
     
  17. Kapua

    Kapua Well-Known Member

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    Deleted - duplicate
     
  18. MassGuy

    MassGuy The Monsters Ain’t the Ones Beneath the Bed

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    I’m not so sure about that.

    Initially, I did believe that she was killed in a domestic violence incident.

    The fact that he is charged with first-degree murder, and solicitation to commit first-degree murder, means that there was premeditation here.

    This indicates that it wasn’t a crime of passion, but a planned killing.
     
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  19. jillianelaine

    jillianelaine Former Member

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  20. nwmouse

    nwmouse Verified cheese addict.

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    The motive appears to be clear in this case: sole custody of their daughter.

    PF had means, motive and opportunity.

    There is no doubt in my mind that this killing was pre-meditated with other involvement, similar to the family involvement of the Karyn Hearn Slover murder. I keep wondering if KB's body parts are going to turn up, although I hope she wasn't dismembered for the sake of her family and loved ones.


    moo
     
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