CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #43 *ARREST*

[Nudgee]

I don't think he was supposed to get her at that time at all.
I wonder if he sweet-talked her into letting him take the baby in the pretense that he would be picking her up later so the three of them could go out to dinner. Maybe he suggested she take a nap, since she was up all night. Imo

Yes...it could be one of those details we may never know the truth about (unless SF does take the stand since it appears she may be the only one who could/would state the where about of Baby K Wed night/Thurs morning). For all we know, PF could have brought Baby K to KB's Thursday morning. Then KB and Baby K went to Safeway later. I don't recall if CB ever mentioned any kind of custody exchange in her statements or any specifics of where or who Baby K was going to be with... so nothing to compare notes to.

 

[MassGuy]

I hope the Walmart detail is clarified.

In the affidavit, iirc, it is stated that PF was seen by Walmart and furniture store surveillance video--as in, he was seen driving by both places on his way to KB's townhouse.

Then it was stated that he was seen AT Walmart with a baby carrier with the same blanket over the carrier as when KB was seen in the Safeway video. Couldn't see baby in the carrier, but it was assumed she was in it.

Was he seen AT Walmart in his pickup, and baby carrier seen through the windows of the truck? Or were he and the baby carrier seen IN Walmart?

The implication was that he was seen with the baby carrier, inside the Walmart.

It jibed perfectly with him picking up the baby from Kelsey’s house, shortly after she returned from Safeway.

What didn’t fit, was that he claimed that once he picked up the baby, he never saw Kelsey again.

Of course, he was caught on camera returning to the house after he left Walmart.

Liar, liar, pants on fire.

 

[UKslueth2018]

Two things:

IMO, KKL has a plea deal and that deal is likely to stick based on what we know so far. That said, PF is nothing if not vindictive and cruel. I’d wager that the defense will do everything in its power not just to refute her evidence but to expose her in a deal-breaker lie or some critical fact that she withheld. In fact, the DA may be expecting (hoping for?) just such a move. She ought to be terrified. But I find it hard to imagine they’d void her deal for any reason prior to PF’s trial.

Also, as things stand currently, it seems to me like the defense really has only one logical course of action — to suggest that the murder didn’t occur until after KKL arrived in town. All the evidence surrounding the proposed TOD seems to be circumstantial and/or based on KKL’s testimony. Co-pinging phones only mean the phones were in proximity to each other, not that anyone was dead. So if the defense can raise enough doubt about the TOD, they also can raise doubt about who committed the murder. And that’s all they need to do.

Again, MOO. LE no doubt has more evidence than we are aware of and they continue to strengthen the DA’s case. But this does worry me...

I think he is probably wishing he had bashed her face in as well (poor Kelsey, so sorry you met this sob) so I fully expect him to come up with a story totally implicating her as the culprit

 

[ab01]

I got my dates mixed up but... there is a a call noted in #17 of the affidavit - apparently this log was downloaded from PF’s phone. I believe the log shows a call from KB’s cell to PF's phone on the 24th, call lasted more than 16mins. So how/when did KK end up with KB’s phone? Was it left at the townhome on the 22nd and someone used it to call PF? Assuming that had to be KK if she eventually destroyed it. All said, was this a conversation about what she needed to clean up? Why use KB’s phone if KK had a burner phone or her own phone for that matter if she wanted LE to find her? MOO

I think Its highly likely that PF made calls to and from KBs phone when he was in possesion of them both. I think he merely dialed one phone pressed answer and would just leave it connected for certain amounts of time. Trying to make it look like him and KB were having conversations. He likely thought he was being clever....MOO

 

[GoneGoldfishin']

I got my dates mixed up but... there is a a call noted in #17 of the affidavit - apparently this log was downloaded from PF’s phone. I believe the log shows a call from KB’s cell to PF's phone on the 24th, call lasted more than 16mins. So how/when did KK end up with KB’s phone? Was it left at the townhome on the 22nd and someone used it to call PF? Assuming that had to be KK if she eventually destroyed it. All said, was this a conversation about what she needed to clean up? Why use KB’s phone if KK had a burner phone or her own phone for that matter if she wanted LE to find her? MOO

Both KB and PF phones pinged together. He was just calling it (not speaking to anyone) to throw off the investigation. At least that is how I interpreted affadavit points 21-23. MOO.

 

[MassGuy]

I think Its highly likely that PF made calls to and from KBs phone when he was in possesion of them both. I think he merely dialed one phone pressed answer and would just leave it connected for certain amounts of time. Trying to make it look like him and KB were having conversations. He likely thought he was being clever....MOO

Yeah, except doing that was tantamount to shooting himself in the foot.

It’s so utterly bizarre.

The elaborate effort to deceive on one hand, and the idiocy of having two phones sitting next to each-other, communicating from the exact same location.

 

[MemPat]

I don't think he was supposed to get her at that time at all.
I wonder if he sweet-talked her into letting him take the baby in the pretense that he would be picking her up later so the three of them could go out to dinner. Maybe he suggested she take a nap, since she was up all night. Imo

Beware of demons who suddenly become thoughtful human beings, right?!

 

[Herat]

We know KB talked to her mom twice on Thanksgiving morning. If (as mentioned in @Seattle1 's post you are quoting), she and her mom also spoke in the evening after the late night cattle checking/ulcer meds activity, that means the late night wasn't Wednesday night into Thursday morning but rather Tuesday night into Wednesday morning?

Whichever night it was, I suspect the target shooting was a part of the same day that became the late night session. I don't think he sent her to check cows by herself, as some have implied. I think they went out there together, though perhaps each driving separately if the cattle activity required two vehicles (ie "you go down the road and count how many are in the meadow while I count in this field"). Earlier in the day, while it was still light, they could have gone target shooting. It does raise the question of whether PF intended for an "accident" to happen then but he chickened out or something else got in his way.

We don't know if he did target shooting too or if it was just her, perhaps refamiliarizing herself with the gun if she hadn't shot it in a long while. If she did the target shooting somewhere like his place, with him overseeing her, to me that suggests she felt safe around him to have him be the one helping her get comfortable with the gun again. IMO

ETA or @MassGuy 's thought that it was all Weds eve but the sequence was target shooting then phone call to mom then cattle checking then ulcer meds -- that makes sense too, IF the call to mom happened while on the way to the cows rather than from home. Cows were in Westcliffe which IIRC is over an hour away? Meaning a decent chunk of that late night, 2-3 hours worth, was spent just driving there and back. Wouldn't they have started out before dark? Why were they going late in the day at all? Wouldn't one want to count cows/fix fence/whatever they were doing in the daylight?

So my head is spinning with all his shenanigans with the ulcer and the cows and the target shooting

Thankfully, LE will have the pings of both phones minute by minute to plot out where they both were

 

[ab01]

Yeah, except doing that was tantamount to shooting himself in the foot.

It’s so utterly bizarre.

The elaborate effort to deceive on one hand, and the idiocy of having two phones sitting next to each-other, communicating from the exact same location.

And that is the Genius of his extreme stupidity !

 

[whoizzit]

Yeah, except doing that was tantamount to shooting himself in the foot.

It’s so utterly bizarre.

The elaborate effort to deceive on one hand, and the idiocy of having two phones sitting next to each-other, communicating from the exact same location.

What a buffoon.

"Can you hear me now?"

 

[PommyMommy]

I got my dates mixed up but... there is a a call noted in #17 of the affidavit - apparently this log was downloaded from PF’s phone. I believe the log shows a call from KB’s cell to PF's phone on the 24th, call lasted more than 16mins. So how/when did KK end up with KB’s phone? Was it left at the townhome on the 22nd and someone used it to call PF? Assuming that had to be KK if she eventually destroyed it. All said, was this a conversation about what she needed to clean up? Why use KB’s phone if KK had a burner phone or her own phone for that matter if she wanted LE to find her? MOO

PF gave KK the phone after they burned KB's body at the ranchette.
MOO

PF's phone and KB's phone pinged together from Nov 22 to Nov 24 so no, KB's phone was not left in her townhouse. We don't know what the conversation was on the 16th minute phone call. If I had to guess, I'd say PF was talking to himself. MOO

 

[Seattle1]

I got my dates mixed up but... there is a a call noted in #17 of the affidavit - apparently this log was downloaded from PF’s phone. I believe the log shows a call from KB’s cell to PF's phone on the 24th, call lasted more than 16mins. So how/when did KK end up with KB’s phone? Was it left at the townhome on the 22nd and someone used it to call PF? Assuming that had to be KK if she eventually destroyed it. All said, was this a conversation about what she needed to clean up? Why use KB’s phone if KK had a burner phone or her own phone for that matter if she wanted LE to find her? MOO

After KB's murder on 11/22, reports indicate that PF and KB's phones were paired together up until 11/24. An outgoing call on KB's phone on 11/24 would have been KK or PF making the call.

My bet's with KK making the call.

 

[Dave F.]

Posters have asked for the exact route from Florissant to Idaho that KKL and LE described. I personally don't believe she drove straight through without stopping. Rodeo people often have friends or family where they can crash for a few hours and go again without an extensive visit, so I have broken it into two logical parts. The total is at the bottom, if you believe she drove without stopping:

US 24 from Florissant to Buena Vista, CO
US 50 over Monarch Pass, through Gunnison and Grand Junction, CO to Fruita, CO
note: Florissant to Fruita 272 miles, 5 hr 32 min

I 70 from Fruita to Green River, Utah
US 191 from Green River to Castle Gate, Utah
US 6 to Spanish Fork, Utah
I 15 from Spanish Fork thru Salt Lake City to Tremonton, Utah
I 84 from Tremonton to Exit 182 (Anderson Camp, Idaho)
Idaho 50 from Exit 182 to Rock Creek Road (Hansen, Idaho)
note: Fruita to Hansen 482 miles, 7 hr 10 min

Total Distance 759 miles, Est driving time 12 hr 31 min

 

[UKslueth2018]

IDK, maybe because she is a user and a manipulator? They do still live together, so yeah that's pretty involved. But really, she may have been too nervous to drive, considering she just learned that everything was about to come crashing down around her and PF. MOO.

The things people will do and put up with for love never ceases to amaze me... (Myself included!! - although I should add would never do anything like the stuff we see on here!)

Feel sorry for him and the kids as I guess he was either trying to make it work or be there for his children.. They divorced in 2016 didn't they so one wouldn't necessarily expect them to still be living together..

 

[UKslueth2018]

Posters have asked for the exact route from Florissant to Idaho that KKL and LE described. I personally don't believe she drove straight through with stopping. Rodeo people often have friends or family where they can crash for a few hours and go again without an extensive visit, so I have broken it into two logical parts. The total is at the bottom, if you believe she drove without stopping:

US 24 from Florissant to Buena Vista, CO
US 50 over Monarch Pass, through Gunnison and Grand Junction, CO to Fruita, CO
note: Florissant to Fruita 272 miles, 5 hr 32 min

I 70 from Fruita to Green River, Utah
US 191 from Green River to Castle Gate, Utah
US 6 to Spanish Fork, Utah
I 15 from Spanish Fork thru Salt Lake City to Tremonton, Utah
I84 from Tremonton to Exit 182 (Anderson Camp, Idaho)
Idaho 50 from Exit 182 to Rock Creek Road (Hansen, Idaho)
note: Fruita to Hansen 482 miles, 7 hr 10 min

Total Distance 759 miles, Est driving time 12 hr 31 min

12 hour drive to do that... What an earth must have been going on in her mind... So many opportunities to turn around..

 

[Ccging]

KK was killed in the living room as cited by Investigators in the affidavit, not the bathroom. There were blood smears later found in the bathroom -- probably from PF cleaning himself off.

Even with that, KK forgot to take the trash in the bathroom? That was my main point. Why leave that trash? They found blood evidence on the trash can so it’s not like it was enclosed under a sink. This strikes me as strange.

 

[MsBetsy]

Both KB and PF phones pinged together. He was just calling it (not speaking to anyone) to throw off the investigation. At least that is how I interpreted affadavit points 21-23. MOO.

Yes, I think there were several short calls lasting a minute or two, and one longer call, which may be the 16 minute call the OP is referring to. All done by PF to make it look like he and KB were communicating. Imo

 

[AgeofAquaruis]

I just don't think he is as smart as he thinks he is. I think he was more concerned with the timing of it all than the well thought out details.

Yes he is. He had his,and KB's phones with him, sending fake messages from one phone to another.
Plus the stories came up with. oh yeah,and thinking whacking someone with a baseball bat would be clean kill.
MOO

 

[Steelslady]

• • Slater says after KK collected the items, she put some towels in the washing machine. She ran out of trash bags & used 4 bags from inside KB’s home. She also found bloody baby wipes, suggesting PF tried to clean up, and discarded them. Slater says KK used some Oxiclean & Windex from inside KB’s home.
  • They concluded she may have been killed in the bathroom.
  
  *. Not to be insensitive, but defense points out Kelsey was on her period at that time. Slater confirmed he found tampons in the trash. @KOAA #KelseyBerreth #PatrickFrazee #KrystalKenney
  
  
  
  OK, huge question!!! So it’s been stated that KK was detailed in her cleanup, she states above she ran out of trash bags and had to use 4 from KB’s home.
  
  LE concluded KB may have been killed in the bathroom and that’s where most of the blood evidence was yet.....Slater found tampons in the trash?????????
  
  Um, what trash? KK left trash in the bathroom!?!?
  
  HUH??????

You can't make this stuff up, can you?

 

[MsBetsy]

Even with that, KK forgot to take the trash in the bathroom? That was my main point. Why leave that trash? They found blood evidence on the trash can so it’s not like it was enclosed under a sink. This strikes me as strange.

Maybe she just had so much on her mind that she forgot about it.
It must have been a very long day, after all. Imo