CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #17

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I’m seeing more of an ego thing for the motive for these murders that reminds me of Scott Peterson. These 2 men (SP & CW) thought they were cool. Interestingly, they both were cheating on pregnant wives. I wish I could articulate it better, but I think neither one wanted to be seen as a failure or a jerk. They would have felt embarrassed and ashamed. Both of them placed a high value on their image and appearance. Both of them were filled with secrets and lies. I can see where they might take desperate measures to maintain the level in society they’d thought they’d achieved. They didn’t want to be found out.

That's possible. Maybe he didn't consider (before he acted) being suspected of murdering his entire family due to their disappearances (even if no one could prove) would be far worse than anything for his reputation and desire for privacy.
 

ZsaZsa

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I also have a Bachelors degree in Journalism. I earned it many years ago and so many things have changed since then. I agree, the standards today are quite different.
Sad but I have to think back to Walter Cronkite before I can think of someone that I trusted implicitly with the news being accurate and honest.
 

molly1255

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CW was the one who no longer loved his spouse and wanted to be free, so why would he have snapped if she was giving him what he wanted (i.e. leaving)?

Can't find the link now, but I seem to recall an early article with friend stating CW would give his life for his girls. If he killed SW in a rage, then why systematically kill the girls? Why sacrifice them to save his own skin when he was likely going to be caught anyway?

That's why I think he planned to killed all of them for his own selfish reasons, like not wanting to pay child support or having any further parental responsibilities.

You might be right. My thoughts are that none of this had to do with being in love, or with not being in love, but rather about having control.

My perception of him is that he is highly narcissistic and he has an exaggerated sense of entitlement. The fact he was having an affair, on his pregnant wife with a co-worker tells me he
May I ask why you think they only put $2,000 down on the Saratoga Trail house if SW got $16,000 from the sale of her house? They were not paying rent, as they lived with SW’s friend that she nannied for.

IIRC, the home (Saratoga) was purchased for $400,000 and the mortgage was $392,000.
 

nwmouse

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CW was the one who no longer loved his spouse and wanted to be free, so why would he have snapped if she was giving him what he wanted (i.e. leaving)?

Can't find the link now, but I seem to recall an early article with friend stating CW would give his life for his girls. If he killed SW in a rage, then why systematically kill the girls? Why sacrifice them to save his own skin when he was likely going to be caught anyway?

That's why I think he planned to killed all of them for his own selfish reasons, like not wanting to pay child support or having any further parental responsibilities.
Yes, this is what I think too. Plus he would bask in the role of the "grieving dad/widower" and get lots of sympathy. Do we know if there were life insurance policies taken out on SW?
 

Seattle1

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Sorry, they did not voluntarily disclose the payments as a disclaimer before airing the photos. The information came to light only during a court hearing into Casey Anthony's need for more defense funds, then they tried to back pedal on the true nature of the payment.
ABC News Under Fire For Payment To Murder Suspect
All the major news gathering agencies have been caught doing it, without it bothering their scruples too much.
I believe it was on ABC/20-20 that I recall Ms. Vargas read the disclaimer about payment for the photos (not GMA). Thanks for NPR link and reminder. MOO
 

Layla123

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You have only paid dollars of the capital of a mortgage after three years of payments.
Could you explain this better, I don’t know what “paid dollars of the capital of a mortgage after 3 years” means. Thx.
 

silverkitty

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Better stated by several others.
 
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Seattle1

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I am assuming he brought no assets to the marriage due to the low down payment they placed on the Frederick house, and how quickly they declared bankruptcy, shortly, thereafter. I did a search on SW’s NC house. It was purchased in 2009 for $334,000 and sold in 2012 for $350,000. That’s a $16,000 profit. If all the financial records posted here are correct, that’s about all the money they had when they came to CO. But I could be wrong. Please share if you know different.
I don't believe you're accounting for the fact that these prices are gross numbers. After seller's closing and sales costs, SW very well could have owed more than your perceived $16k profit. In other words, SW very likely walked away with no cash in her pocket to take to Colorado! (Also, a three year mortgage would not of touched the principal mortgage balance but by a few dollars). MOO
 

pocketaccent

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I am assuming he brought no assets to the marriage due to the low down payment they placed on the Frederick house, and how quickly they declared bankruptcy, shortly, thereafter. I did a search on SW’s NC house. It was purchased in 2009 for $334,000 and sold in 2012 for $350,000. That’s a $16,000 profit. If all the financial records posted here are correct, that’s about all the money they had when they came to CO. But I could be wrong. Please share if you know different.
If those figures are accurate, she most likely had lost money upon sale of her NC house.

If she purchased it for $334,000, she probably had to pay at least $10,000 in closing cost and escrow.

Also, very little of monthly mortgage payments go toward the principal in the first few years. Almost all goes toward interest.

Then she would have to pay no less than $20,000 in closing cost to sell the house.
 

nwmouse

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Does anyone know if SW had a life insurance policy/policies naming CW as the beneficiary? I have googled it but couldn't come up with any info.
 

LovesChocolate

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In regards to "unnamed sources", it is not unusual with journalists, it's a way to get otherwise unavailable information. When I studied Journalism in college and got my first newspaper job (a small daily) it was accepted that reporters would have MORE than one source before the story was run. I believe the Washington Post demanded three (3) sources/confirmations during Watergate. Alas, journalism has changed and the standards are not that high anymore.


The Journalist's Creed was written by the first dean of the Missouri School of Journalism, Walter Williams. One century later, his declaration remains one of the clearest statements of the principles, values and standards of journalists throughout the world. The plaque bearing the creed is located on the main stairway to the second floor of Neff Hall at the University of Missouri at Columbia,

“I believe in the profession of journalism.

I believe that the public journal is a public trust; that all connected with it are, to the full measure of their responsibility, trustees for the public; that acceptance of a lesser service than the public service is betrayal of this trust.

I believe that clear thinking and clear statement, accuracy and fairness are fundamental to good journalism.

I believe that a journalist should write only what he holds in his heart to be true.

I believe that suppression of the news, for any consideration other than the welfare of society, is indefensible.

I believe that no one should write as a journalist what he would not say as a gentleman; that bribery by one's own pocketbook is as much to be avoided as bribery by the pocketbook of another; that individual responsibility may not be escaped by pleading another's instructions or another's dividends.

I believe that advertising, news and editorial columns should alike serve the best interests of readers; that a single standard of helpful truth and cleanness should prevail for all; that the supreme test of good journalism is the measure of its public service.















I believe that the journalism which succeeds best -- and best deserves success -- fears God and honors Man; is stoutly independent, unmoved by pride of opinion or greed of power, constructive, tolerant but never careless, self-controlled, patient, always respectful of its readers but always unafraid, is quickly indignant at injustice; is unswayed by the appeal of privilege or the clamor of the mob; seeks to give every man a chance and, as far as law and honest wage and recognition of human brotherhood can make it so, an equal chance; is profoundly patriotic while sincerely promoting international good will and cementing world-comradeship; is a journalism of humanity, of and for today's world. “


Mizzou - my alma mater.

Welcome to WS @LovesChocolate -- you're among friends here!

When I posted same news about CW on suicide watch (i.e., People Crime), a fellow member reminded me that suicide watch was protocol for new inmates. As to remorse, CW will always view his actions as somebody else fault (he already blamed SW). He immersed his babies in crude oil, he obviously has no conscious and therefore no remorse. He didn't deserve a family, and no jail privileges should be the norm. The monster doesn't have another court date until November! MOO.

Some posts (or threads) back, someone mentioned that pinning the children's death on SW would be in CW favor as far as sentencing goes. Can something like this be advised by an attorney?

I agree! I am struggling with the concept that this person could not be capable of remorse, perhaps because I don't want to think that a family man could do such a thing, especially to his own babies. It's too frightening to think that there's people out there living like this every day. Or perhaps because the SM presentation is so normal, they were the-family-next-door. In the majority of horrible crimes, we aren't privy to people's personal lives as much as this one.
 

gregjrichards

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How long is he likely to be on suicide watch for? Can he be watched indefinitely till trial and beyond. It is a real worry he is going to escape justice and not be held accountable because he has hung himself or harmed himself some other way.
 

Layla123

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If those figures are accurate, she most likely had lost money upon sale of her NC house.

If she purchased it for $334,000, she probably had to pay at least $10,000 in closing cost and escrow.

Also, very little of monthly mortgage payments go toward the principal in the first few years. Almost all goes toward interest.

Then she would have to pay no less than $20,000 in closing cost to sell the house.
Her original asking price was $399,000, but she lowered it to $350,000.
 

Solstice Canyon

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We’ve seen several expert analyses of CW’s initial news interviews. Has anyone seen a similar analysis of some of the FB videos? I’m particularly interested in what they might pick up in the “Oops, We Did it Again!” clip.

It’s currently my understanding that the pregnancy was (at least allegedly) the idea of CW, and that SW “agreed to” it.

Earlier, someone commented about CW’s seemingly recent hypersexuality. If there were multiple AP’s in a fairly short timeframe, could CW’s apparent desire for a third child perhaps have been a front to disguise his desire for more sex? Could “pretending” to want a third child have been a way to convince SW to “willingly participate” on a more regular & frequent basis?

Purely speculation, but supposing he was “taking steroids” to help develop his physique (apologies in advance if we’ve ruled this out), could this potentially have fueled any hyper-sexual tendencies?

Continuing on that premise (which again is speculative), if given a scenario in which CW was taking steroids, mightn’t he also have assumed his fertility would be negatively impacted?

Since it was already difficult for SW to conceive as a result of her lupus diagnosis, perhaps he assumed that the combination of him taking steroids (which I understand to reduce sperm production) + her lupus would allow him to “safely” proceed in this manner without actually having to “risk” another pregnancy.

When I see the “Oops, We Did it Again!” video, I get the sense he is perhaps more dumbfounded than pleased. He is slow to respond, and not genuinely jubilant. Although he says, “That’s awesome,” his words ring hollow to me. It seems like his mind is racing.

The last sentence, where he expresses something to the effect of “I guess that just shows if you want it, it happens” also strikes me as a strange sentiment, and his delivery is choppy. Almost like he’s stifling what he might really like to say.

Aside from the fact that the sentence itself is odd (to me, anyway), why is he saying “you” instead of “we”?

It isn’t: “WE’re expecting, hooray!!!”

It’s more like:

“I guess when YOU want it, it happens.” (Like a mistake or an accident “happens”?)

When I first heard it — reading between the lines — it struck me as if he was lamenting the belief that the universe always seems to line up in SW’s favor, rather than his.

Then, he threw in a big hug and smooch at the end for good measure. I figure maybe this was like the hug someone witnessed between them, which was in the driveway, in the midst of a fight. In other words, a big act for the audience’s benefit.

FWIW, I have no idea if this line of thinking has merit. It’s basically just a “what if” idea that occurred to me as I was trying to piece the puzzle together in my brain.
 
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