NOTGUILTY Daniel Penny on Trial for manslaughter and negligent homicide of Jordan Neely #4

[GRT]

If JN knew there was an open arrest warrant, it could explain his comment about (paraphrased) not caring if he died or went to jail.

JMO

That could be.

One of the problems, MOO, is that people like JN slip through the cracks way too often. We just don't have the services necessary to help these people, so we end up with situations like this.

I don't think life was easy for JN. With 42 arrests under his belt, maybe he learned to act out and get arrested when he couldn't find food elsewhere. He bounced in and out of jail. But, at least they fed him in jail.

The judge allowed the Defense to offer testimony about JN being violent--breaking bones in an elderly woman's face--maybe to show the jury what JN was capable of (MOO), but why didn't anyone (prior to this incident) really step up and help JN?

In my small community, there are churches and organizations that care for those who struggle like JN, but it seems as though services are hard to find in big cities.

 

[Ontario Mom]

The judge allowed the Defense to offer testimony about JN being violent--breaking bones in an elderly woman's face--maybe to show the jury what JN was capable of (MOO), but why didn't anyone (prior to this incident) really step up and help JN?

In my small community, there are churches and organizations that care for those who struggle like JN, but it seems as though services are hard to find in big cities.

RSBM

"Neely had been on a NYC Department of Homeless Services list of the city’s homeless with acute needs – sometimes referred to internally as the “Top 50” list – because individuals on the list tend to disappear, a source told CNN. The list is generally not made public but is compiled in hopes that outreach organizations will be on the lookout for those individuals and alert the city’s homeless services department to intervene, the source said. The agency places additional focus on trying to find those on the list and give them the help they need, the source explained." https://www.cnn.com/2023/05/07/us/jordan-neely-subway-nyc-homeless/index.html

The article doesn't identify who actually compiles this list, but in the spirit of charity I'll give them the benefit of doubt and suggest that maybe they did offer him help, and he refused it? Or maybe he avoided contact with any authority because he knew he had a warrant after he ditched the residential treatment program? I'm not sure we'll ever know those answers, but it's sure a valid question.

 

[RANCH]

snipped

Maybe generous folks like those who donated to Daniel Penny's defense would be willing to make donations to organizations that help people in need like Jordan Neely.

Crowdfund gives Daniel Penny millions for legal defense in alleged killing of homeless man Jordan Neely

Daniel Penny has raised almost $3 million in a legal defense fund following charges in the killing of homeless man Jordan Neely.

abcnews.go.com

Maybe they do.

 

[Inthedetails]

Maybe they do.

Of course.

jmo

 

[GRT]

snipped

Maybe generous folks like those who donated to Daniel Penny's defense would be willing to make donations to organizations that help people in need like Jordan Neely.

For sure. Maybe.

The guys with the bells and red buckets just appeared outside my Walmart store this past week, and it seems like almost everyone drops some money in those buckets. The Salvation Army is one of the biggest non-governmental charities that helps the homeless. Catholic Charities and Mennonite Aid are also big on helping the homeless.

I'll try to dig deeper in my pockets this year when I see the bell-ringers.

 

[Inthedetails]

For sure. Maybe.

The guys with the bells and red buckets just appeared outside my Walmart store this past week, and it seems like almost everyone drops some money in those buckets. The Salvation Army is one of the biggest non-governmental charities that helps the homeless. Catholic Charities and Mennonite Aid are also big on helping the homeless.

I'll try to dig deeper in my pockets this year when I see the bell-ringers.

I used to volunteer at a place in NYC that helped people like JN and it was HARD, rewarding, and very humbling. Any bit not only helps materially but helps boost morale to the people who provide services. If we truly want people like JN to get help, we have to actively support the helpers. (And, I'm not assuming people are not already doing that.)

Money and well-wishes for places that help don't flow in as easily as the $2.9 million for Penny's defense funding and emotional support for him did, (but criticism about help for the needy "not being enough" and laments about "where is the help?" sure do, predictable like clockwork).

jmo

 

[Inthedetails]

I used to volunteer at a place in NYC that helped people like JN and it was HARD, rewarding, and very humbling. Any bit not only helps materially but helps boost morale to the people who provide services. If we truly want people like JN to get help, we have to actively support the helpers. (And, I'm not assuming people are not already doing that.)

Money and well-wishes for places that help don't flow in as easily as the $2.9 million for Penny's defense funding and emotional support for him did, (but criticism about help for the needy "not being enough" and laments about "where is the help?" sure do, predictable like clockwork).

jmo

Oh, thought of another one - sickle cell research. A disease that causes a young man in prime years of life to keel over dead deserves attention.

And I say that sincerely, even as I do not think JN died of sickle cell. This case has made me more aware of the disease and I'm assuming research could use support.

In other WS cases, I have been left wanting to make a difference after learning about certain issues, and this is another one. I always am surprised what I learn by following WS threads. I'm not suggesting this is the reaction everyone should have, only sharing a reaction from me, myself, and I.

jmo

 

[RANCH]

I'm certainly grateful for all of the people who donated to Penny's legal defense fund.

It's allowing him to put up a good defense against a powerful state prosecution. Without those donations I feel he wouldn't have a prayer.

I'm hoping the jury will acquit Daniel Penny. JMO.

 

[IceIce9]

I used to volunteer at a place in NYC that helped people like JN and it was HARD, rewarding, and very humbling. Any bit not only helps materially but helps boost morale to the people who provide services. If we truly want people like JN to get help, we have to actively support the helpers. (And, I'm not assuming people are not already doing that.)

Money and well-wishes for places that help don't flow in as easily as the $2.9 million for Penny's defense funding and emotional support for him did, (but criticism about help for the needy "not being enough" and laments about "where is the help?" sure do, predictable like clockwork).

jmo

Daniel Penny’s defense fund is now
$3,212,334. And it is stated on the site that any proceeds collected, which exceed those necessary to cover Mr. Penny’s legal defense, will be donated to a mental health advocacy program in New York City.

 

[Inthedetails]

Daniel Penny’s defense fund is now
$3,212,334. And it is stated on the site that any proceeds collected, which exceed those necessary to cover Mr. Penny’s legal defense, will be donated to a mental health advocacy program in New York City.

That is terrific! Thanks so much for sharing that.

jmo

 

[Snoopster]

I'm certainly grateful for all of the people who donated to Penny's legal defense fund.

It's allowing him to put up a good defense against a powerful state prosecution. Without those donations I feel he wouldn't have a prayer.

I'm hoping the jury will acquit Daniel Penny. JMO.

I'm hoping that everyone in any case has a good defense against 'a powerful prosecution'. Having said that the prosecution always has the burden of proof. And that is how it should be.

 

[GRT]

I'm certainly grateful for all of the people who donated to Penny's legal defense fund.

It's allowing him to put up a good defense against a powerful state prosecution. Without those donations I feel he wouldn't have a prayer.

I'm hoping the jury will acquit Daniel Penny. JMO.

I'm grateful for the donations to his defense fund, too. I wasn't paying much attention to this case until it went to trial, and I started reading the thread here. Then, I watched the video(s) and felt something was "off." Because JN was clearly resisting--in a very active manner--and if DP had been trying to kill him, JN would have been unconscious much earlier. MOO

All the pieces finally came together when Dr. Chundru testified about what really happened, and then it started to fit. Then I started reading peer-reviewed studies about victims of exertional sickling, and it made much better sense. MOO, What happened to JN was nearly identical to those seemingly healthy young men with SCT who collapse and die on athletic fields nearly every year. I found so many studies and reports.

I don't know if Dr. Harris was lax or if she just hadn't dealt with an exertional sickling death before. But, in my opinion, her testimony was inaccurate. MOO

So, like you, I'm grateful that people donated to DP's defense fund. Otherwise, he wouldn't have gotten the robust defense he has recieved. Who knows what the verdict will be--but I now feel that DP is innocent of wrongdoing.

MOO, but I think those who donated did so out of a sense that an innocent man might be punished for keeping the other passengers safe in the train that day. Blackstone's Ratio is still alive and well in our nation. MOO

All is MOO.

 

[GRT]

Daniel Penny’s defense fund is now
$3,212,334. And it is stated on the site that any proceeds collected, which exceed those necessary to cover Mr. Penny’s legal defense, will be donated to a mental health advocacy program in New York City.

And, that's the way it should be.

 

[Jade]

Its so obscene that money is being celebrated as the officiant in this case.

That money will buy the case for Daniel Penny that otherwise The People will win their case. The horror a jury may decide the fate as charged.

Equally they both as citizens walked on to the subway and instead of how it’s decided in courts throughout the nation now it’s tipped with outside interference to the perceived better than.

At least a life long neglected, starving, thirsty, tired, mentally exhausted man who is killed by a attacker cost millions and millions of dollars before DP and fans can buy the case. Or try to hadn’t bought it yet.

The donors bought a pig in a poke with Daniel Penny lying to investigators, imo, but the bought victory crowd won’t be bothered, imo.

It does seem the Defense could have bought some witnesses beyond mom and sister who like with Richard Allen were predictably not applicable to the person acting in the crime that day.

Yes, I’m sure the attorney team will leave plentiful funds for a token charitable donation, lol. That will insure there’s no funds for a civil case.

Marine Veteran Misused a Combat Technique in Fatal Chokehold of NYC Subway Rider, Trainer Testifies

Attorneys for Daniel Penny argue their client had sought to restrain Neely by placing him in a headlock, but that he did not apply strong force throughout the interaction.

www.military.com

All imo

 

[Ontario Mom]

MOO, but I think those who donated did so out of a sense that an innocent man might be punished for keeping the other passengers safe in the train that day. Blackstone's Ratio is still alive and well in our nation. MOO

All is MOO.

<RSBM>

I know folks who donated, and from the ones I know (good, decent folks, all of them), that's exactly why. They wanted to ensure DP had a proper, qualified defense. It's as simple as that.

 

[mickey2942]

Just one comment respectfully - just because someone has a diagnosis of schizophrenia doesn't make them any more physically aggressive then someone who does not. There are actually plenty of people who have a schizophrenic diagnosis who have never been physically aggressive even when in the throes of psychosis.

However, Neely does have a substantial history of violence.

Including three separate charges for assault.

In 2021, Neely socked a 67-year-old woman as she exited the Bowery station in the East Village in Lower Manhattan.

The woman sustained a broken nose, a fractured orbital bone, and "bruising, swelling and substantial pain to the back of her head" in the Nov. 12 attack, according to a criminal complaint.

Neely pleaded guilty to felony assault Feb. 9 in exchange for a 15-month alternative-to-incarceration program, according to the Manhattan District Attorney's Office. He was supposed to stay in a treatment facility and abstain from drugs.

If he had completed the program, the felony assault would have been reduced to a misdemeanor, but he skipped a compliance court date and left the facility. A warrant was issued for his arrest on Feb. 23. It wasn't immediately clear how long he spent in jail awaiting the resolution of the assault case.

Jordan Neely's arrest record examined as outrage grows over subway death

Neely, 30, died after he was restrained by other riders on a Manhattan subway, including one who put him in a chokehold for several minutes.

www.newsweek.com

 

[Ladyotm]

Its so obscene that money is being celebrated as the officiant in this case.

That money will buy the case for Daniel Penny that otherwise The People will win their case. The horror a jury may decide the fate as charged.

Equally they both as citizens walked on to the subway and instead of how it’s decided in courts throughout the nation now it’s tipped with outside interference to the perceived better than.

At least a life long neglected, starving, thirsty, tired, mentally exhausted man who is killed by a attacker cost millions and millions of dollars before DP and fans can buy the case. Or try to hadn’t bought it yet.

The donors bought a pig in a poke with Daniel Penny lying to investigators, imo, but the bought victory crowd won’t be bothered, imo.

It does seem the Defense could have bought some witnesses beyond mom and sister who like with Richard Allen were predictably not applicable to the person acting in the crime that day.

Yes, I’m sure the attorney team will leave plentiful funds for a token charitable donation, lol. That will insure there’s no funds for a civil case.

Marine Veteran Misused a Combat Technique in Fatal Chokehold of NYC Subway Rider, Trainer Testifies

Attorneys for Daniel Penny argue their client had sought to restrain Neely by placing him in a headlock, but that he did not apply strong force throughout the interaction.

www.military.com

All imo

Perfectly said!

 

[IceIce9]

However, Neely does have a substantial history of violence.

Including three separate charges for assault.

In 2021, Neely socked a 67-year-old woman as she exited the Bowery station in the East Village in Lower Manhattan.

The woman sustained a broken nose, a fractured orbital bone, and "bruising, swelling and substantial pain to the back of her head" in the Nov. 12 attack, according to a criminal complaint.

Its so obscene that money is being celebrated as the officiant in this case.

That money will buy the case for Daniel Penny that otherwise The People will win their case. The horror a jury may decide the fate as charged.

Equally they both as citizens walked on to the subway and instead of how it’s decided in courts throughout the nation now it’s tipped with outside interference to the perceived better than.

At least a life long neglected, starving, thirsty, tired, mentally exhausted man who is killed by a attacker cost millions and millions of dollars before DP and fans can buy the case. Or try to hadn’t bought it yet.

The donors bought a pig in a poke with Daniel Penny lying to investigators, imo, but the bought victory crowd won’t be bothered, imo.

It does seem the Defense could have bought some witnesses beyond mom and sister who like with Richard Allen were predictably not applicable to the person acting in the crime that day.

Yes, I’m sure the attorney team will leave plentiful funds for a token charitable donation, lol. That will insure there’s no funds for a civil case.

Marine Veteran Misused a Combat Technique in Fatal Chokehold of NYC Subway Rider, Trainer Testifies

Attorneys for Daniel Penny argue their client had sought to restrain Neely by placing him in a headlock, but that he did not apply strong force throughout the interaction.

www.military.com

All imo

But he wasn’t just a “a life long neglected, starving, thirsty, tired, mentally exhausted man.”

He had a long criminal record.

Jordan Neely's arrest record examined as outrage grows over subway death

Neely, 30, died after he was restrained by other riders on a Manhattan subway, including one who put him in a chokehold for several minutes.

www.newsweek.com

And, he threatened to kill passengers:

One witness testified to the grand jury that Neely’s menacing words — which included ravings that “someone is going to die today” and that he was “ready to go to Rikers” — were “insanely threatening” and delivered with a “sickening” and “satanic” bent.

The witness “believed he was going to die as Neely began approaching him,” the motion read.

“He described the moment as ‘absolutely traumatizing’ beyond anything he had ever experienced in six years riding the subway,” the lawyers wrote.

NYC subway passengers hid, prayed during Jordan Neely’s ‘insanely threatening’ rant before deadly chokehold: court docs

Train passengers who were in the subway car when homeless man Jordan Neely launched into a maniacal rant just before his death described his words as “sickening” and “satanic” — as defense attorney…

nypost.com

 

[Jade]

But he wasn’t just a “a life long neglected, starving, thirsty, tired, mentally exhausted man.”

He had a long criminal record.

Jordan Neely's arrest record examined as outrage grows over subway death

Neely, 30, died after he was restrained by other riders on a Manhattan subway, including one who put him in a chokehold for several minutes.

www.newsweek.com

And, he threatened to kill passengers:

One witness testified to the grand jury that Neely’s menacing words — which included ravings that “someone is going to die today” and that he was “ready to go to Rikers” — were “insanely threatening” and delivered with a “sickening” and “satanic” bent.

The witness “believed he was going to die as Neely began approaching him,” the motion read.

“He described the moment as ‘absolutely traumatizing’ beyond anything he had ever experienced in six years riding the subway,” the lawyers wrote.

NYC subway passengers hid, prayed during Jordan Neely’s ‘insanely threatening’ rant before deadly chokehold: court docs

Train passengers who were in the subway car when homeless man Jordan Neely launched into a maniacal rant just before his death described his words as “sickening” and “satanic” — as defense attorney…

nypost.com

Horrible circumstances manifested that would have been plenty of reason that day for intervention but for some reason Daniel Penny over reacted, ignored knowledgeable assistance that then resulted in killing JN, and lied to investigators about those circumstances.

all imo

 

[caradana]

MOO: I think he will be acquitted. And as a female, petite NYC commuter with easily 1,000+ MTA rides under my belt - who has seen firsthand how terrifying the unchecked post-COVID mental health situation underground has gotten - if I ever see Daniel Penny walk into a car, I’m walking in right behind him and sitting next to him.