Evidence not tested

[CuriousGeorgia]

FS. it wasn't exactly a "long drop hanging", as they think she went over vertically, so a broken neck isn't a given. Even in real "long drop hangings" the neck does not always break, so that seems to be a moot point, IMO.

The medical examiner found all of the things you mentioned, and they all proved to him it was a hanging, and that Rebecca was alive when she went over the railing.

It sounds to me like they did a very through investigation...seven weeks with 8 - 15 investigators working around the clock. And they even flew out to talk to the Zahaus in person after they determined it was suicide. They spared no expense, IMO.

 

[justice be served]

BTW, Rebecca had four SEPARATE hemorrhages to the top of her head. She also had cuts and blood on her fingers, scratches on her face, back, arms and legs, bruises to her thigh and lower legs, tape reside on her legs and an extra ligature mark around her neck. Also her throat bones were broken and she had facial petechiae and congestion which is indicative of strangulation vs hanging but no broken neck or decapitation as would be expected in a long drop hanging.

This doesn't sound right to me. It sounds like solving Rebecca's murder was too expensive so they opted for a determination of suicide because it was cheaper. Imo.

BBM. I would said "expedient" not necessarily cheaper. The faster it goes away the sooner forgot was their take perhaps? Hardly in this case.

 

[freespeech]

IMO that is not at all required because SDSO did so little testing of any DNA, trace or otherwise.

Other posters have suggested that testing was limited to save money. I was also just thinking that it took 13 hours for the coroner to arrive and inspect the body. I wonder how that time lag may have effected the condition of DNA at the scene.

 

[justice be served]

FS. it wasn't exactly a "long drop hanging", as they think she went over vertically, so a broken neck isn't a given. Even in real "long drop hangings" the neck does not always break, so that seems to be a moot point, IMO.

The medical examiner found all of the things you mentioned, and they all proved to him it was a hanging, and that Rebecca was alive when she went over the railing.

It sounds to me like they did a very through investigation...seven weeks with 8 - 15 investigators working around the clock. And they even flew out to talk to the Zahaus in person after they determined it was suicide. They spared no expense, IMO.

BBM. Per the timeline..........
August 31st

– LE conducts first and only interview with Rebecca’s sister, Mary.

September 2nd

– LE conducts press conference. They declare Rebecca’s death a suicide and the case closed. Max’s death is declared an accident.

The one and only interview with the person closest to Rebecca was done 2 days before announcing it a suicide? I don't care how many investigators were working on the case they did not talk with her sister whom Rebecca had spent a great deal of time on the phone with speaking/texting the night she was murdered? That is not an exhaustive investigation when one is determining a person's mindset in concluding a suicide result.

And the fact they flew out to see Mary - whoop-de-doo - they probably wanted to get a sense of what they would be up against from the family since even LE IMO were not convinced it was suicide.

Not impressed.

 

[CuriousGeorgia]

BBM. Untrue according to Dr. Cyril Wecht on Dr. Phil: 'You might have unconsciousness............from the blunt force trauma on her head'. And this was a world renowned medical examiner who WAS NOT PAID FOR by anyone.

http://www.drphil.com/slideshows/slideshow/6583/?id=6583&slide=1&showID=1737&preview=&versionID=

Compelling interview that goes into many other inconsistencies of the so-called "suicide".

San Diego Sheriff Bill Gore issued the following written statement at 7:12 p.m. on Tuesday, responding to the Dr. Phil Show series of reports:

After personally reviewing the two-part show by entertainment psychologist Phil
McGraw, Sheriff Bill Gore explained, "No new information has been provided by this second
autopsy." The case remains concluded.


"To date," Sheriff Gore said, "neither our detectives, nor the Medical Examiner's Officehave been presented with any new evidence from this examination. "

Sheriff Gore advised those who appeared on the "Dr. Phil" show altered and
misrepresented facts, as well as omitted pertinent details all together.

Further, Dr. Wecht did not reach out to the San Diego County Medical Examiner's Office or the Sheriff's Office to attend the autopsy, as is normal protocol to establish and maintain a clean chain of custody, should new evidence be found.

According to Sheriff Gore, "This is nothing more than sensationalism at its lowest pointand the family is only enduring more suffering from this insensitivity."

http://www.cbs8.com/story/16049618/pathologist-hanging-would-have-broken-zahaus-neck

 

[CuriousGeorgia]

BBM. Per the timeline..........
August 31st

– LE conducts first and only interview with Rebecca’s sister, Mary.

September 2nd

– LE conducts press conference. They declare Rebecca’s death a suicide and the case closed. Max’s death is declared an accident.

The one and only interview with the person closest to Rebecca was done 2 days before announcing it a suicide? I don't care how many investigators were working on the case they did not talk with her sister whom Rebecca had spent a great deal of time on the phone with speaking/texting the night she was murdered? That is not an exhaustive investigation when one is determining a person's mindset in concluding a suicide result.

And the fact they flew out to see Mary - whoop-de-doo - they probably wanted to get a sense of what they would be up against from the family since even LE IMO were not convinced it was suicide.

Not impressed.

I would think JONAH was the person closest to Rebecca, not Mary. All she knew was the few times she and RZ texted and talked that Monday and Tuesday. She had no clue how Rebecca was reacting the rest of the time after Max's accident. Rebecca was a 32 year old woman - her boyfriend would have been the person to talk to, not Mary.

I really don't understand why the Zahaus and some of their supporters think they should get the "royal" treatment. Just my opinion.

 

[freespeech]

Someone would have had to wear an entire Hazmat suit to not leave any DNA or fingerprints. Just gloves wouldn't do it.

The bruises on RZ's head were minor. They wound not have knocked her out and there were no drugs found in her body.

"Bruises on the right of her scalp were also seen. These were relatively minor. Because there was evidence that she went over the balcony in a non-vertical position, she may have struck her head on the balcony on the way down," Dr. Jonathan Lucas, of the San Diego Medical Examiner's Office says.

In conclusion, the San Diego Medical Examiner firmly stands by their findings that Rebecca Zahau committed suicide: "As in any comprehensive investigation, some findings cannot be entirely explained.

http://www.radaronline.com/exclusiv...eport-explained-san-diego-sheriffs-department

Which finding can't be explained?

"Bruises on the right of her scalp" does not really fit the suicide scenario does it? They seem more fitting in an assault scenario. Especially FOUR SEPARATE HEMORRHAGES as opposed to the downgraded presser version which renamed them bruises. So she struck her head on the balcony FOUR SEPARATE TIMES as she traveled downward in a non-vertical position. This appears to defy the law of gravity.

After she defied the law of gravity and repeatedly struck her head against the balcony she then swung her body repeatedly in wide arch like circles so she would be sure to obtain innumerable scratches and bruises to her face, legs, and back.

The amazing part is that she even made it over the balcony after her throat was crushed by the tee shirt wrapped around it.

 

[justice be served]

I would think JONAH was the person closest to Rebecca, not Mary. All she knew was the few times she and RZ texted and talked that Monday and Tuesday. She had no clue how Rebecca was reacting the rest of the time after Max's accident. Rebecca was a 32 year old woman - her boyfriend would have been the person to talk to, not Mary.

I really don't understand why the Zahaus and some of their supporters think they should get the "royal" treatment. Just my opinion.

BBM. I guess that says it all, thank you. Let us hope that a "suicide by others" doesn't happen to any of us that would cause our beloved families to expect the "royal" treatment in seeking answers to a suicide finding that has more holes in it than swiss cheese. I believe a new investigation is more than warranted and no one should be afraid that it be reopened. It does seem that there is fear in that possibility.

 

[freespeech]

I would think JONAH was the person closest to Rebecca, not Mary. All she knew was the few times she and RZ texted and talked that Monday and Tuesday. She had no clue how Rebecca was reacting the rest of the time after Max's accident. Rebecca was a 32 year old woman - her boyfriend would have been the person to talk to, not Mary.

I really don't understand why the Zahaus and some of their supporters think they should get the "royal" treatment. Just my opinion.

Not to be facetious but didn't Dina claim that Rebecca was descended from royalty in the 'Boy Interrupted' article?

 

[freespeech]

Your post made me think.

I don't think LE ever said this was girl's underwear, e.g., it couldn't have been a size a woman would wear? Rebecca was small anyway and I bet she would wear abut the same size as many teenage girls. Of course, if they were excluded then no one tried to find out if someone would claim them (there are only a few reasons people throw underwear in the trash anyway, so I find the fact they were there unusual anyway!).

Is there any evidence that Rebecca died in that room? They obviously did not check out whether she could have been murdered elsewhere and moved to that room, right? It would be easier, it seems to me, to not leave DNA if a struggle or altercation took place elsewhere and the staging took place in the room with the balcony. It sort of makes sense to me also.

Was there an issue with no light being on in that room or was that settled, e.g., the light was off and the claim would have to be that Rebecca either committed suicide in the dark, turned the lights off before jumping, or?

Now that you mention this I always wondered if they tested the red blanket. It could have been used as a tarp to work on and protect the rug from blood DNA stains. It also could have been used to wrap up her body in order to carry it from the guest house to the main house. It seems that it's presence would be more indicative of use by a murderer that a suicide victim.

 

[CuriousGeorgia]

Which finding can't be explained?

"Bruises on the right of her scalp" does not really fit the suicide scenario does it? They seem more fitting in an assault scenario. Especially FOUR SEPARATE HEMORRHAGES as opposed to the downgraded presser version which renamed them bruises. So she struck her head on the balcony FOUR SEPARATE TIMES as she traveled downward in a non-vertical position. This appears to defy the law of gravity.

After she defied the law of gravity and repeatedly struck her head against the balcony she then swung her body repeatedly in wide arch like circles so she would be sure to obtain innumerable scratches and bruises to her face, legs, and back.

The amazing part is that she even made it over the balcony after her throat was crushed by the tee shirt wrapped around it.

DUDE! Did you not see the wall and the prickly tree that she fell into? Not to be mean, but I'm sure her body swung a bit until it came to rest. That tree and that wall would have done all of those injuries just fine.

Plus, they don't think she went over vertically, so she probably hit the balcony, too.

The tee shirt did not crush her throat. She was alive when she went over. And she could have spit the ends out of her mouth at any time. If it wasn't suicide, why wouldn't she have spit out the gag?

If you want to hear Gore's reply to what Dr. Wecht said (and remember he said Whitney Houston was murdered), go to http://www.cbs8.com/video and search for "Sheriff Slams Dr. Phil" and watch the 4:29 video.

 

[CuriousGeorgia]

Not to be facetious but didn't Dina claim that Rebecca was descended from royalty in the 'Boy Interrupted' article?

Dina said, "Rebecca CLAIMED she was from royalty", IIRC.

 

[CuriousGeorgia]

Now that you mention this I always wondered if they tested the red blanket. It could have been used as a tarp to work on and protect the rug from blood DNA stains. It also could have been used to wrap up her body in order to carry it from the guest house to the main house. It seems that it's presence would be more indicative of use by a murderer that a suicide victim.

Funny, in my mind, since she was hanging herself naked, she was cold, and used it in the wicker chair while she bound her ankles.

What "blood DNA stains"? And don't you think two or three people carrying a Jui Jitsu master in a red blanket all the way from the guest house to the main house would have left some clues? Why didn't Rebecca have any defensive wounds? Why was there no skin or blood under her nails?

 

[freespeech]

There have been plenty of cases where a murderer has worn gloves, whether leather or latex or whatever. But in this case, I'll point out again, that the black glove found were probably not latex and were powder free. They would be exactly what a murderer would want. I doubt you are going to buy one pair of these gloves that easily, IDK. The fact that no matching glove and no box was found indicates it was probably brought to the scene.

Also, killers have been known to even wear surgical/crime scene booties during a murder to cover their footprints so it is not at all implausible they at least wore gloves.

Do we know if the inside of that black glove was tested for DNA?

This is an excellent point. Killers have been know to suit up so that their DNA will not be discovered at the scene. Though that may offer some protection it is not 100% infallible, imo.

 

[justice be served]

Dina said, "Rebecca CLAIMED she was from royalty", IIRC.

Just one more "dig" at a dead woman. Unforgivable IMO.

 

[justice be served]

Funny, in my mind, since she was hanging herself naked, she was cold, and used it in the wicker chair while she bound her ankles.

What "blood DNA stains"? And don't you think two or three people carrying a Jui Jitsu master in a red blanket all the way from the guest house to the main house would have left some clues? Why didn't Rebecca have any defensive wounds? Why was there no skin or blood under her nails?

BBM. Cyril Wecht believes Rebecca very likely could have been unconscious. See his interview upthread.

 

[freespeech]

Funny, in my mind, since she was hanging herself naked, she was cold, and used it in the wicker chair while she bound her ankles.

What "blood DNA stains"? And don't you think two or three people carrying a Jui Jitsu master in a red blanket all the way from the guest house to the main house would have left some clues? Why didn't Rebecca have any defensive wounds? Why was there no skin or blood under her nails?

There were abrasions and blood on her fingers so apparently she did try to fight. Since she had four separate hemorrhages to the top of her head, she was either ambushed and knocked unconscious or dazed before they wrapped her up in the blanket and carried her to the hanging room.

 

[freespeech]

DUDE! Did you not see the wall and the prickly tree that she fell into? Not to be mean, but I'm sure her body swung a bit until it came to rest. That tree and that wall would have done all of those injuries just fine.

Plus, they don't think she went over vertically, so she probably hit the balcony, too.

The tee shirt did not crush her throat. She was alive when she went over. And she could have spit the ends out of her mouth at any time. If it wasn't suicide, why wouldn't she have spit out the gag?

If you want to hear Gore's reply to what Dr. Wecht said (and remember he said Whitney Houston was murdered), go to http://www.cbs8.com/video and search for "Sheriff Slams Dr. Phil" and watch the 4:29 video.

So the dude who was in charge of the Ruby Ridge fiasco gave his take on Cyril Wecht's professional findings. Huh. I'll bet it's fascinating.

 

[justice be served]

So the dude who was in charge of the Ruby Ridge fiasco gave his take on Cyril Wecht's professional findings. Huh. I'll bet it's fascinating.

Ah yes, Ruby Ridge. Not one of Sheriff Gore's finer moments. I believe it was his undoing with the FBI. So far he's hanging in there with SDSO.:floorlaugh:

 

[gypsychild]

This is an excellent point. Killers have been know to suit up so that their DNA will not be discovered at the scene. Though that may offer some protection it is not 100% infallible, imo.

Question: If AS cut RZ down and performed CPR, how was RZ's dna the only dna on the rope, the shirt, her body, etc?