Fact or Fiction?

Discussion in 'JonBenet Ramsey' started by Barbara, Jul 24, 2004.

  1. Barbara

    Barbara New Member

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    I have been reading time and time again that JonBenet said she was going to receive a special/secret visit from Santa.

    Did she really say that?

    To Whom?

    Is that an internet fallacy or is that a witnessed fact?
     
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  3. K777angel

    K777angel New Member

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    The mother of JonBenet's friend, Megan I believe her name is, told investigators that JonBenet had made this comment to her about Santa making a special visit to her after Christmas. When Megan's mother tried to correct JonBenet on the timing of the visit and tell her that Santa comes on Christmas Eve, JonBenet insisted that it was after Christmas.

    I've always felt that it was all probably easily explainable in that the Ramseys were going to celebrate ANOTHER Christmas once they arrived in Michigan at their summer home where they were gathering with John Andrew, Melinda and her fiance. Patsy had last minute wrapping of the gifts she was bringing for everyone to open and so I can see where they could have mentioned to JonBenet that "Santa was coming again AFTER Christmas to pay a special visit." It could have simply meant in Michigan and not something cryptic as some like to see it.
     
  4. Barbara

    Barbara New Member

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    Thanks Angel,

    That certainly makes a whole lot of sense. Was this little girl's mother the only one that heard it? Just curious. I don't think it has a great deal of relevance regarding the case, but sometimes I get confused as to what is fact and fiction after hearing things so many times.

    I don't have all the materials/books handy and there are so many whose memory is better than mine, that from time to time I just ask first before I go searching.

    So much information..........so little memory :)
     
  5. BlueCrab

    BlueCrab New Member

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    It's a fact. On Christmas Eve JonBenet told Barbara Kostanick about the secret visit from Santa. Pg 50, PMPT pb:

    "The day before Christmas, JonBenet was at our house playing with Megan. The kids were talking about Santa, getting all excited. I asked JonBenet if she had visited Santa Claus yet. She said, "Oh, Santa was at our Christmas party the other night." Megan had seen Santa at the Pearl Street Mall, so we talked about that.

    Then JonBenet said, "Santa Claus promised that he would make a secret visit after Christmas."

    I thought she was confused. "Christmas is tonight," I told her. "And Santa will be coming tonight."

    "No, no," JonBenet insisted. "He said this would be after Christmas. And it's a secret."

    JMO
     
  6. Islander

    Islander New Member

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    I think Angel is right on target. It is very likely that not only were John and Patsy going to give gifts to John Andrew and Melissa, but also John Andrew and Melinda were going to give gifts to all the Ramseys, including JB. Since JB still believed in Santa, it makes sense that Patsy would tell her beforehand that Santa was going to make a second visit to their house in Michigan to explain the gifts from John Andrew and Melinda.
     
  7. BlueCrab

    BlueCrab New Member

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    But why would JonBenet be told to keep it a secret? She likely knew that JAR and Melinda were also coming and there would be presents exchanged at Charlevoix. There was no apparent need to keep it a SECRET.

    JMO
     
  8. Jayelles

    Jayelles New Member

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    Kids love secrets. I will regularly tell my Tootsie that something is a "secret" - it's just a game. Might be that we're going to have spaghetti bolognese for tea or that Daddy is a silly sausage/dopey doughnut. Maybe JBR was told that melinda and JAR didn't know Santa was coming again to visit them and that it was a secret.

    These kinds of games are purely for the amusement of our children. We build things up for them - give them fantasies to make their little world's magical.
     
  9. BlueCrab

    BlueCrab New Member

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    I can't disagree with Jayelles' theory, but it's only her guess. A theory alone doesn't cancel out the hard fact, supported by a credible eyewitness, that SOMEONE told JonBenet that Santa was going to pay a secret visit after Christmas.

    It's a clue that shouldn't be casually dismissed with a theory. The person who told JonBenet that should have been tracked down.

    JMO
     
  10. vicktor

    vicktor New Member

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    We agree on this one, for a change.
     
  11. TressaRing28

    TressaRing28 Former Member

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    Yes -- Jayelles you are right on ...
     
  12. Toltec

    Toltec New Member

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    The secret Santa JonBenet was referring to was tied in with the letter found torn up in her bedroom trash can. It is a letter telling her to have a nice Christmas and it was signed by a secret Santa.

    She most likely got the letter along with the teddy bear from the Amerikids people.
     
  13. TressaRing28

    TressaRing28 Former Member

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    Toltec where is this in writing that SECRET SANTA JB was talking about was from the trash letter?

    Was it really signed Secret Santa????

    Thanks Tressa
     
  14. WolfmarsGirl

    WolfmarsGirl New Member

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    I think the letter in the trash was more like a tag that was addressed to 'friend.' I also think that the tag, or letter, came off of the Santa bear from the pageant. The tags were addressed to 'a friend' since the pageant directors did not know which kid would end up with which bear at the pageant. Addressing the tags in this manner would be a lot easier than making sure that JBR got the bear that said, "to JBR" and that Suzie got the bear that said, "to Suzie," etc. Make sense?

    Also, we tell my daughter that Santa will visit Grandma & Grandpa's house after Christmas, because we celebrate with grandparents after we celebrate at home.

    I am always nervous when she and her friends talk about Santa, etc. because traditions are so different from family to family. It is too soon for her to figure the whole thing out yet, so I try to change the subject.

    My daughter also wakes up to candy in her shoes on St. Pat's day. We are of Irish descent and the shoe/candy thing has always been a tradition.

    However, we are one of only a few families I know who honors this tradition.

    I did tell my daughter on at least one occasion to not talk about the candy thing much in school because she would hurt other kids' feelings if they didn't get candy also. So, I guess I have told her to keep this tradition a 'secret.' I just am not ready for my little girl to learn the truth about leprechauns from a classmate...:) The less she talks about it the better.

    I am sure the secret Santa visit JBR talked about was pretty much the same thing in the Ramsey house.
     
  15. Blazeboy3

    Blazeboy3 Inactive

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    IMHO JonBenet was taught at a very young age that the word "secret" meant you didn't speak of such to others...IMHO this meant that JonBenet was mind-controlled by her parents and probably because John was molesting her and it was a "secret"--not to be talked/shared about to others...wake up you all (or as Cher says:SNAP OUT OF IT)...this "secret" stuff is going on all around you if only you had eyes to see. IMHO knowledge of such is neutral but to stand by and see/look at it right in the face and know abuse is going on AND then do nothing is too shameful beyond words.
     
  16. Ivy

    Ivy Inactive

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    Maybe it's not important, but according to the PMPT excerpt BC posted, the story was about a secret visit from Santa, not a visit from a secret Santa.

    imo
     
  17. TressaRing28

    TressaRing28 Former Member

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    Good Point Ivy ;)
     
  18. TLynn

    TLynn New Member

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    JonBenet's remark is highly suspicious and after reading it - I strongly suspected Santa McReynolds. Still think of him as a possible intruder.

    You would think the note in the trash would have been emptied out by the housekeeper if it were given with the Santa Bear...but there is a possible connection.

    Also, no one else seems to think the note in the trash is a "clue."

    But McReynolds got himself into the Ramsey house under the excuse of doing a Charles Kuwalt (sp?) tv show...which was cancelled...?! I've often wished someone had followed up to confirm that.

    The McReynolds are suspicious and the excuse of the BPD to eliminate Santa because of his health doesn't hold with me. I think he was healthy enough - especially with Mrs. Santa.

    They were strange - they knew the house, the play she wrote, their child going through the same-type scenario (and wasn't it at Christmas?), the fact that she was a movie reviewer, they were each others alibi, etc. Even the heart on her hand reminds me of JonBenet saying to McReynolds something like "Christmas is always in the heart..."

    Does someone remember the quote I'm talking about?
     
  19. BrotherMoon

    BrotherMoon Former Member

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    I think the special visit was a set-up by Patsy to lure JB into the basement quietly.
     
  20. kimba

    kimba Inactive

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    I am totally with Tlynn,

    McReynolds had been Santa for her for the previous 3 years, if I am not mistaken. She's 6, if she thinks Santa is going to give her a secret visit, it is him she speaks of.
     
  21. Ivy

    Ivy Inactive

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    JonBenet and Burke both still believed in Santa. JonBenet (and Burke too) knew Bill McReynolds wasn't the REAL Santa, just as I knew when I was a little kid that none of the department store Santas were the REAL Santa, and neither was my friend's dad who dressed up like Santa and rode on a float in the Christmas Parade. There was only one REAL Santa.

    I think that the "secret visit from Santa" referred to the Christmas celebration that the Ramsey family was going to have with Melinda and John Andrew in Michigan, in which Santa (the REAL Santa) was going to again arrive in his sleigh while they slept and leave gifts, just as he had on Christmas Eve in Boulder.

    John and Patsy probably both know very well that's what JonBenet was talking about when she told her friend she was expecting a secret visit from Santa...secret because he wasn't going to be visiting everyone's family twice that year, just hers....but true to their characters, the Ramseys would rather an innocent person such as Bill McReynolds be the target of unwarranted suspicion rather than explain the simple truth about the "secret visit from Santa" that JonBenet was expecting.

    imo
     

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