GUILTY FL - Calyx, 16, & Beau Schenecker, 13, shot to death, Tampa, 27 Jan 2011 #4

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In case anyone missed it here is the raw video of JS buying the gun that killed her children. First video is when she picked it up after the 3 day waiting period. It repeats from different angles then shows the video footage of the first day she chose the gun and filled out paperwork for the permit.

The day she picks up gun she has a striped shirt on. The first day she chooses the gun and fills out paperwork she is wearing a black blazer.


http://www.wtsp.com/video/3550822409001/1/Raw-video-Julie-Schenecker-buying-gun
 
I'm sure military get very good insurance so why didn't she find a new psychiatrist? she had choices.

You ALWAYS have a choice! We saw a glimpse of this doctor, he is in court on the stand, you can not assess his qualifications etc based on that, yes you get a picture, but make no mistake, this has affected him!

I think she considered him perfect...young, little if any experience with patients, easy to up meds by phone without seeing her...no follow up with missed appointments and seemed to leave her to decide about suicide. My big question here again is for PS. He is not stupid and had to see that his wife was getting worse (he wrote this) and that this "Dr" and the plan was not working. I think he should have sought other help for himself and for her. I would not hire someone in training to provide me with any professional service let alone deal with my spouse's mental health. One look at his resume in 2010 and it was clear his wife needed much more experienced help and they could afford it. I wonder what he was thinking as he watched this guy on the stand...and was that the first time he saw him in person? Could be.
Most people I know that have a spouse in therapy or with serious medical issues (this was) want to meet the person treating their spouse. This can be accomplished easily without violating hippa.
I don't know if defense will go there with PS but I would love to hear his side of this...so far I have heard nothing from him other than she was at her worst but he took her word for being okay with him gone for 2 weeks. I think we all need to hear the story completely from his side but don't know if we will.

PS did try, JS did not cooperate at all, in any fashion. The doc did what was reasonable, I have seen a lot of talk, sort of condemnation for the doc only seeing her for 20 minutes at a time, this is the standard of care! He is a Psychaitrist, not a therapist, they don't do lengthy counsel. He did deny her the oxycodone script she asked for, this is huge to me, and is standard care, shows he is responsible. This treatment he provided was not skimping, this is not out of the ordinary. JS was not his only patient, he is seeing, I would guess 3-4 patients per hour at least 7, 8, maybe even 10 hours a day every single day, plus phone follow ups, etc! In all seriousness, do you really think he has the time, reason, (whatever motivation you want to insert here) to chase her down to make sure she is taking her drugs and not drinking, and if he is doing that with one patient, shouldn't he be doing that with all of them, and how would that even be possible?
Patients like this seeing their doc once a week (as he said at one point), hell, even once a month is a LOT. He had hundreds of other patients as well to think about. JS was not his sole concern. I know this sounds callous, but this was HER decision, non compliance with advice, meds, follow up etc. Also, most definitely not PS fault, blaming him for this is a travesty!

I can't even imagine mother's day for someone like her...but then again doubt she is even aware of it. I would like to know what kind of relationship she had with her mother and what the family was like back in Iowa....so many questions for me as to how someone gets where she is. I don't think she has any emotions at all ...I see a shell sitting there.

She is aware, seriously, you think she is not aware of Mother's Day? She manipulated, lied, murdered, the list is endless, she is sitting there of her own accord. She certainly showed she was not an empty shell sitting here when she yelled at the doctor, she knows everything going on, make no mistake about it. She said to Parker "I guess I stomped your heart flat, huh?" A shell of a woman does not say that.
 
You ALWAYS have a choice! We saw a glimpse of this doctor, he is in court on the stand, you can not assess his qualifications etc based on that, yes you get a picture, but make no mistake, this has affected him!



PS did try, JS did not cooperate at all, in any fashion. The doc did what was reasonable, I have seen a lot of talk, sort of condemnation for the doc only seeing her for 20 minutes at a time, this is the standard of care! He is a Psychaitrist, not a therapist, they don't do lengthy counsel. He did deny her the oxycodone script she asked for, this is huge to me, and is standard care, shows he is responsible. This treatment he provided was not skimping, this is not out of the ordinary. JS was not his only patient, he is seeing, I would guess 3-4 patients per hour at least 7, 8, maybe even 10 hours a day every single day, plus phone follow ups, etc! In all seriousness, do you really think he has the time, reason, (whatever motivation you want to insert here) to chase her down to make sure she is taking her drugs and not drinking, and if he is doing that with one patient, shouldn't he be doing that with all of them, and how would that even be possible?
Patients like this seeing their doc once a week (as he said at one point), hell, even once a month is a LOT. He had hundreds of other patients as well to think about. JS was not his sole concern. I know this sounds callous, but this was HER decision, non compliance with advice, meds, follow up etc. Also, most definitely not PS fault, blaming him for this is a travesty!



She is aware, seriously, you think she is not aware of Mother's Day? She manipulated, lied, murdered, the list is endless, she is sitting there of her own accord. She certainly showed she was not an empty shell sitting here when she yelled at the doctor, she knows everything going on, make no mistake about it. She said to Parker "I guess I stomped your heart flat, huh?" A shell of a woman does not say that.

Thank-you azmama. :seeya:

:goodpost:
 
The defendant is a veritable genius:

Deciding her daughter, and now her son are "mouthy", and she can't deal with them, and her husband's sudden insistence that she be responsible for her actions, and quit drinking, are too much, she:
1. Voluntarily commits herself to inpatient facilities twice
2. Plays her Doc into putting her on the "Drug of the Month", fakes the bad side effects of those meds, feigns mild to moderate suicidal ideologies and emphasizes a craving for oxy
3. Goes full bore on her alcohol consumption, wrecks her vehicle, and puts on a drunken show at a family get together to put some weight into it
4. Keeps the bottles from her old pain med prescriptions
5. Documents various obscure ideas in a journal to back up her plan
6. Becomes a master at replicating the symptoms of Tardive Dyskinesia
7. Randomly misspells words and disconnects sentences in emails on purpose
8. Forges a document from her doc stating she can have 2 drinks (and 2 pain pills?) a day
9. Tells her husband "I got this" when asked if she could handle his absence so she wouldn't have to deal with her MIL
10. Goes to a different city to buy a gun, from a store with video cameras and the standard waiting period, without a disguise, using her real ID (of course she knows the SOP, she's experienced with handguns)
11. Goes BACK to the same gun store to pick up gun and ammo, again, without a disguise
12. Shoots her son and daughter twice so it fits the whole "mouthy" issue documented in her journal, by LE and Child services, her husband and her doc
13. Puts daughter in bed, leaves son in vehicle in husband's parking spot to anger him, and covers both children with blankets just to make it more screwy
14. Reloads weapon so it looks like she is planning on killing herself
15. Is slow on the post it notes on the door for the carpool, but covers it anyway
16. Sends a veiled suicide note to family so someone will panic and call LE for "welfare check/possible Baker Act"
17. Spends the evening consuming alcohol and meds to bolster her "suicide attempt", making sure there are plenty of pill and empty alcohol bottles around
18. Finishing touch on the scene is "DNR" note
19. Makes sure there is blood on herself and pretends to be "out of it" when LE shows up
20. Being an experienced interrogator for the Military, she knows exactly how to "play" LE during her interview
21. When she knows there's audio, note taking, and/or video around, she fakes her MI and TD
22. Being argumentative with the Judge puts the icing on the cake

........and the Prosecution takes the Death penalty off the table.
 
I'm sure military get very good insurance so why didn't she find a new psychiatrist? she had choices.


She didn't really want help or wasn't able to realistically evaluate her needs IMO
 
I'm pretty much caught up on the testimony now. This is a tough case but here are my thoughts:

I don't blame the doctor at all. He can only go by what his patient reports to him and the information provided by Parker. His primary concern after the accident was the chemical dependency issues, and that was Parker's concern as well.

So she went to rehab to address it - but unfortunately they took her off her meds and didn't address her severe mental health issues. She apparently did not learn any coping strategies at rehab - so it's predictable that she's going to go downhill when she gets out. Nothing feels better - in fact it feels worse. She didn't have the kind of support she needed at home. She didn't know how to communicate her needs and the family didn't recognize how debilitating or severe her mental illness was and didn't know how to help her in the right way. They believed "where there's a will, there's a way" and essentially left it to her to figure out how to fix herself. However, they did what they thought would help.

Meanwhile Julie's thinking gets more and more distorted -- but NO ONE has any idea the extent of the distortions, at least partly because they were having their discussions and drawing conclusions without her input and in secret.

Julie feels ganged up on and thinks Parker is planning divorce behind her back - so she refuses to allow him to speak with her doctors. (Major distorted thinking).

It's a perfect storm of misperception, ignorance, distortion, and mental illness that is spiraling beyond control.

I would like to believe that if I were Parker I would not have left her alone for 10 days - but he didn't know she was suicidal at that time; she had been doing carpool and making dinner, so it seems things were an improvement from before the rehab when he wouldn't even allow her to drive. And I don't think it crossed anyone's mind that she was homicidal.

So she was feeling desperate and alone and totally unable to function. I think she felt a lot of shame; she felt like a burden and a failure as a mother and as a person. Her kids had turned against her (in her mind), and she thinks Parker's going to divorce her and take the kids, so I'm guessing that in her mind she would be all alone with her mental illness that she knew she could not manage by herself.

I also think she was extremely angry at Parker for divorcing her instead of helping her (in her mind) and she probably thought he aw turning her family against her.

With these distorted thoughts, she saw no way out. She didn't want to ruin her kids' lives any further by living with her suicide, so in her warped reality, she thought it best to take them with her and save them the pain. This is not that uncommon for mothers who are suicidal with children at home.

So she waited for Parker to leave and she bought the gun. I can't remember if the email from Dave was before or after she purchased the gun - if before, I think it pushed to the point of no return. If it was after, it would have confirmed that she had made the "right" decision.

I think when she killed the kids, it was a combination of: 1) revenge against Parker. She wanted to hurt him deeply as she believed he was hurting her. And 2) hopeless and desperate and overwhelmed with no reality testing - alone with a couple of kids she couldn't manage and who were a constant reminder of her failures and shame.

In some of her correspondence she indicates that she thought she was saving her kids from further suffering and talked of heaven. Again, that's some seriously distorted thinking but I don't think it rises to the legal definition if "insanity." Especially since she also had the motivation of hurting Parker.

She obviously planned this and took rational and deliberate steps to carry it out at a time when no one could stop her. I think she has a severe mental illness and her thinking was very distorted but I don't think it is legal insanity. I believe it should be a mitigating circumstance.
 
In addition to Dr. O, JS was doing therapy/counselling and I do hope that that therapist is also going to take the stand. The ''note'' supposedly from Dr. O (PS referred to that in his email) raises a question mark ((am thinking that had to be forged and would appreciate the comments from other WS'rs on that regard)).

Knee surgery ((if it was a replacement)) could have been really painful. That makes me question her ''craving'' for Oxy

Why wasn't the ''note'' produced in court as evidence?
 
I'm pretty much caught up on the testimony now. This is a tough case but here are my thoughts:

I don't blame the doctor at all. He can only go by what his patient reports to him and the information provided by Parker. His primary concern after the accident was the chemical dependency issues, and that was Parker's concern as well.

So she went to rehab to address it - but unfortunately they took her off her meds and didn't address her severe mental health issues. She apparently did not learn any coping strategies at rehab - so it's predictable that she's going to go downhill when she gets out. Nothing feels better - in fact it feels worse. She didn't have the kind of support she needed at home. She didn't know how to communicate her needs and the family didn't recognize how debilitating or severe her mental illness was and didn't know how to help her in the right way. They believed "where there's a will, there's a way" and essentially left it to her to figure out how to fix herself. However, they did what they thought would help.

Meanwhile Julie's thinking gets more and more distorted -- but NO ONE has any idea the extent of the distortions, at least partly because they were having their discussions and drawing conclusions without her input and in secret.

Julie feels ganged up on and thinks Parker is planning divorce behind her back - so she refuses to allow him to speak with her doctors. (Major distorted thinking).

It's a perfect storm of misperception, ignorance, distortion, and mental illness that is spiraling beyond control.

I would like to believe that if I were Parker I would not have left her alone for 10 days - but he didn't know she was suicidal at that time; she had been doing carpool and making dinner, so it seems things were an improvement from before the rehab when he wouldn't even allow her to drive. And I don't think it crossed anyone's mind that she was homicidal.

So she was feeling desperate and alone and totally unable to function. I think she felt a lot of shame; she felt like a burden and a failure as a mother and as a person. Her kids had turned against her (in her mind), and she thinks Parker's going to divorce her and take the kids, so I'm guessing that in her mind she would be all alone with her mental illness that she knew she could not manage by herself.

I also think she was extremely angry at Parker for divorcing her instead of helping her (in her mind) and she probably thought he aw turning her family against her.

With these distorted thoughts, she saw no way out. She didn't want to ruin her kids' lives any further by living with her suicide, so in her warped reality, she thought it best to take them with her and save them the pain. This is not that uncommon for mothers who are suicidal with children at home.

So she waited for Parker to leave and she bought the gun. I can't remember if the email from Dave was before or after she purchased the gun - if before, I think it pushed to the point of no return. If it was after, it would have confirmed that she had made the "right" decision.

I think when she killed the kids, it was a combination of: 1) revenge against Parker. She wanted to hurt him deeply as she believed he was hurting her. And 2) hopeless and desperate and overwhelmed with no reality testing - alone with a couple of kids she couldn't manage and who were a constant reminder of her failures and shame.

In some of her correspondence she indicates that she thought she was saving her kids from further suffering and talked of heaven. Again, that's some seriously distorted thinking but I don't think it rises to the legal definition if "insanity." Especially since she also had the motivation of hurting Parker.

She obviously planned this and took rational and deliberate steps to carry it out at a time when no one could stop her. I think she has a severe mental illness and her thinking was very distorted but I don't think it is legal insanity. I believe it should be a mitigating circumstance.

I still don't know why she was still alive after shooting the kids in the head if she really wanted to die. She saw how messy it was after she took out the kids and chickened out. She probably never intended to harm herself. It's the people that never talk about suicide that actually do it. Hers was just threats.

She could have started the engine and sat in the drivers seat with sweet Beau till she died from the fumes. Poor Beau was already deceased. Wasn't this her original plan how to kill the kids? She could have put the gun in her mouth and pulled the trigger, swallowed household cleaners, rat poison, hung herself, jump off the roof on her head, drown in the bath tub, buy cyanide pill like that guy who swallowed the pill in court after he was found guilty and died in the courtroom.

She is a COWARD!!!

She was busy writing all her stupid notes and journaling to make PS feel bad and to get even instead of offing herself. By not killing herself she would still be around to make life miserable for PS. If she killed herself it would make it too easy for PS to move on with his life perhaps find a nice sweet woman and start a new family. She is a mean vindictive hateful killer.

I'm not buying it. I'm starting to believe her suicide threats were a bunch of BS to get sympathy from everyone as a way of manipulating.
 
I still don't know why she was still alive after shooting the kids in the head if she really wanted to die. She saw how messy it was after she took out the kids and chickened out. She probably never intended to harm herself. It's the people that never talk about suicide that actually do it. Hers was just threats.

She could have started the engine and sat in the drivers seat with sweet Beau till she died from the fumes. Poor Beau was already deceased. Wasn't this her original plan how to kill the kids? She could have put the gun in her mouth and pulled the trigger, swallowed household cleaners, rat poison, hung herself, jump off the roof on her head, drown in the bath tub, buy cyanide pill like that guy who swallowed the pill in court after he was found guilty and died in the courtroom.

She is a COWARD!!!


She was busy writing all her stupid notes and journaling to make PS feel bad and to get even instead of offing herself. By not killing herself she would still be around to make life miserable for PS. If she killed herself it would make it too easy for PS to move on with his life perhaps find a nice sweet woman and start a new family. She is a mean vindictive hateful killer.

I'm not buying it. I'm starting to believe her suicide threats were a bunch of BS to get sympathy from everyone as a way of manipulating.
^
I am beginning to believe this.
 
I'm pretty much caught up on the testimony now. This is a tough case but here are my thoughts:

I don't blame the doctor at all. He can only go by what his patient reports to him and the information provided by Parker. His primary concern after the accident was the chemical dependency issues, and that was Parker's concern as well.

So she went to rehab to address it - but unfortunately they took her off her meds and didn't address her severe mental health issues. She apparently did not learn any coping strategies at rehab - so it's predictable that she's going to go downhill when she gets out. Nothing feels better - in fact it feels worse. She didn't have the kind of support she needed at home. She didn't know how to communicate her needs and the family didn't recognize how debilitating or severe her mental illness was and didn't know how to help her in the right way. They believed "where there's a will, there's a way" and essentially left it to her to figure out how to fix herself. However, they did what they thought would help.

Meanwhile Julie's thinking gets more and more distorted -- but NO ONE has any idea the extent of the distortions, at least partly because they were having their discussions and drawing conclusions without her input and in secret.

Julie feels ganged up on and thinks Parker is planning divorce behind her back - so she refuses to allow him to speak with her doctors. (Major distorted thinking).

It's a perfect storm of misperception, ignorance, distortion, and mental illness that is spiraling beyond control.

I would like to believe that if I were Parker I would not have left her alone for 10 days - but he didn't know she was suicidal at that time; she had been doing carpool and making dinner, so it seems things were an improvement from before the rehab when he wouldn't even allow her to drive. And I don't think it crossed anyone's mind that she was homicidal.

So she was feeling desperate and alone and totally unable to function. I think she felt a lot of shame; she felt like a burden and a failure as a mother and as a person. Her kids had turned against her (in her mind), and she thinks Parker's going to divorce her and take the kids, so I'm guessing that in her mind she would be all alone with her mental illness that she knew she could not manage by herself.

I also think she was extremely angry at Parker for divorcing her instead of helping her (in her mind) and she probably thought he aw turning her family against her.

With these distorted thoughts, she saw no way out. She didn't want to ruin her kids' lives any further by living with her suicide, so in her warped reality, she thought it best to take them with her and save them the pain. This is not that uncommon for mothers who are suicidal with children at home.

So she waited for Parker to leave and she bought the gun. I can't remember if the email from Dave was before or after she purchased the gun - if before, I think it pushed to the point of no return. If it was after, it would have confirmed that she had made the "right" decision.

I think when she killed the kids, it was a combination of: 1) revenge against Parker. She wanted to hurt him deeply as she believed he was hurting her. And 2) hopeless and desperate and overwhelmed with no reality testing - alone with a couple of kids she couldn't manage and who were a constant reminder of her failures and shame.

In some of her correspondence she indicates that she thought she was saving her kids from further suffering and talked of heaven. Again, that's some seriously distorted thinking but I don't think it rises to the legal definition if "insanity." Especially since she also had the motivation of hurting Parker.

She obviously planned this and took rational and deliberate steps to carry it out at a time when no one could stop her. I think she has a severe mental illness and her thinking was very distorted but I don't think it is legal insanity. I believe it should be a mitigating circumstance.

Welcome to the thread minor4th. I see you are taking a little breather from the OP trial. Glad you joined us here. Your input is appreciated.

What is your opinion of JS' defense team? I am interested.
 
I do not believe she was serious about suicide either. In my experience, the two people who I have known (neither one were people I was close too) but no one knew or suspected they would do it, ever, one had severe MI issues, probably post partum, but neither threatened, talked or otherwise, just did it. I believe for the most part the talkers are just that, talkers, looking for attention.

Her saying that she didn't want to leave the kids with a stigma of a Mother that committed suicide is ridiculous and another excuse.

As for people dealing with the MI issues, My Mom is BP and is on and off meds my whole life, including up to now. It gets old, tiring, people (family, friends) get tired of listening to it, it is exhausting, I tell her all the time "if the meds help you and you feel better, take the da*n meds", but it is a cyclical thing, she will go off of them again, will spiral down till she hits bottom then go to the doc and start over again. It is hard to tolerate when someone does not follow medical advice, you know the person is ill, but it is infuriating that they seemingly do this to THEMSELVES! I wonder if Julie's family felt this, after a while, you become numb too it! You get sick of catering to their every trouble and issue, because they don't take care of themselves. Does that make sense? Does anyone else go through that with someone that is MI that they are close too?
 
Patients like this seeing their doc once a week (as he said at one point), hell, even once a month is a LOT. He had hundreds of other patients as well to think about. JS was not his sole concern. I know this sounds callous, but this was HER decision, non compliance with advice, meds, follow up etc. Also, most definitely not PS fault, blaming him for this is a travesty!

.

The fact that she was scheduled to see her psychiatrist (and also her therapist) once a week indicates the gravity of her mental illness. Patients only get this sort of scheduling -- extensive outpatient care -- when they're one step away from hospitalization. And, according to both her doctor and her husband, JS's mental illness was getting increasingly worse. I know the doctor is busy, but when the patient you've been seeing every week for the past several months stops coming, the patient whose meds you've changed nearly every week, the patient who has talked about suicide, the patient whose husband keeps sending emails saying how bad things are getting, the patient you've considered hospitalizing...when THAT patient stops coming to appointments, that should be a huge red flag. He did call her on Jan 4, the first time she missed an appointment. He asked her about suicide AND homicide (meaning the thought HAD crossed his mind). He offered to reschedule her appointment, she says no, so he just drops it. Busy or not, he made a serious error in judgement.

As did PS. And, don't get me wrong -- I'm not blaming Parker for the death of his children. Their murder rests squarely on the shoulders of their mother. And PS really did try, over and over again, to get more help from the doc. But at the end of the day, PS left his children in the hands of a woman he knew was doing poorly with managing her own medical care, who was a closet alcoholic, who had suicidal thoughts, who was in a combative relationship with his daughter, and, more recently, his son, who had recently had a car accident (most likely due to DUI), whose kids were afraid to go anywhere with her in the car, who was spending most of the day in bed.
 
I do not believe she was serious about suicide either. In my experience, the two people who I have known (neither one were people I was close too) but no one knew or suspected they would do it, ever, one had severe MI issues, probably post partum, but neither threatened, talked or otherwise, just did it. I believe for the most part the talkers are just that, talkers, looking for attention.

Her saying that she didn't want to leave the kids with a stigma of a Mother that committed suicide is ridiculous and another excuse.

As for people dealing with the MI issues, My Mom is BP and is on and off meds my whole life, including up to now. It gets old, tiring, people (family, friends) get tired of listening to it, it is exhausting, I tell her all the time "if the meds help you and you feel better, take the da*n meds", but it is a cyclical thing, she will go off of them again, will spiral down till she hits bottom then go to the doc and start over again. It is hard to tolerate when someone does not follow medical advice, you know the person is ill, but it is infuriating that they seemingly do this to THEMSELVES! I wonder if Julie's family felt this, after a while, you become numb too it! You get sick of catering to their every trouble and issue, because they don't take care of themselves. Does that make sense? Does anyone else go through that with someone that is MI that they are close too?


Yes, I know how you feel my 31 year old son is bi-polar & schizoaffective disorder. I've been going through this living he** for 11 years. I won't get started but let's just say it has been horrible. He's is chronic with extreme paranoia, delusions, voices the whole nine yards. Even when he get his anti psychotic injection the voices he hears don't go away. It just makes him sleepy. My family and I will be going through this forever. It is so tiring and makes me depressed.

He graduated HS with 4.0 GPA, was very athletic, popular, had many friends, he excelled in all sports mainly, snow-board, skateboard, and college wake-boarding team, football. He went off to college ended up dropping out because of manic episodes, mood swings, depression, he became a loner. It is extremely sad. We've been through NAMI classes, support groups, church you name it.
 
As for people dealing with the MI issues, My Mom is BP and is on and off meds my whole life, including up to now. It gets old, tiring, people (family, friends) get tired of listening to it, it is exhausting, I tell her all the time "if the meds help you and you feel better, take the da*n meds", but it is a cyclical thing, she will go off of them again, will spiral down till she hits bottom then go to the doc and start over again. It is hard to tolerate when someone does not follow medical advice, you know the person is ill, but it is infuriating that they seemingly do this to THEMSELVES! I wonder if Julie's family felt this, after a while, you become numb too it! You get sick of catering to their every trouble and issue, because they don't take care of themselves. Does that make sense? Does anyone else go through that with someone that is MI that they are close too?

I think the issue with mental health patients and NOT taking their meds is that they don't always feel better when on the meds, if it's not the right med or combo of meds. Or they don't like the side effects of the meds. My son has been on a number of the same meds that Julie was on (he has Epilepsy, and many of the same drugs -- Lamictal, drugs in the benzodiazapine family, etc. are used to treat both seizure disorder as well as bipolar and other mental illness). These meds are Hell. They've caused serious cognitive disfunction, memory loss, speech dysfunction, hair loss, weight gain/weight loss -- they've damaged his liver, damaged his kidneys, damaged his bone marrow, damaged his bone density. They've given him hand tremors, and at one point he even stopped walking temporarily. They've completely changed his personality, and some of them made him violent -- to the point that my arms were covered with bruises and my hands bleeding from scratch-marks. He would attack me in the middle of the night. He began self-harming after being put on Diazepam -- banging his head on the wall, and sticking his fingers in the fan and laughing as he did it. And, most damnable of all, is that these horrible drugs did little, if anything, to stop the damned seizures. We were dealing with all the crap from the drugs, plus having multiple grand mal (tonic clonic) seizures a day. And we began to wonder...which is worse -- the disease or the "cure?"

Believe me, I totally get it when mentally ill people go off their meds. Or feel helpless, or hopeless.
 
Welcome to the thread minor4th. I see you are taking a little breather from the OP trial. Glad you joined us here. Your input is appreciated.

What is your opinion of JS' defense team? I am interested.

TBH I'm not totally bowled over by either team. My guess is that it's just a difficult case for both sides and they all feel some ambivalence about that they're doing.
 
I think the issue with mental health patients and NOT taking their meds is that they don't always feel better when on the meds, if it's not the right med or combo of meds. Or they don't like the side effects of the meds. My son has been on a number of the same meds that Julie was on (he has Epilepsy, and many of the same drugs -- Lamictal, drugs in the benzodiazapine family, etc. are used to treat both seizure disorder as well as bipolar and other mental illness). These meds are Hell. They've caused serious cognitive disfunction, memory loss, speech dysfunction, hair loss, weight gain/weight loss -- they've damaged his liver, damaged his kidneys, damaged his bone marrow, damaged his bone density. They've given him hand tremors, and at one point he even stopped walking temporarily. They've completely changed his personality, and some of them made him violent -- to the point that my arms were covered with bruises and my hands bleeding from scratch-marks. He would attack me in the middle of the night. He began self-harming after being put on Diazepam -- banging his head on the wall, and sticking his fingers in the fan and laughing as he did it. And, most damnable of all, is that these horrible drugs did little, if anything, to stop the damned seizures. We were dealing with all the crap from the drugs, plus having multiple grand mal (tonic clonic) seizures a day. And we began to wonder...which is worse -- the disease or the "cure?"



Believe me, I totally get it when mentally ill people go off their meds. Or feel helpless, or hopeless.


I'm so sorry to hear this Abigail. It is awful meds cause so many side effects. My son has experienced so many just like your son. Damned if you do and damned if you don't.

At least our Sons haven't murdered anyone.
 
I definitely think she was planning to kill herself - she had no thought that she would go to jail because she thought she'd be dead. But she messed up her own suicide.
 
TBH I'm not totally bowled over by either team. My guess is that it's just a difficult case for both sides and they all feel some ambivalence about that they're doing.

I think her attys will be glad when they are rid of her. I suspect she is a handful.
 
I think her attys will be glad when they are rid of her. I suspect she is a handful.

I'm sure she is very difficult, and I feel sorry for her attorneys.

Are these public defenders or privately hired?
 
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