FL - Dawn Brancheau, Female Trainer Killed at Shamu Stadium

jon_burrows

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For those who have not seen this... it's a must watch.
Set those DVR's people.

Some parts I had to watch with my eyes closed. But it scratches the surface of what the book Death at SeaWorld covers.

I will be the first to admit, I HAD NO CLUE!

I read the book 'Death at Seaworld' a while ago, I'm re-reading it now. Excellent book! It's hard to believe the cruelty was kept a secret for so long. Hopefully things will change.

______________________________________________

Re-posting the times for Blackfish:

It will air again this Saturday and very early Sunday morning on CNN.

7 & 9 PM EST Saturday
12 & 3 AM EST Sunday

http://www.cnn.com/CNN/Programs/saturday.html
 

Nova

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So very sad. Another day in the life of an orca at SeaWorld. I think the video is titled incorrectly, it is not a tantrum….

I agree that ascribing a human behavior such as "tantrum" to an orca is problematic. But it is interesting that the public was kept out of the area as long as the orca was thrashing on the shelf.

Do you have an opinion as to what was happening? (I admit I don't.)
 

Kimberlyd125

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Nova

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For those who have not seen this... it's a must watch.
Set those DVR's people.

Some parts I had to watch with my eyes closed. But it scratches the surface of what the book Death at SeaWorld covers.

I will be the first to admit, I HAD NO CLUE!

Nor did I. Now I have nightmares from the scene where the orca mother screams all night for the child they have stolen from her. (I debated with myself and decided to use "child" rather than "calf". I think we devalue the connections these intelligent animals have by using cow names for them.)
 

Hope32

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I do not have CNN but I did find a website that has the whole documentry that i watched..
http://viooz.co/movies/21942-blackfish-2013.html

It can be hard to find the information on the things that really happen in seaworld and other marine parks as they cover a lot of it up and you never get the full story. Blackfish does have videos of the Ken Peter attack, and some of the Dawn attack. I felt bad for the trainers because once they realized what was happening they stayed because they felt that they were the only ones to help anyway and if they left what would happen to the others...

The orcaproject website is very helpful. I shows that there is a lot of inbreeding going on at seaworld and that Tilikum is blood relative to 45 (?) other orcas in their system. He is pretty much a sperm bank. THere is video of him for 3 hours just floating at the top of his holding tank and he never moves.. He is clearly frustrated and they explain that the animals know when the food is getting low as they can hear the ice and the amount they get for tricks gets lower... so he was not be rewarded to do some of the actions and this is one of the few times he gets to be active IMO and he just didn't want to do it that day.. I think some of the trainers stay because they feel they are the only ones that can help the animals and don't know how to do it legally and without getting in trouble by many organizations.

I think some animals are better in captivity in situations where their habitats are being threatened and they are almost extinct. The larger the animal I feel the less appropriate they are for captivity. I see the need for research in captivity for intelligence type testing and such to help reproduce and increase populations.. Whales need to be out in the open as I have heard that they are actually more emotionally developed in the brain then humans.. It like they are keeping a human in a cell to perform on command... Like dolphins are the same way super intelligent and smart...
 

Kimberlyd125

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Nor did I. Now I have nightmares from the scene where the orca mother screams all night for the child they have stolen from her. (I debated with myself and decided to use "child" rather than "calf". I think we devalue the connections these intelligent animals have by using cow names for them.)

That was the hardest part for me too.
So sad.
 

Hope32

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There are movement's for other whales like Morgan..
There is a freetilly website to free tilikium.
There is also free Lolita (sp?)
The traniers say to free them into a bay area that is blocked off from the ocean, but still they aren't in the wild all the way. I think that would be the best thing for these animals. An open water "cell" but much much larger and they can provide nutrition supplemented with the fish that naturally come into the bay as such... They need room and not 4 walls like a psych facility..
 

Herding Cats

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[video=youtube;wGxMLiL1uZI]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wGxMLiL1uZI[/video]

The above is what I have just started watching - "Lolita, Slave to Entertainment" I think.

Best-
Herding Cats

ETA: OK, this is a hard vid to watch. Very difficult.
 

Sheromom

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Too difficult for me; I live on an island in Puget Sound. :-( And I have seen them dance.

ETA: I have lived here for 57 years and there have been NO cases of deaths from these lovely orcas. Not among all the boating and tubing and water skiing accidents. None.
 

Nova

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...The above is what I have just started watching - "Lolita, Slave to Entertainment" I think.

Best-
Herding Cats

ETA: OK, this is a hard vid to watch. Very difficult.

How heartbreaking! Twice yearly trips to the Miami Seaquarium were a big part of my growing up in South Florida.

It was with great trepidation that I google Lolita to learn her fate since that doc was filmed 10-15 years ago.

**SPOILER ALERT**
Much to my surprise I discovered that Lolita is still alive. Sadly, she is apparently still in her undersized tank.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/steph...y-life-at-the-miami-seaquarium_b_3424457.html
 

Kimberlyd125

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How heartbreaking! Twice yearly trips to the Miami Seaquarium were a big part of my growing up in South Florida.

It was with great trepidation that I google Lolita to learn her fate since that doc was filmed 10-15 years ago.

**SPOILER ALERT**
Much to my surprise I discovered that Lolita is still alive. Sadly, she is apparently still in her undersized tank.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/steph...y-life-at-the-miami-seaquarium_b_3424457.html

Yes she is. And they have found her family.
They think she could be released and be accepted back into her original pod. Her mother is still alive. They think Lolita still speaks the same "language" as the pod.
And since we was 6 years old when captured, she learned skills she will need in the wild then. Orcas have great memories so the theory is, she could rejoin the pod, be with her family, and they would remember her and she would remember them.

Lolita is a great candidate for release.

But $$$$$ talks. Although the owners at Miami Sealand have been offered $1,000,000.00 but refused it.
 

Nova

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Just FYI, it's the Miami Seaquarium. "Sealand" was the park in Victoria, B.C. where Tillikum was first kept; it was closed after Tilli's first attack on a trainer and the whales were sold to Sea World. (BTW, the now-closed Ocean World that is mentioned several times in the LOLITA doc was in Fort Lauderdale, about 45 minutes north of the Seaquarium. That's my hometown and I spent countless hours at both parks as a kid.)

If I understood correctly, not only is Lolita's mother still alive, her GRANDMOTHER is still alive at 90! The Sea World claim that orcas live longer in captivity is a flat out lie.

(Kimberly, though $1 million sounds like a lot for an aging whale, the Miami Seaquarium remains basically unchanged since I was a kid nearly 60 years ago. Lolita is the "face" of Sea World and freeing her might be tantamount to dooming the entire park. (Not that that would be a bad thing.) Of course, the buyer's point was that Lolita has already lived longer than any captive orca, so one may assume its only a matter of time until the Seaquarium loses its "icon" anyway.)
 

jon_burrows

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I agree that ascribing a human behavior such as "tantrum" to an orca is problematic. But it is interesting that the public was kept out of the area as long as the orca was thrashing on the shelf.

Do you have an opinion as to what was happening? (I admit I don't.)

I don't know what's happening either. The orca looks in distress. It's very sad to see.
 

jon_burrows

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http://articles.orlandosentinel.com...s-georgia-aquarium-seaworld-entertainment-inc

Wild killer whales captured in Russia for overseas marine parks, activists say

Seven wild killer whales have been captured off the eastern coast of Russia in recent months, according to a conservation group, in what activists say appears to be an effort to stock some overseas marine parks.

There is a possible SeaWorld connection. It's rumored that two of the captured orcas are slated to go to China.

“Expect SeaWorld to open its first-ever theme park outside the U.S. within the next three years with China being target No. 1 for them — something that had been hinted at by SeaWorld during its IPO road show and which attracted Asian individual investors to the offering,”

Perhaps it's a coincidence but I have my doubts considering SeaWorld's history.

http://www.bizjournals.com/orlando/...seaworlds-new-antarctica-area-a.html?page=all

SeaWord's history of buying and moving cetaceans outside the US:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=D3fZ2dMdtu8#t=1622
 

Nova

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I don't know what's happening either. The orca looks in distress. It's very sad to see.

I agree. And as I said above, the fact that they were actively barring patrons from the area suggests the orca was acting out in some way. (Not blaming the orca.)
 

jon_burrows

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Russia captured 18 beluga whales between 2006 and 2011. Thankfully the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration's (NOAA) denied Georgia Aquarium's request to import them to the US.

"The Georgia Aquarium wanted to feature the white whales from Russia at its own marine park in Atlanta and at partner facilities, including SeaWorld's various locations."

The aquarium is appealing.

SeaWorld is lying when they say they aren't in the capture business anymore. If they get their way these beautiful creatures will end up like this:

[video=youtube;YJ5zqR704Nc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YJ5zqR704Nc[/video]
 

Kimberlyd125

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Just FYI, it's the Miami Seaquarium. "Sealand" was the park in Victoria, B.C. where Tillikum was first kept; it was closed after Tilli's first attack on a trainer and the whales were sold to Sea World. (BTW, the now-closed Ocean World that is mentioned several times in the LOLITA doc was in Fort Lauderdale, about 45 minutes north of the Seaquarium. That's my hometown and I spent countless hours at both parks as a kid.)

If I understood correctly, not only is Lolita's mother still alive, her GRANDMOTHER is still alive at 90! The Sea World claim that orcas live longer in captivity is a flat out lie.

(Kimberly, though $1 million sounds like a lot for an aging whale, the Miami Seaquarium remains basically unchanged since I was a kid nearly 60 years ago. Lolita is the "face" of Sea World and freeing her might be tantamount to dooming the entire park. (Not that that would be a bad thing.) Of course, the buyer's point was that Lolita has already lived longer than any captive orca, so one may assume its only a matter of time until the Seaquarium loses its "icon" anyway.)

I misspoke and used the wrong name. I meant Miami Seaquarium.
But LOL you did it too.
We can't get right NOVA.
Lolita is not the face of Sea World
:)

We both know what we mean.

I think you are right. I think her grandmother is still alive and doing well. The matriarch.
Sea Worlds claim is bogus. Feeding everyone a line of BS for sure. Trying to save face.

BTW, Lolita's insurance policy is a million. So they will get their money sooner or later. They don't care that she's miserable.
 

Nova

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You are so right, Kim, I did screw up. To review:

Sealand = Victoria, BC (closed in early 90s, I believe)
Loro Parques = Tenerife, Canary Islands
Ocean World = Ft. Lauderdale, FL (my "hometown" park, now closed)
Miami Seaquarium = Miami (home of Lolita)
Sea World = San Diego, San Antonio (IIRC), Orlando (China TBA)

There was also:

Marineland = Los Angeles (closed in late 80s/early 90s; animals bought by Sea World)

IIRC (and I may not because I'm juggling a lot of parks now), Tillikum is now used largely for breeding at Sea World Orlando.

***

Did you watch the LOLITA doc? What was most interesting was the interview with the magazine owner who came up with $1 million offer for Lolita. He said that the owner of the park has a bigger picture of himself with the orca than with his own family. And the mag owner realized that the Seaquarium owner DOES love Lolita, he's just convinced himself that she is better off in his park.

If Lolita were a person, we would call that possessiveness, not "love".
 

Kimberlyd125

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On Tuesday, November 12, 2013 SeaWorld takes its case to Washington D.C. as they continue the appellate process in an attempt to overturn citations issued by the Occupational Health and Safety Administration (OSHA) following the death of killer whale trainer Dawn Brancheau in 2010.

http://theorcaproject.wordpress.com/

BBM
 

Kimberlyd125

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http://www.cnn.com/2013/11/12/us/seaworld-court-challenge/

SeaWorld challenges ban limiting interaction between whale and trainer

No stranger to performances, SeaWorld must put on a very different kind of show Tuesday in what could be a make-or-break day for the aquatic entertainment giant.

SeaWorld Orlando is asking a panel of three judges on a federal appeals court to overturn safety citations and a ban instituted by the Occupational Safety and Health Administration restricting how humans interact with killer whales during performances.




The hearing will be held at Georgetown University. Eugene Scalia, son of Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia and former solicitor of the Department of Labor, will handle SeaWorld's appeal. Amy Tryon will argue on behalf of the Department of Labor.

A decision is not immediately expected.
 
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