FL Teens filmed, mocked drowning man, Cocoa police say

[MIKAYOYO]

Whilst on the subject of sociopaths......I am absolutely convinced that pesticides is the cause of so many people being born sociopathic.....and even psychopathic. I am convinced of this.
OT I know but had could not resist the opportunity to say this. I would say a bit more about this but I don't want a mod to remove this....!

Take it to politivent. I'm curious.

 

[Laughing]

Wouldn't a misdemeanor conviction support a wrongful death suit?

If Cubby is right, those humans observing his distress should have helped!!! Call 911 instead of using that phone to take video.

 

[Cubby]

They were high. It's no excuse, but teens hanging around and smoking weed aren't going to be calling 911.

I can't find a link, but it was reported on TV that surveillance exists showing Jamal freely entering the water. I don't see how any wrongful death lawsuit would be succesful.

 

[swooooooooo]

They were high. It's no excuse, but teens hanging around and smoking weed aren't going to be calling 911.

I can't find a link, but it was reported on TV that surveillance exists showing Jamal freely entering the water. I don't see how any wrongful death lawsuit would be succesful.

Don't blame the weed. High or not, if that were my friends and I smoking a blunt we would still at least call 911 or try and help. I think any reasonable people would. Weed doesn't impair you to the point of not being knowing to call 911 if someone is dying. It doesn't impair your ability to swim either.

 

[jjenny]

Don't blame the weed. High or not, if that were my friends and I smoking a blunt we would still at least call 911 or try and help. I think any reasonable people would. Weed doesn't impair you to the point of not being knowing to call 911 if someone is dying. It doesn't impair your ability to swim either.

If you are going to try to save a drowning man he could easily pull you down with him.
You are not obligated to risk your life to save someone.
Obviously they could have called 911, but I don't think one should be required to risk their life to save someone else (which you seem to be suggesting).

 

[lonetraveler]

The only hope left for these heartless callous teenagers is that their parents make them see the error of their ways. Otherwise this world is going to have these people living amongst us for many years to come.

I'm of the opinion that the parents have already had their chance and that it hasn't worked. These little monsters need a stronger hand IMO. They need a wake up call by the judicial system.

 

[msrica97201]

This really touches home for me. My cousin drowned in a lake in Texas in 1993 I think. People came to help him but he apparently thought they were trying to push him under and fought everyone off. Unfortunately the outcome ended in his death.


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[jjenny]

This really touches home for me. My cousin drowned in a lake in Texas in 1993 I think. People came to help him but he apparently thought they were trying to push him under and fought everyone off. Unfortunately the outcome ended in his death.


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Drowning persons often panic. Which makes rescues dangerous, unless rescuers know what they are doing.

 

[swooooooooo]

If you are going to try to save a drowning man he could easily pull you down with him.
You are not obligated to risk your life to save someone.
Obviously they could have called 911, but I don't think one should be required to risk their life to save someone else (which you seem to be suggesting).

I said at least call 911. They aren't obligated to risk their life to try and save him. Also I think if multiple people tried to save him he wouldn't be able to drag 3 or 4 people down with him.

 

[lonetraveler]

Whilst on the subject of sociopaths......I am absolutely convinced that pesticides is the cause of so many people being born sociopathic.....and even psychopathic. I am convinced of this.
OT I know but had could not resist the opportunity to say this. I would say a bit more about this but I don't want a mod to remove this....!

I grew up with pesticides which had no repercussions about environmental impact nor any considerations about the impact on humans. Today there are many laws and regulations regarding the impact of pesticides on humans. These teenagers have absolutely no excuse other than their own psychopathy. IMO

 

[lonetraveler]

I said at least call 911. They aren't obligated to risk their life to try and save him. Also I think if multiple people tried to save him he wouldn't be able to drag 3 or 4 people down with him.

You are absolutely correct. All it would take is one who knew how to pull him to safety or two to swim out and take him to shore. This is totally disgusting and totally not excusable.

 

[lonetraveler]

Drowning persons often panic. Which makes rescues dangerous, unless rescuers know what they are doing.

Do you really think that this group of teenagers did not rescue him because they thought their lives would be in danger?

 

[mrsselig]

These teens were making fun of him. They didn't have to jump in and risk their own (pathetic) lives to save his.....all they needed to do was to call 911. They filmed him, and verbally taunted him. It doesn't matter if he went in on his own volition or if his intent was (possibly) suicide. He was crying for help, actively drowning. They watched him struggle, taunted, laughed, filmed him, and said "he dead" once it was clear he didn't make it. They all need to go to prison. It makes me sick to think of how these lowlifes will infect their community if they remain free. What if it was YOUR loved one in that pond?

 

[Cubby]

Don't blame the weed. High or not, if that were my friends and I smoking a blunt we would still at least call 911 or try and help. I think any reasonable people would. Weed doesn't impair you to the point of not being knowing to call 911 if someone is dying. It doesn't impair your ability to swim either.

I'm not blaming the weed. They could have been drunk..... Impaired teens first priority is going to be not getting busted.

What if the man was dead set on killing himself and chose to pull anyone trying to help him under? This wasn't someone who accidentally fell into a body of water. This was a disabled man who walked directly into a retention pond while the teens were on the other side of the pond. And entered the water immediately following an argument with his fiance.

While I despise the teens mocking behavior, I can understand why they didn't jump in after him. The courts will sort out the repercussions for not reporting a death.

 

[jjenny]

Do you really think that this group of teenagers did not rescue him because they thought their lives would be in danger?

I am not claiming that at all. But there are no laws requiring that you have to save someone-notice they are charged with not reporting death.

 

[jjenny]

You are absolutely correct. All it would take is one who knew how to pull him to safety or two to swim out and take him to shore. This is totally disgusting and totally not excusable.

That's not really accurate. Especially if supposed rescuers are impaired on some substance.
"Swimming to rescue someone drowning should be the last resort, it require swimming skills and a lot of training before doing it. This is because a drowning person is violent and may pose danger to the rescuer. They may try to climb on the rescuer to be able to breathe, which may cause him to drown too. "

https://www.swimmersdaily.com/2014/...guide-on-how-to-save-someone-who-is-drowning/

 

[katydid23]

I dont blame anyone for not jumping in. But they could have been sympathetic, tried to talk to him to help him figure out how to escape, WHILE ALSO CALLING 911.

There is no excuse for mocking him and laughing as he died. That is disgusting and I wish they could be charged for being so hateful.

 

[MsMarple]

I dont blame anyone for not jumping in. But they could have been sympathetic, tried to talk to him to help him figure out how to escape, WHILE ALSO CALLING 911.

There is no excuse for mocking him and laughing as he died. That is disgusting and I wish they could be charged for being so hateful.

Yes! Forgetting the video, the mocking, the possible fear of getting hurt in trying to save the man, to me the real issue is that a call to 911 would have brought help and maybe the man wouldn't have died.

Unfortunately there don't seem to be any Florida laws regarding doing nothing when another person needs medical attention. Well, at least in this case; plenty of parents and caregivers have been charged for failing to provide medical attention to injured children. I think the distinction lies in the responsibility a caregiver has to insure the well being of his/her charge versus acting on behalf of a stranger.

So what does that leave? I guess the misdemeanor charges brought against these teens. However, under civil law (versus criminal law) there's more leeway in proving culpable negligence - in theory anyway.

An argument could be made that the teens diregarded the safety of the drowning man by not calling 911. IOW, did they fail to act in a reasonable way? IMO, making a video and sharing it online is evidence of reckless disregard. But then I'm not a lawyer.

CULPABLE NEGLIGENCE VS. CIVIL NEGLIGENCE
Culpable negligence differs from conventional negligence (as used in Florida civil cases) in the degree of disregard a person must exhibit for the safety, rights, or welfare of others. In the civil context, negligence is established merely by showing a breach of duty to exercise reasonable care on behalf of others. If a person fails to act reasonably in regard to a duty they have towards others, then civil liability may be imposed.

With culpable negligence, the accused must not only act unreasonably with respect to his or her duty, but he or she must also exhibit gross recklessness, or wanton disregard for others.

http://www.husseinandwebber.com/crimes/violent-crimes/culpable-negligence/

I understand that bringing a lawsuit is problematic but IMO the man's family might be found to have standing and if so then they may prevail. Unfortunately, the teens are likely judgment proof so a lawsuit would only be helpful in terms of bringing the lack of law for this kind of incident to the public's attention. Laws don't change until someone challenges them.

I guess what I'm saying is that IMO I believe the teens should have called for help and furthermore there should be punishment under criminal law that demands that a person has a responsibility to act in a reasonable way when they see a person in need of help.

It doesn't require special training or expertise. All it requires is that when a person recognizes that someone is in danger they should call 911. Not rocket science. Have we, as a society, gotten so dumbed down that we don't expect our fellow humans to act in a reasonable way?

 

[MIKAYOYO]

This is disgusting and there are no excuses! Call 911 FFS.

 

[Snoopster]

what the heck???? How can anyone support these kids? Do I expect them to behave in a mature way and find a creative way to rescue him? No. Do I expect them to jump in the water? No. But then again I give them little slack if they don't try to seek help for the man. And mocking and filming him? Well that's over the top. I would be disgusted with my kids if they acted that way.

Sorry Cubby, but I just can't agree with you.