Flight 253 - Cover up?

Discussion in 'Up to the Minute' started by brad, Dec 31, 2009.

  1. brad

    brad The Prez - Arithmomaniac

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    Kurt Haskell recounts his story of the events following the flight on Christmas Day.

    http://www.mlive.com/news/detroit/index.ssf/2009/12/flight_253_passenger_kurt_hask.html

    "Today is the second worst day of my life after 12-25-09. Today is the day that I realized that my own country is lying to me and all of my fellow Americans. Let me explain.
    Ever since I got off of Flight 253 I have been repeating what I saw in US Customs. Specifically, 1 hour after we left the plane, bomb sniffing dogs arrived. Up to this point, all of the passengers on Flight 253 stood in a small area in an evacuated luggage claim area of an airport terminal. During this time period, all of the passengers had their carry on bags with them. When the bomb sniffing dogs arrived, 1 dog found something in a carry on bag of a 30 ish Indian man. This is not the so called "Sharp Dressed" man. I will refer to this man as "The man in orange". The man in orange, who stood some 20ft away from me the entire time until he was taken away, was immediately taken away to be searched and interrogated in a nearby room. At this time he was not handcuffed. When he emerged from the room, he was then handcuffed and taken away. At this time an FBI agent came up to the rest of the passengers and said the following (approximate quote) "You all are being moved to another area because this area is not safe. I am sure many of you saw what just happened (Referring to the man in orange) and are smart enough to read between the lines and figure it out." We were then marched out of the baggage claim area and into a long hallway. This entire time period and until we left customs, no person that wasn't a law enforcement personnel or a passenger on our flight was allowed anywhere on our floor of the terminal (or possibly the entire terminal) The FBI was so concerned during this time, that we were not allowed to use the bathroom unless we went alone with an FBI agent, we were not allowed to eat or drink, or text or call anyone. I have been repeating this same story over the last 5 days. The FBI has, since we landed, insisted that only one man was arrested for the airliner attack (contradicting my account). However, several of my fellow passengers have come over the past few days, backed up my claim, and put pressure on FBI/Customs to tell the truth. Early today, I heard from two different reporters that a federal agency (FBI or Customs) was now admitting that another man has been held (and will be held indefinitely) since our flight landed for "immigration reasons." Notice that this man was "being held" and not "arrested", which was a cute semantic ploy by the FBI to stretch the truth and not lie.


    much more at link
     
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  3. LoveMyDogs

    LoveMyDogs New Member

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    Very interesting. Thank you for posting this.
     
  4. hockeymom

    hockeymom New Member

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    Wow! Its scary.
     
  5. Monaco

    Monaco Argentine Tennis Players

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    I wonder if Haskell is the same guy who was interviewed by a local talk show in LA, where he said he and his wife noticed the panty bomber with the "sharp dressed guy," who was speaking up for PB and eventually was allowed to talk to a supervisor, even tho PB didnt have a passport? I'm pretty sure he said the guy didnt have a passport ... maybe he said "visa." I'll check to see if that phone interview is saved on the radio show website.

    p.s. thx for the link ... there's a lot of info there to digest ... as we saw at the Texas Army base, political correctness can kill! :(
     
  6. passionflower

    passionflower Just 1 tip to find a killer

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    Thanks for the story.
    I can't get over the warnings BEFORE the flight from his own father!
    Yet no air marshalls on board, etc.
    Thank GOD that all of you are ok.
    Cover up??...........you bet!!!
     
  7. Cypros

    Cypros New Member

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    I am nor sure what Mr. Haskell is griping about. If he ever watches any law-related tv shows, or paid attention to crime stories (or read here at WS!) he would know that "arrest" has a specific definition and that LE chooses its words carefully when reporting on ongoing investigations in order to maintain some control and to prevent key information from disseminating to the public and criminals. There is no conspiracy here -- just a typical investigation. If they caught a second potential bomber Mr. Haskell should be applauding and not trying to stir up allegations of a conspiracy. His confusion is due to his own lack of awareness.
     
  8. poco

    poco A cat will blink when struck with a hammer.

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  9. essies

    essies "We're all just walking each other home." Ram Dass

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    Kurt Haskell on FoxNews.
    [video=youtube;w8y1eGZzT2E]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w8y1eGZzT2E[/video]
     
  10. jjenny

    jjenny Well-Known Member

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    So, Mr. Haskell says the alleged terrorist had no passport? Why wouldn't the alleged terrorist have a passport? Supposedly he had a visa to US to visit as many times as he wanted. It also has been reported he had visited US in 2008.
    So, I am not sure how all of it adds up.
     
  11. jjenny

    jjenny Well-Known Member

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    Mr. Haskell said the alleged terrorist didn't have a passport. Well, it has been reported that alleged terrorist has been in US before, as recently as 2008, so how would it be possible for him not to have a passport and visit US several times?
     
  12. hockeymom

    hockeymom New Member

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    Maybe he meant a visa? Who knows. I think this Haskell guy might be legit,but i sure would like to hear from the other people on the plane who supposedly are saying something similar. Is it possable the government is holding back as to not panic the public. Why hold back from the people who plotted the thing? They know who they had on the plane.
     
  13. Liz

    Liz I am not a chemist and this is not my 1st rodeo

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    Official reverses, confirms 2nd arrest from Flight 253
    Couple on 253 did see 2nd man in cuffs, customs officer says


    Detroit -- A U.S. Customs official reversed himself Friday, admitting a passenger from Northwest Flight 253 was placed in handcuffs, searched and released after a security dog alerted officers to the passenger's carry-on luggage.

    Ronald G. Smith, chief U.S. Customs and Border Protection officer in the Detroit area, sent an e-mail to The Detroit News late Thursday apologizing that the information on the passenger -- which was made public by a pair of Taylor attorneys, Kurt and Lori Haskell, who were passengers on the flight -- was not officially announced earlier.

    More at link:
    http://www.detnews.com/article/2010...reverses--confirms-2nd-arrest-from-Flight-253
     
  14. hockeymom

    hockeymom New Member

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    Mr. Smith has changed his story 5 times now. Makes you wonder if this is even the truth. It does confirm the Haskell's story however,so who was the sharp dressed man in Amsterdam helping the young terrorist?
     
  15. jjenny

    jjenny Well-Known Member

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    Since the young man had both passport and visa, why would anyone trying to help him claim he had no passport?
    He is also not Sudanese, he is Nigerian.
    So it doesn't add up.
     
  16. mom_of_five

    mom_of_five New Member

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    Maybe my morning coffee hasn't kicked in just yet (even though it's 5pm), but why is this even an issue? As another poster astutely pointed out, LE (on all levels) has procedural guidelines to follow. They cannot just pronounce someone has been arrested when, in fact, an investigation is still ongoing and the person has not been arrested at that particular time (civil rights and all). Let's assume said "man in orange" was immediately arrested and his personal information released to the world...and LE discovers later on that they did not investigate thoroughly before they announced his arrest. Then they are accused of racial profiling and ruining the reputation of an innocent man. How does LE and/or Department of Homeland Security win in this day and age? We demand they protect us at almost any cost, but we gripe when they do their jobs (if it isn't a 'cover-up', it's an 'invasion of privacy', etc). If 'invading my privacy' a bit keeps hundreds, thousands, or millions of people from being senselessly slaughtered, why on earth would I have a problem with that (unless I have something to hide)?! These terrorists are using our own arrogance and self-righteousness against us.

    In the interest of full disclosure, I am the daughter of two parents in the Dept of Homeland Security who sacrifice LONG (years!) periods of time without their families -- not to mention their very lives -- to protect every one of you (and your families) from suicidal hate-filled terrorists who have no respect for life (not even their own). I am also an incredibly proud member of a family full of mothers, fathers, sons, daughters, brothers, sisters, etc that wake up every morning on a bed of hot sand, sweltering temps, and dehyrdated 'food', not having seen their children or spouses in months (or longer) -- with no idea if they will EVER see them again. These heroes make these horrendous sacrifices so you and I can sit around and complain about how horrible and unpatriotic our government is...and how those mothers, fathers, sisters, brothers, sons, and daughters have no business being over there in the hot sand in the first place. How's THAT for gratitude?

    While some of you might not agree with my sentiments, one thing I know for certain is that those government officials and regular Moms, Dads, sons & daughters, love this country -- so much so that they've devoted their entire adult lives to protecting it. If I (or one of my children or loved ones) were on a plane with a terrorist who was intent on blowing us out of the sky, one of these well-trained, loyal, self-sacrificing patriots is exactly who I'd want sitting next to me (or said loved one). And if the FBI had to hedge a bit in order to get to apprehend EVERY person involved in said terrorist attempt, I have NO problem with that. It boggles my mind why any person would have a problem with that. Let's assume a plane full of children was hijacked and by some miracle the plot was foiled and the plane landed safely. Who cares if LE announces they've arrested said person on this day as opposed to announcing it two, three, four, a thousand days later? Let officials do what we are demanding of them.

    *No offense or insult meant towards ANY poster on this thread. My frustration with how our military (including Homeland Security) is/has been treated has been escalating for awhile -- this just happens to be where it was released. Love & blessings to all and a happy, safe New Year.
     
  17. Anadarko

    Anadarko New Member

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    Mr. Haskell and his wife are both lawyers, so I'm sure they know more about what is an arrest versus detained etc... Either way, it was never mentioned, then it was denied, then it did happen, but not related. Which is it?? This situation is different than most, as it involves an attempted terrorist situation in our country, and could have disastrously affected hundreds of American citizens.

    The citizens of this country have a right to know what was, and is, going on. If someone else was even detained, and not arrested, we have the right to know. We are the travelers, and we are the taxpayers. We are the very people paying the salaries of all levels of LE and officials involved. They may hold back some details, but I am owed the information regarding the basics of any terrorist situation on our soil. As is any other American.

    Cover-up? You betcha. DHS was aware of alot going on in the days leading up to this botched plot. The information came straight from the father of the little Panty Bomber POS, and we did nothing. When the attempt of 12/25 was happening, that info should have been spread through the airlines and to crews of enroute flights, but that didn't happen. The President didn't have anything to say for a few days. Janet Napolitano said everything worked, and then had to back track and say it didn't. Then the President says everything failed. Didn't bother to cut his vacation short, as I guess this isn't all that important to him. He is a pathetic waste of air who doesn't seem to want to mess with the terrorists. hhmmmmmm......I wonder why???....

    MOO
     
  18. Anadarko

    Anadarko New Member

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    If the terrorist doesn't want anyone to see that he is on the no fly list,or on a watch list, he might say he has no passport. A Visa could have been obtained and used before he was put on any list. Could have been when he was just a regular citizen, and not yet involved with a terrorist organization. JMO
     
  19. Anadarko

    Anadarko New Member

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    From what I have heard on multiple news shows, people from Sudan don't have access to passports. Government problems, refugees, etc. So this "sharp dressed man" said he's Sudanese, and we have to do this all the time".

    Also, didn't they determine this man has a passport, but it was expired? He may not have been able to get a current passport anywhere due to his terrorist connections, or didn't bother.

    Flight tules should be the same everywhere, and it you don't have a valid passport, you don't fly. From the Sudan? Too bad. Not our problem. Might keep anyone from trying that in the future, if that is what happened.

    MOO
     
  20. jjenny

    jjenny Well-Known Member

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    Dutch officials say he presented a valid (obviously not expired) passport and VISA.
    "Abdulmutallab was carrying a valid Nigerian passport and had a valid U.S. visa, the Dutch said. His name did not appear on any Dutch list of terror suspects."
    http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/12/30/world/main6037474.shtml
     
  21. Cypros

    Cypros New Member

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    The standard rule in religion and politics is that the general public is best kept ignorant and in the dark. That's the way it has been throughout history and it is no different here in the US. Eight years ago there was a lot of activity in the White House and CIA leading up to 911. They had received a tape from Bin Laden which was understood to be a prelude to an attack and were searching for clues and suspects -- there was some coverage of this on international news (I was watching it and, along with som many others, expecting something to happen soon). And, oh yes, some years before this Al-Qaida's plot to use commercial planes to bomb buildings was uncovered and announced on the news networks. And yet, after the 9/11 attack all White House staffers feigned complete surprise and said that it never dawned on them that terrorists would use commercial planes to attack us. They lied. They lied and continued to lie for a variety of reason, but one main reason is that they want -- need -- the public to remain clueless and confused. The current administration will handle this situation as any other administration and you, the lowly general public, will just have to accept that. If you choose to question or demand answers be prepared to be called unpatriotic or even a terrorist sympathizer. That is the way the system works.
     

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