Forensic Astrology - CAYLEE ANTHONY Reported missing 7/15/2008 #16

Discussion in 'Forensic Astrology Forum' started by Soulscape, May 22, 2011.

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  1. momshrink

    momshrink New Member

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    Thanks, Katy - this is what I have thought, that there may have been some sexual interaction with LA, but nothing involving penetration - can I say that here????
     


  2. Soulscape

    Soulscape Active Member

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    Katydid,

    If you are "entirely wrong," so are Tuba, Neptunian, Housemouse, Kaitland and myself. As most of our readers know, we have been involved in the astrological analysis of this case since the beginning. None of us saw credible evidence of natal promise of sexual abuse in Casey Anthony's (untimed) birth chart, nor did we see the tell-tale markers in GA's (untimed) birth chart that typically suggest sexual obsession/ perversion.

    What we did see in Casey Anthony's chart was testimony after testimony associated with manipulation, deceit and pathological lying.


    Thanks,
    Soulscape
     
  3. momshrink

    momshrink New Member

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    Thank you, Soulscape. You and Katydid have confirmed what I have felt all along, that GA was falsely accused.
     
  4. Leomoon80

    Leomoon80 Well-Known Member

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    I love your "off to bed" emoticon! Puts a chuckle in an otherwise, hard subject to write about.

    I've been back to the charts, looking again as in the very beginning of this case, at CERES, which I find fasincating, in this family arena of charts, not only because of it's location in Cayley's natal chart, but also the interplay of the family charts and of course, the mythology behind the nurture of Ceres:


    Ceres description at this link: astrologycom.com


    http://www.cafeastrology.com/articles/aspectpatterns.html

    Re:Casey's KITE formation with Neptune at the Apex of the kite.

    quote:

    M.March and J.McEvers reckon that the biggest problem of the Kite is that the configuration comprises three different aspects, and can lead to excessive concentration on part of a horoscope and, correspondingly, to adverse utilization of other opportunities which are contained within the horoscope.



    I'm not here to try to convince anyone of anything, especially when minds are made up but I do think Ceres is one part of everyone's chart which should be seriously considered, especially in regards to this case in particular.

    Everyone who is human needs nurturing and needs to learn to nurture in return. Not everyone learns apparently one or the other.


    There happens to be a “running theme” I noticed and am willing to share here, from the very beginning, of checking the natal charts d for CA, her child Cayley (timed birth helped a great deal here, for we easily find her Ceres at the I/C in Scorpio)….Ceres for the grandmother, GA and LA.


    Here are the locations in case anyone is interested in studying Ceres in the natal charts:

    LA (uncle) Ceres at 22nd degree of SAG conj. Neptune at 25deg.Sag.
    Venus 2Sag conj. Uranus 4Sag.

    CA (grandmother of child) 9Leo conj. Uranus 8Leo (obvious as loss of the child to nurture and be nurtured by in such a “quick” (Uranus) fashion, overnight.

    On December 11, 2008 when the bones were discovered , the grandmother’s natal chart has TR Ceres conj. TR Mercury stationed over her natal PLUTO (DEATH) (both conj. Regulus)

    TR Mars stationed over her natal Venus and formed a square to her Ceres & Uranus.

    G.A. - (grandfather of Caylee , dad of Casey):
    His Ceres is 9PISCES (fatal and a degree of suffering) and of course, ruled by Neptune(theme)
    When Caylee’s body was found, his PROG Ceres was conj. “Fomalhaut” at 3PIS.
    (in the news, and as the ancients suggested, an immortal name)
    His Natal North Node is conj. Ceres at 9PIS within one hour
    and Sun is conj. the South Node and at 9Virgo – is considered, “body in the ditch” at this degree.

    CA (Caylee) is the only timed chart, so we know the angles involved. In this case, even more poignant of course because the I/C where her Ceres is located, is in the 3rd (using Placidius an uneven houses chart) and located conjunct the cusp of the 4th which is the home life.
    Caylee’s I/C was 17.36 degrees Scorpio and her Ceres was 16.51 degrees Scorpio so we can see how remarkably close in orb they were. The Angle to Ceres.
    As well, Caylee’s Ceres is square to the Sun (the light or ego expression) which was 16Leo57minutes Leo , (see how close to Ceres, this square was)
    And square to her natal Neptune which was 16degrees 11minutes Aquarius
    Remarkable, and certainly shows us how Astrology can reflect in the natal chart the probability to come.

    CMA (Casey A.) : Has her natal Ceres at 4degrees34min. (rx) Virgo which puts it opposed to natal Jupiter at 6°Pisces.
    Her natal Ceres makes one other major aspect (caveat being the time of birth), which is a Trine to Neptune, the Apex of a Kite in her natal chart linking the Moon (emotions) with Pluto and Jupiter (both at the 6th degree) and Neptune (illusions, and fantasies) at almost the same 5 degrees 43minutes in Capricorn, and of course the Apex of the Kite, the expiation point i.e. “fantasy world woven by the other planets” control is often a hallmark of Pluto when unbridled and unleashed, Jupiter (can be overwhelming and overdone) Neptune, is usually undermining and in this case we know now it is to her (the made up life and people in the life) a life of fantasy weaving.

    To my belief however, the fantasies are a creation (purposeful perhaps) in order to cope with the life she was leading and had led as a child.

    Anyone see the classic movie, "12 Angry Men?"......one of my husband's favorites, he probably knows every line.
    CA only needs one holdout to escape the DP. who MAY wonder if it's possible this is the only time she didn't lie after all.
    But like the old Aesop Fable? "The little boy who cried wolf" ?
    Who will believe now......when so many lies were told just like that fable teaches.
     
  5. Hunnie

    Hunnie New Member

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    I wonder if casey herself, is a sexual abuser....something just haunts me about that video of baby Caylee in her highchair, and casey is so weird filming her aiming the camera at her crotch and saying kill....and then the baby starts repeating it, I Kill You
    Could the charts be picking up that casey is the sexual abuser?

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=807kMNkVl0k&feature=related"]YouTube - ‪Who is Momtective? Breakfast with Caylee‬‏[/ame]
     
  6. katydid23

    katydid23 On Time Out

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    In my experience, Ceres in a natal chart is said to represent one's sense of 'mother' and one's own mothering skills and ability to nurture. Having an afflicted Ceres would be indicative of being 'abused' or neglected or overpowered by one's mother figures before it would indicate being molested by the father. imoo

    Casey has Ceres retro in Virgo, opposed by Jupiter in Pisces. I would [imo] interpret that as Casey having a critical mother figure who was passive aggressive in nature, and who was in opposition to an expansive and nurturing male figure, who was too forgiving and too generous to a fault. But I see nothing in that aspect which denotes sexual assault. imoo

    That Ceres also describes HER as a mother. She would feel that inner critical passive/aggressive
    tension herself when it comes to being in the role of the nurturer.
    Being at the midpoint of Saturn/Chiron in Gemini/ Sag may bring about the urge to break free from the bonds of daily routine activities. Those things make her feel deeply insecure and unprepared. Her own mother probably added to that feeling of inferiority because Cindy was a super MOM. everything was just so and just
    perfect. How could Casey ever live up to that expectation with such an afflicted sense of Ceres.

    Her Ceres is the midpoint of Saturn/Chiron, and the apex of a t-square. I see that as mental stress, nervous exhaustion, perhaps double messages in the home life about honesty/dishonesty. But the mutable mode and the Saturn /Jupiter do not imply sexual
    abuse in my opinion. I see it more as a battle between the sexes in the home, as the women emasculating the men, by witholding respect or love, and by being hypercritical.

    The Kite is a difficult planetary formation, I agree. An under estimated formation imo.
    However, imo, and imo only, it represents' leaving' the body, soaring above reality, escapism, the urge to disconnect from the physical senses. I have not seen it being a representation of physical abuse.

    Casey's lies--that she has a good steady job, is in college, has a wealthy boyfriend who gave her a tiffany ring, has lots of successful friends---are the only way she can live up to her family's expectations. The kite is like something that gets out of control, goes airborne, and there is no turning back, onward and upward.

    The major planetary formations in Casey's chart seems to be connected to her inability to realistically assess physical reality. I think she may be delusional at times and be at risk of losing touch with reality. But that does not seem to be tied to a father /sexuality issue imo. It seems to be her own personal demons, and inner rage. Sure, she grew up in a dysfunctional family. But I do not see it as the way she is describing it at all. imo

    ETA: I can agree that she wanted to rise above her difficult home life. But I do not agree that it was because of sexual abuse by the father. I think it was more likely to do with issues surrounding the tension between the mother and father, their own lack of connection, love and respect for each other. I think she felt a real burden to be a 'perfect' child and felt wholly incapable of doing so. [ Sun in critical degree of Pisces with major afflictions from Moon and from Mars, Uranus and Neptune. I think she felt insecure and inferior in many ways and could not focus well enough to follow through on basic ordinary tasks. [ Sun = Moon/Mars, Uranus in Mutable signs.]
     
  7. VidaRose

    VidaRose New Member

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    Dear wonderful members,
    This may be a primitive attempt at astrological, and forensic websluething however I have compared ICA’s chart with my own because I know for a fact that I had a childhood of abuse. I am convinced that ICA was a child who was doted over by a well meaning, loving, but imperfect family. \

    Rather, I see a power base in her chart that makes her energy like a bull dozer. People are hit and run by her before they realize it. They do not expect the actions they eventually get from her based on what they initially believe about her. She is also somewhat intelligent which makes her a skilled manipulator.
    Not to say she has the same influential power of great world leaders who also have the “free will” to use their influence for good or bad; but it is similar. ICA is not sophisticated enough. Instead she will steam roll someone and leave them in the dust wondering why the heck they didn’t see it coming. ICA is blusterous right out of the gate of her creation, and wanting right away to do her own bidding. She lives for ICA ( herself) and no one else. Some are too bad, too soon to be stealthy. Her GREAT Midpoint conflicts with GA or anyone else are of her own doing……or un- doing. IMO
     
  8. Jenny60123

    Jenny60123 Just Us for Caylee Marie

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    It's taken me time to separate emotion but now I also think that ICA is mentally ill. Just throwing my :twocents: in. :)

    I also agree being metnally ill does not excuse what was done to Caylee.
     
  9. momshrink

    momshrink New Member

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    All I can say is thanks for these interpretations! Leomoon, Katydid, and VidaRose. I am (and always have been) fascinated by family dynamics and the ways that individual and family dynamics interact. These interpretations make so much sense to me. And I think we have to consider all of the family dynamics in order to understand ICA.
    Leomoon - I created that new signature last night when I was so tired after yesterdays court session. That was how I felt!
     
  10. LiveLaughLuv

    LiveLaughLuv New Member

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    Thank you for your interpetations, Katydid..as well as the other astrologers. Your gift is so very unique....Thank you all...

    I see there is emotional/mental/verbal abuse with the two women of that home. I think a domineering, controlling mother who's daughter can never do anything right, led to the animosity between them. I believe they butted heads over how to raise Caylee and of course, it's CA's way or the highway. I also believe since CA was paying the way, gave Caylee lots of attention (as she should, she was her first grandchild), ICA felt she could not measure up to her mothers love.

    I also believe ICA was made to feel like only the babysitter to her own child. I believe this was the contention between them and ICA felt 'sibling' rivalry towards her own child.

    I do not believe ICA was molested by her father as a child or young teen. I don't buy that theory at all. This is just more of ICA's vengenace and it appears as if she is getting great pleasure in doing so. She is taking delight in embarrasing her family.

    As for the lying. Nothing ICA told CA was checked into to, nor was she held responsible for bad behaviors. CA's self proclaimed 'avoidance' tendencies is where this family went wrong with ICA. I also believe CA has that same ability to spin a tale, we've all seen her do this as well. There is no rhyme or reason, they do it just because. JMHO

    Justice for Caylee
     
  11. Leomoon80

    Leomoon80 Well-Known Member

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    It would be easy to let emotions overcome us in such a horrendous event as the loss of a child such as in this case.

    Since CA has Neptune at apex of the KITE formation, and Neptune is often about fantasies (she is a Pisces afterall, the Sun sign ruled by Neptune)
    I believe her fantasies were created by a mind that went overboard in overtime, (Jupiter is part of this Kite and Jupiter was the older ruler of Pisces from before Neptune was discovered ) and therefore, these energies represented by the Kite, become part of her mental health issues (the foundation for which we may never know and certainly cannot agree upon being they are not provable at this point)

    Cayley A. cannot be helped in the physical plane now, but Casey can be, possibly.


    Cayley's chart was very difficult and I don't think there is one Astrologer here who would find fault with this statement, yet the one who ended that life and effectively that chart is the depiction of that short life, cannot serve Cayley by ending another one as well.

    Perhaps if I am correct afterall about Ceres and the running theme through the lives of the family Cayley was a catalyst for the lessons that Ceres attempts to teach. That of nurture and being nutured properly.



    IMO.
     
  12. Paulette

    Paulette Well-Known Member

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    Arabic Part of Retribution & Retaliation: Asc + Sun - Mars

    This occurs. There isn't anything (in this imperfect world) that we mortals can do about it. As soon as you're born, it clicks into your life - along with all the other Arabic Parts & Midpoint points that apply to each and every one of us.

    KC won't be singled out by the universe unfairly - it was written when she was born - if you do this or that, you will incur this benefit/wrath.

    I have experience the part of R&R. It was exact to the minute.
     
  13. coastal

    coastal Well-Known Member

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    Respectfully snipped, Leomoon80, because the thanks button wasn't enough thanks for these ideas. Casey makes me so mad smoke comes out my ears, and so sad I find myself weeping for her lost potential, for her...emptiness. Then I hear Caylee's sweet voice, so new and already so full of love, and there I go, mad as hell again, only now I hate myself for forgetting to listen to the lesson she is living for us all, and loving first.

    Sigh. It's crazy-making, the whole thing, including the astrology (and I mean that in the nicest way :angel:) which is why I wanted to say thank you so much to all of you who help us try to understand these people and these things. I don't know that I would be making the effort, honestly, without the conversations that happen within this these few threads; life is short, and there are surely better ways to live it than falling into Court TV, and yet...here I am. Here you are, and I am learning and growing every day. Thanks for that.

    [​IMG]
     
  14. Leomoon80

    Leomoon80 Well-Known Member

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    How kind you are coastal, thank you so much.

    After reading on and on various threads here and there are so many of them on the other WS forums now some with timed events to chart , I do agree that CA has serious issues with narcissism tendencies and her manic episodes, yet the Fantasy life found in the astrology's KITE formation , is what I'm trying to understand by honing in on astrologically.

    I know people who mimic the same type of personality disorders that the forum threads speak of which are evident of course, narcissist and the (pathological lying at least is a very negative Neptune negative trait) for the Apex of that Kite.

    However, neither of these two I'm thinking of, have a vivid fantasy life complete with 20 people or more and making up stories as though they are true to life events as a way of life.

    Many people say these personality disorders are for life and not treatable as an integral part of one's personality, but I'm just not as convinced as they are of this, in light of the fantasy world she engages seemingly, to disassociate from the reality around her.
     
  15. katydid23

    katydid23 On Time Out

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    I am not certain that she actually 'lived' this fantasy life or believed this fantasy life at all.

    Her Pisces stellium of Sun, Mercury retro, and Jupiter gave her a wild imagination. But those intense squares from Mars, Uranus and Neptune forced her to deal with an intrusive reality. I do not believe she lived in her fantasies, I believe she used them to hide her reality. imoo

    Her kite helped blow things out of proportion and things got out of control. But she never believed in those fantasies as being real, she believed in them as ways to cover up her actions and her behavior from others. She was cunning, and devious imo. The grand trine in her kite is in the water element.
    It was her DESIRES that propelled that kite, not her fantasies. She wanted to fulfill her urges and desires, which were indicated by Moon, Pluto and Jupiter. She was passionate and loved to be in love,deeply in love. Her emotional relationships took control of her life and as the kiter soared, they swept her away.
     
  16. momshrink

    momshrink New Member

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    I so agree with you. Excellent post!
     
  17. Frigga

    Frigga New Member

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    I do believe what happened to Caylee was an act of premeditation by the defendant, however I think she is also very mentally ill.

    I also agree with Katydid23 in terms of Casey's "lies" and "fantasy world", her lies served two purposes (IMO) the one that Katy mentioned covering her 'real' life from her parents, but also it allowed her to appear equal if not superior to her friends and acquaintances. That is a self serving and devious form of lying... not the "I live in a fantasy world because my real world is so heinous and abusive" type reason for lying!

    The testimony of her long time best friend Ryan Paisley reinforces this when he said in his depositions and interviews that whenever he shared with Casey something he had accomplished or was proud of she always had to 'one-up' him- always. This kid knew her and cared about her for a long time and he knew (for the most part) when she did this, that she was lying.

    Cindy said that their was always "some truth to Casey's lies" was taken the wrong way.
     
  18. Leomoon80

    Leomoon80 Well-Known Member

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    I suppose people can believe whatever they will , but ultimately it will be up to the Jury to decide.

    Subjective opinions all, but the jury too will have their own subjective take on the whys and wherefores of all that has been posted.

    To place the Fantasy World creations into the "I believe" category, is simply subjective to each of us.

    The why of it , that is.

    The Astrology natal chart for instance , the Kite and Neptune so very prominent in her natal chart, is impossible to say with 100% certainty, (and the DP must be 100% certainty)imo, or 100% agreeing to it,
    For the astrological indicators:
    Only that it's critical and crucial energy in her life that will be exhibited in a likely negative fashion, that Neptune shows (imo)

    added: from Frigga (snipped) post:

    VERY interesting Frigga! I did not know that the mother said this, for it points again to the family knowing all along, yet ignoring (for whatever personal reasons they may have had) this FACT,
    which I underlined as fact, if so. A statement made by the mother herself.
     
  19. momshrink

    momshrink New Member

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    This is such a thought provoking thread. As you know, I know nothing about astrology, but am fascinated by the interpretations of the charts here. It has been really interesting to learn that individuals can have the same things in their charts, but act differently - a postive way or a negative way. Maybe I am simplifying. Maybe I need to be corrected (on shaky ground here). I agree that we all have free will and make choices that determine our fate.
    I do think we must be held accountable for our acts unless there is a diminished capacity wherein one does not understand right or wrong. I have felt all along that she would get LWOP. Based only on my intuitive feeling.
     
  20. momshrink

    momshrink New Member

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    respectfully snipped
    A thanks was just not enough. I appreciate your posts so much. Always so much to think about.
     
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