FOUND DECEASED - WA - Lindsey Baum, 10, McCleary, 26 June 2009

Discussion in 'Lindsey Baum' started by Blue_Dolphin308, Jun 29, 2009.

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  1. fullofsecrets

    fullofsecrets Member

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    Interesting they request tips be sent to the PI instead of directly to LE or Crimestoppers...it seems to cast some doubt on how active their case truly is? sigh.
     
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  2. tnith

    tnith Well-Known Member

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    I don't have a lot of faith in information reaching the right people in the PNW if you aren't dropping it right at the detectives feet. Too disconnected, I've hit a lot of dead ends and messy processes.
    The wording feels off kilter to me as well, 'Active... but only if' :(

    "The FBI, and the Kittitas County and Grays Harbor County Sheriff’s Office say Lindsey’s case is still very active, but they tell us they will not search the area where her skull was found unless new evidence is found."

    Mother of murdered 10-year-old Lindsey Baum calls for another search for evidence
     
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  3. ChuckMaureen

    ChuckMaureen Well-Known Member

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    "Active" in what way? Like food in a running blender.

    I'd imagine the case is still "active" in that LE had long ago zeroed in on one particular individual whom they discuss behind closed doors but as of yet have been unable to piece together definitive evidence/proof and that's where their energies are directed.

    Since many if not most cases are proved in court using circumstantial evidence I have to wonder if evidence in this case is just too thin or is it something other than evidence that's lacking or is otherwise preventing follow-up and arrest(s)?

    • White car.
    • Revealing comments over time.
    • Loosely-connected dots. Loosely, but connected nonetheless.
    • Opportunity.
    • Odd interactions.

    I can only imagine exculpatory indications are either preventing progress or are steering LE in other, lesser-known directions.

    I do not believe this was a stranger abduction. Of all the children in the area, we might safely assume children used the sidewalks/alleys/streets at evening time to walk from A to B. That assumption leads me to a conclusion that LB was specifically targeted.
     
  4. luxISlight

    luxISlight Active Member

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    I'm sure her mother/family have searched the area themselves but wonder if a search team has been put together in that area later than 2017.
     
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  5. ChuckMaureen

    ChuckMaureen Well-Known Member

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    I suspect the immediate discovery location was not the only evidence repository. I believe items were discarded along the way, maybe close to the location but far enough to inhibit discovery.

    Clothing. Shoes. That's about all LB had with her (AFAWK) when she was abducted. Other relevant evidence LE would want to discover would be that of or from the perp(s); a missing link.

    As I indicated in previous posts, this was a planned abduction. It's too clean, too swift. The conditions and timing were right, and patience was employed to wait for that confluence. Now, would such a feat have required a higher level of intelligence or could 'anyone' have pulled it off? IQ or no IQ? Did it take brains or simply deep desire?

    No one heard noise?
    No one realized a struggle?
    Not impossible. That time of the evening people are otherwise occupied, such as some were at a retirement party in the VFW, others were readying for bed.

    Who else knew LB wanted to spend the night at her friends?
    Who else knew LB and her friend would be declined the request?
    Who else knew LB walked a (assumed) particular route to home?
    Were new/regular patrons of the video store interviewed, whereabouts on previous days tracked?

    I believe the abductor to have been one of two persons:

    • White Car.
    • Video Store Patron.

    At the moment, I'm leaning toward one, and it's the one who's never been given proper, public attention (AFAIK)... and it isn't the first one.
     
  6. SouthernMom

    SouthernMom Well-Known Member

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    Stopping in to see if anything new has come up in this case. Hoping for evidence soon that will bring justice for Lindsey.
     
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  7. watcher9

    watcher9 Well-Known Member

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  8. MizStery

    MizStery Missing Pregnant Lacy P. brought me here in 2005

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    Mom of slain McCleary girl outraged after memorial banner removed
    by Keith Eldridge, KOMO News reporter

    Tuesday, August 25th 2020
    by Keith Eldridge, KOMO News reporter

    Tuesday, August 25th 2020
    MCCLEARY, Wash. — A banner to honor the memory of a young murder victim was taken down from her memorial garden after McCleary city officials ordered it removed, saying it violated city rules.

    <snip>
    When a volunteer discovered the banner for Melisa was missing this week, it was returned to her mother, Melissa Baum, who had it re-hung. She said she was told by city officials that the banner was a reminder of a negative event in the city's history that was scaring small children.

    "I’m offended that my banners offend them," Baum said. "I’m offended that my 10-year-old little girl’s murderer does not outrage and offend them. And I’m offended that they would have the gall to think that taking my banners down is an appropriate action to take.”

    New posters are being produced and Baum said she hopes people will want to use them in the effort to find her daughter's killer.

    Mom of slain McCleary girl outraged after memorial banner removed

    On my way to Long Beach,Wa tomorrow I drive by McCleary. If there is still daylight I will try to take a picture of the banner. Prayers for courageous Millissa Braun.
     
  9. AmandaReckonwith

    AmandaReckonwith Defective Detective

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    This makes me want to scream.
     
  10. AmandaReckonwith

    AmandaReckonwith Defective Detective

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    Family fights to keep 10-year-old girl’s unsolved murder banners up
    Good video here.

    “I don’t know how much louder I have to scream that I’m not going anywhere and neither are my banners,” said Melissa.

    Melissa said city workers took down the banner at the police department and at the park near Lindsey’s memorial garden; for now, that one is back up.

    In a statement to KIRO 7, Mayor Brenda Orffer said:

    “Council members have been asked by some if the banner could be removed from the park as it is where children go to play. When it was placed there without approval, we did not immediately remove it because we do want to see justice for Lindsey. When concerns were shared and the request to remove it was made, we attempted to find out who had placed the banner at the park so we could make a plan together. When we could not determine who or what organization had placed it there, council members asked that it be removed in response to concerns that had been shared with them.”

    “They can complain all they want, where’s my justice, where’s the outrage for my murdered 10-year-old,” said Melissa.

    “We apologize if anyone is offended by the signs, but we’re offended by the fact that there’s still a killer walking the streets that is responsible for murdering Lindsey Baum,” said Angela, a Justice for Lindsey volunteer.
     
  11. AmandaReckonwith

    AmandaReckonwith Defective Detective

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  12. Penny4YourThoughts

    Penny4YourThoughts Well-Known Member

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    Monsters don’t just do this once and stop-especially when they get away with it for so long. So I’m not only tormented constantly, daily, nightly, by all the horrific things that may have happened to my 10-year-old child, but what are they doing to other children? And getting away with?” RSBM from @tnith link.
    THIRTY-FIVE THOUSAND DOLLAR REWARD still unclaimed...unbelievable. Lindsey brought me to WS ❤️
     
  13. bettyboop

    bettyboop Well-Known Member

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    Following. Also wondering if the Emory brothers
    had something to do with this case.If you haven't
    read about them please do so.
     
  14. JudgeJoe

    JudgeJoe Well-Known Member

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  15. boondock

    boondock Member

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    I haven't posted in a very long time but I've been thinking about where Lindsey's remains were found and how that must connect to her killer. This person has ties to areas around McCleary and Ellensburg. For someone to be familiar enough with Manastash Ridge to dump remains there, they must frequent that area enough to feel very comfortable in their surroundings.

    I tried to look up more of an exact location to where her remains were found ( what trails are nearby) but I haven't found it yet. I know I've read it before, does anyone remember? I'm wondering if it might give a clue, being some trails are used more by dirt bikes, others ATVs etc. Was the killer a hunter, did he/she ride dirt bikes, did they like to go 4 wheeling? Both Manastash Ridge and McCleary have popular Off Road Vehicle (ORV) riding areas.
    I've posted some videos below of Manastash and different ORV types there. This person must have at least had a truck or vehicle rugged enough to navigate the area I'm guessing. If anyone is more familiar with the exact local of the remains, can you please chime in your thoughts on this? Could a regular car have been used?






     
  16. Knox

    Knox Well-Known Member

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    I did look extensively when the news on the brothers hit. The link to the house they owned made me sure it was possible. But LE went through that place with a fine tooth comb and cadaver dogs. At the end, I was satisfied those men were the devils spawn, but not likely responsible for Lindsey's death.

    I've never been able to let go of Tim the Jeweler or Dale Golder. But it could just as easily been a stranger abduction.

    I hate that Melissa is still waiting for answers!
     
  17. DoughChild

    DoughChild New Member

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    I was going through the unsolved cases and found this one, read through most of what's been posted, and dug around myself. I haven't found much new information that isn't posted here already, but I was wondering if anyone else here was still looking into this case in 2021?
     
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  18. Knox

    Knox Well-Known Member

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    The family hired a PI a while back. I mainly keep up with the case on Facebook.
    Justice For Lindsey Baum
     
  19. Kell1

    Kell1 Verified law enforcement

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    Her case, is tough because kids aren't usually out roaming around at 9:45 pm but here's some common factors in Stranger child abduction murders, I've posted this here before sorry to be redundant



    Just some general factors common in most child abduction homicides to consider


    If you were to apply most states' general guidelines to classify "sexually violent predators", the majority of these individuals would fit the profile outlined in such hence their existence.


    -The Offender is usually in the area of the abduction for legitimate reasons, they usually live or work nearby or this may be a normal route for them to travel in their daily activities



    -The mean age of the offender in most of these cases, is 27 years old, but that works upon a slide rule (26-36) depending on factors such as incarceration time and time in treatment, or the military etc..


    -Approximately 70% are white males



    -Almost always these crimes are perpetrated for sexual reasons.



    -The offender usually has a criminal history most often with a focus on crimes against children, (not always, adult victims are not uncommon) but these will almost always of a sexual nature, these may however have gone unprosecuted, for several reasons



    -Often labelled as "Social Marginals" they are usually considered "oddballs" or "weird" and aren't usually above suspicion in such cases, with a tendency toward sociopathic behavior, In many cases, they are suspected almost immediately.


    -Weak social bonds, may have what they consider "friends" in a mitigated context


    -Most have an identified disorder, usually sexual, but also behavioral , slightly fewer abuse intoxicants.


    -Often frequent residence changes (moves) in their past , prior to the incident, usually at least 1 within a year prior to the incident.



    -Offender usually acts alone



    -Offender is unknown (stranger) to the victim in most cases, but only slightly less are acquaintances



    -Slightly less than half are unemployed or underemployed at time of incident



    -Occupation is usually blue collar considered "unskilled" or "semi skilled" . with construction being the most prominent industry



    -Usually live with parents or a family member



    -Unmarried or in any type of intimate relationship at time of incident


    -Offender, is usually not in any kind of legal custody status at the time (Probation/Parole etc..)



    -Victim is selected usually as a target of opportunity, physical characteristics other than gender and size usually bear little weight in victim selection.



    -Physical force is the most common method used to secure the victim, followed by con/ruse



    -Offender used a vehicle in approx 98% of abductions, where the victim was found deceased (Note to parents: Teach children to avoid vehicles at all costs, and to either get out of it or disable the vehicle , or draw attention to it if they find themselves in that situation)



    -Stressing events prior to , play much less a role in child abduction murders as opposed to abduction murders of adults, than we once thought, these individuals tend to be more like "killers in waiting" , then angry retaliatory types.


    -In only about 10% of cases, (not related to serial cases) has the offender committed a prior murder of a child, and only about 6.5 % had previously kidnapped a child. .



    -The Victim is often abducted less than .4 Mi from their home, they are usually transported greater than 5 Mi from the abduction site



    -Victim is usually alone at the time of abduction, to a lesser extent with friends


    -Overwhelmingly the victims are usually white, female, mean age of approx 11 years old. (the younger the victim the more theres a propensity for the offender to ba an aquaintence or family member)



    -The Murder site is often less then 200 feet from the body recovery site



    -The victim is usually deceased within the 1st 1-5 hours following the abduction, about 76% were killed within 3 hours of the abduction, and almost 100% within 24 hours , this is important to note because most children aren't reported missing until 2-4 hours following the actual abduction, which means in the majority of cases, the victim is deceased before they are even reported missing (the 1st 48 does not pertain to child abduction cases, the time frame is much smaller)



    -The offenders name usually comes up within the 1st 48 hours, is usually known to investigators within the 1st week of the investigation, though not necessarily as a suspect.



    -As we are now learning with the emergence of all these cases, being solved by DNA, the offender often commits further crimes of a sexual nature, though often short of murder, in many cases. (Investigative consideration should be considered in ALL crimes of a sexual nature to collect and submit DNA and do a THOROUGH background investigation on individuals suspected of such crimes, as well as anyone interviewed and perhaps not considered a suspect this is extremely important as many of these individuals have committed prior crimes, but were not prosecuted or caught )
     
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2021
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  20. Jules71

    Jules71 Well-Known Member

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    Just checking in. It's been awhile. I still think about Lindsey. Sad she doesn't have justice yet.
     
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