George Zimmerman /Trayvon Martin General Discussion #12 Wed July 10

[Chelly]

There is a guy in front row, looks like secret service, grey suit. Anyone know who he is?

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

They are bouncing all over with their witnesses..

 

[NIN]

Are "Jury instructions" standard? for each trial?

Most states have "standard jury instructions" for issues of law that come up repeatedly. Lawyers can argue to modify the standard instructions or propose new instructions depending on the facts/law of each case.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

All I can think is please let it be MOM that rises to rebut...

 

[?noanswer]

Is there evidence that TM went for GZ's gun? I believe no traces of TM's DNA or fingerprints were ever found on GZ's holster or gun, so this is not factual, but conjecture based on GZ's own words. I will go with what is already known, ie. no GZ DNA at all on TM or TM's DNA/prints on GZ's gun, based on due process, IMO. I can only believe in what is already presented as clear evidence, IMO

There was none of GZ's DNA or fingerprints either.

JMO

 

[EquallyDivided]

Is there evidence that TM went for GZ's gun? I believe no traces of TM's DNA or fingerprints were ever found on GZ's holster or gun, so this is not factual, but conjecture based on GZ's own words. I will go with what is already known, ie. no GZ DNA at all on TM or TM's DNA/prints on GZ's gun, based on due process, IMO. I can only believe in what is already presented as clear evidence, IMO

I hear what you are saying, but given the complete mis-management, incorrect, incomplete and incompetent handling of the evidence (even some things that weren't presented in court) I have zero confidence that they would have obtained it, had it been there.

At this point, Big Bird could have lost all of his downy feathers at the crime scene, and the investigators would have missed it.

If you can't have confidence in the evidence, absense of evidence means nothing.

All in my professional opinion.

 

[Just K]

There are very specific instances in which prior bad acts may be admitted, and I've cited the Federal Rules of Evidence here that list these exceptions. It does not seem to me, that calling this agent would be anywhere within the scope of these exceptions (the testimony must show motive, opportunity, intent, preparation, plan, knowledge, identity, absence of mistake, or lack of accident). Did the State really think they could get away with this?

The defense witness, Mr Root, testified two times today to GZ's not being a violent person. He opened the door. The prosecution would be remiss not to challenge that expert's testimony.

 

[William N]

They have reached the point of pure desperation. JMO. OMO. MOO.

The state wants to call an ATF agent as a rebuttal witness and they don't even know where he is, much less have him on hand.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

This is silly to me. Sorry.

 

[missmazzy]

There is a guy in front row, looks like secret service, grey suit. Anyone know who he is?

The one chewing gum on defense side?

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

Mr Donnelly...

 

[gxm]

I am going to concede that because right now I don't have the testimony in front of me.. But again, I still don't think it matters much the exact words. But that Rj puts TM speaking to Tm and not GZ storming up to TM and questioning him.

ITA. Both questions, IMO, are essentially the same: a confrontational opening (along the lines of "am I wearing something of yours?"). JMO. OMO. MOO.

 

[missmazzy]

The state wants to call an ATF agent as a rebuttal witness and they don't even know where he is, much less have him on hand.

...and this surprises you how? :floorlaugh:

 

[Mony Mony]

I will be VERY curious if anyone from WS...(that actually WATCHED the case) has changed their minds in the end of trial....

I started out...first few days....with manslaughter, and now I am firmly on side of self-defense.

Even if someone is following you this does not give you the right to attack them. Self-defense is self-defense.

I hope we get a poll at the end of this trial, and that WS can come together again with the next trial we watch.

I wanted to "throw the book" at George in the beginning, only having heard sounds bites. After watching the trial, there is too much reasonable doubt for a conviction of manslaughter let alone M2, and believe it was self defense on the part of George. Carter's testimony sealed the deal for me.

 

[katydid23]

That ATF agent was dressed in undercover clothing when he grabbed Zimmermans college friend and pulled him out of the club for underage drinking. GZ followed and defended his friend, not knowing at first he was an ATF agent. So imo, he was having his friend's back, like a friend should. JMO

 

[sorrell skye]

Judge Nelson just said that she's investigating the possibility of a violation of the rule of sequestration regarding another witness (who she said was a witness for both sides). She said she'll let the attorneys know who that person is at the bench, if they want to know.

ETA: She wasn't referring to Mr. Donnelly, but to another unnamed witness.

 

[Chelly]

The one chewing gum on defense side?

Bald guy earwig spectator first row

 

[Badlands]

The state wants to call an ATF agent as a rebuttal witness and they don't even know where he is, much less have him on hand.

That's because the door didn't open for him to testify until today, when the witness claimed GZ was not a confrontational person.

IMO

 

[cityslick]

I'll be interested to see a poll, based on evidence alone, what people think the verdict will be,

 

[m00c0w]

The defense witness, Mr Root, testified two times today to GZ's not being a violent person. He opened the door. The prosecution would be remiss not to challenge that experts testimony.

I'm not Rule 404 of the FRE.

(1) Prohibited Uses. Evidence of a crime, wrong, or other act is not admissible to prove a person’s character in order to show that on a particular occasion the person acted in accordance with the character.​

Prior bad acts cannot come into play unless they meet the exceptions I have already listed previously in this thread.