Gerald R. McMenamin on Donald Foster pg 84-88

[voynich]

Is it known that Shakespeare actually wrote his will and that it wasn't drafted by one of his many lawyer friends? Bear in mind that copyright laws didn't really exist then so he wouldn't make much reference to his plays in his will...

Actually, I've always favoured the writing syndicate idea for Shakespeare but my sister would eat me alive for saying that

we should bring in the JB handwriting experts to settle this :crazy:

 

[voynich]

I have no idea? You used to be able to buys books on it and occasionally the girls' magazines would carry 'what your handwriting says about you' articles which were fun but meant to be taken with a bucket of salt. On the other hand, this French woman was taken very seriously by the investment banks, law firms etc at one point. Admittedly, in view of recent banking developments, you might take the view that she was an eeejit

in the case of JB RN we have someone trying to disguise his/her handwriting, on top of trying to sound like someone s/he is not.

If I were PR I would say what DeeDee said

 

[DeeDee249]

in the case of JB RN we have someone trying to disguise his/her handwriting, on top of trying to sound like someone s/he is not.

If I were PR I would say what DeeDee said

What, the curtains?

 

[voynich]

What, the curtains?

"Tell anyone and we'll blow her *advertiser censored**king head off".


-- maybe a man wrote this RN and intentionally sounded feminine to mislead us into thinking a woman wrote it.

 

[BBB167893]

Ironically, re gender computer test, I used a similar argument against those RDI who argue that the RN has a motherly tone to it. Not your everyday mother talks about the killing won't be difficult.

This wasn't your everyday mother, in any sense of the phrase.

I am curious as to what other expert forensic linguists have to say on this, and on McM methodology.

As am I.

The problem I have though w/Foster and other interpretative methods is that if you have any suspicion as to who the suspect is, you can then marshal evidence in the writing in favor of your conclusion, and ignore or explain away evidence on the contrary.

I suppose that's a legitimate point. But there's no evidence that happened here. Quite the opposite, in fact.

 

[BBB167893]

Maybe something like this...

"Tell anyone and we'll blow her *advertiser censored**king head off".

Men are much more to the point and blunt. Men don't usually feel the need to explain, and would not care about whether the victim's parents were "rested" or whether they brought an "adequately-sized attache"
Bring the $$$= get your kid back. The end.

That's pretty much what my answer was gonna be!

 

[voynich]

That's pretty much what my answer was gonna be!

So then JR had played no part in writing the RN?

if a 9 y/o, say BR, were to write an RN, what would it look like?

how intelligent is BR? any IQ estimates?

 

[voynich]

This wasn't your everyday mother, in any sense of the phrase.



As am I.



I suppose that's a legitimate point. But there's no evidence that happened here. Quite the opposite, in fact.

well if Shakespeare wrote his own will, as opposed to say his lawyer, I doubt he also authored plays/sonnets attributed to him using these linguistic techniques.

 

[Sophie]

So then JR had played no part in writing the RN?

if a 9 y/o, say BR, were to write an RN, what would it look like?

how intelligent is BR? any IQ estimates?

I have no idea but I do recall an article in the Georgia press about how he had helped his high school maintain a B average and was going to Purdue and there being a subsequent debate on one of the sites about whether he was the C or the A that created the B average Assuming he was a B average, I assume that means higher than average but not creme de la creme?

 

[voynich]

I have no idea but I do recall an article in the Georgia press about how he had helped his high school maintain a B average and was going to Purdue and there being a subsequent debate on one of the sites about whether he was the C or the A that created the B average Assuming he was a B average, I assume that means higher than average but not creme de la creme?

I guess what would be relevant in this particular case is his writing ability & ability to cite certain movies. I concede that this RN would be beyond the abilities of a typical 9 y/o, or not creme de la creme.

Anne Frank was about 12 when she wrote The Diary of a Young Girl which seems rather beyond a typical 12 diary, though your typical girl doesn't have to suffer the ordeal of the Holocaust.

 

[Sophie]

I guess what would be relevant in this particular case is his writing ability & ability to cite certain movies. I concede that this RN would be beyond the abilities of a typical 9 y/o, or not creme de la creme.

Anne Frank was about 12 when she wrote The Diary of a Young Girl which seems rather beyond a typical 12 diary, though your typical girl doesn't have to suffer the ordeal of the Holocaust.

Actually, Voynich, you make a good point. I'm always conscious of citing these tedious local examples which are of no interest to anyone other than me but if you'll forgive me this one case: The Yorkshire Ripper hoaxer was a total eejit who just happened to have read a lot of stuff on Jack Ripper and could copy the orginal Ripper's goading letters to the police. I guess we'd have to look at Burke's reading material etc. If he had been staggeringly bright, you can depend on Patsy having mentioned it in the Christmas letters but the brightness we are discussing is less quantifiable...

Having said that, I'll eat hay with a cuddy* if Burke is involved.


*Another unashamed bit of local dialect

 

[BBB167893]

So then JR had played no part in writing the RN?

Limited, certainly.

 

[BBB167893]

well if Shakespeare wrote his own will, as opposed to say his lawyer, I doubt he also authored plays/sonnets attributed to him using these linguistic techniques.

I fail to see how that relates to this case. (Though, to be fair, the whole "who wrote Shakespeare's plays" debate has been going on for a LOOOONG time.)

 

[voynich]

I fail to see how that relates to this case. (Though, to be fair, the whole "who wrote Shakespeare's plays" debate has been going on for a LOOOONG time.)

How well do various different linguistic methods correctly identify samples v.s incorrectly?

if you and i were to submit to foster, gerald mcm & co a star wars themed sith rn note, 400 words long, how well would either correctly identify which of us wrote it?

same success rate question could be asked about handwriting

 

[BBB167893]

How well do various different linguistic methods correctly identify samples v.s incorrectly?

if you and i were to submit to foster, gerald mcm & co a star wars themed sith rn note, 400 words long, how well would either correctly identify which of us wrote it?

same success rate question could be asked about handwriting

I get you. Still, I'm not sure I like the idea of comparing a modern American ransom note with Elizabethan-era drama. (Although, this case often reminds me of Macbeth.)

Couldn't say about handwriting.

 

[Sophie]

Hi, Voynich, re graphology, this page has some interesting links and articles including one which suggests that I misrembered the popularity of the French woman's work!

http://search.bbc.co.uk/search?go=homepage&scope=all&q=graphology&Search=Search


This is a gender predicting site although it isn't the one I was thinking of:


http://bookblog.net/gender/genie.php

 

[DeeDee249]

Patsy wrote the note.

 

[Sophie]

Patsy wrote the note.

You have a tremendous style about you, DeeDee :blowkiss:

 

[madeleine]

The rn sounds really silly.It was written in a rush......hurry hurry write,our time's up soon and we HAVE to call LE.That's why it makes no sense.It doesn't even have to make sense.It just HAD to be written.That "kidnapping" without that"note"......wouldn't have made sense.IMO they didn't even care WHAT they write in it.They just needed A NOTE.

 

[voynich]

The rn sounds really silly.It was written in a rush......hurry hurry write,our time's up soon and we HAVE to call LE.That's why it makes no sense.It doesn't even have to make sense.It just HAD to be written.That "kidnapping" without that"note"......wouldn't have made sense.IMO they didn't even care WHAT they write in it.They just needed A NOTE.

I'm not entirely convinced they needed to even write a note, although I admit it's hard to think logically if RDI is what really happened.

PR says to JR "we need to write an RN"
JR "good idea"
PR "in my own handwriting"
JR "good idea"
PR "3 pages long"
JR "good idea"
PR "full of inside information like your bonus, that only we would know"
JR "good idea, I give my stamp of approval"