Hailey Dunn: General Discussion thread #3

Discussion in 'Hailey Dunn' started by Salem, Apr 30, 2013.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Tugela

    Tugela Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,713
    Likes Received:
    439
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Starting from scratch won't really help, if there is no evidence there is no evidence, and finding any more after three years is a tall order. The real problem really is that the initial investigation was poorly done, and that has pretty much contaminated everything else.

    In a murder investigation the first 48 hours are crucial when it comes to evidence gathering. After that things fall off rapidly, and in particular, the longer it takes to become aware of potential evidence, they more likely it will be that the evidence is gone or have become contaminated. After three years the chances of any physical evidence will be extremely low.

    What is particularly noteworthy is that since finding the body, no search warrants have been executed that we know about. What that means is that whatever was gathered in the first few weeks is now no longer considered probable cause. Chances are that subsequent investigation refuted most of what was suggested in the initial affidavits, and that is the real reason why no progress is being made now. They know she is dead, but they have nothing to follow up on.
     


  2. PPKik

    PPKik New Member

    Messages:
    906
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    0

    I usually agree with your posts, Tugela, and your perspective, and essentially do here. You are absolutely right about the initial investigation "being poorly done." It was a mess of incompetence and Kampher's bungling intrusion and his covering up C City's mess made it even worse.

    On the other hand, cold cases much older than this, sometimes 20 or 30 years old, with lost or destroyed evidence, do get solved.

    Although evidence was either not gathered, fabricated or ignored in Hailey's case, I do believe if the right dedicated person(s) or agency went back to the beginning and started by reinterviewing everyone, from family members and friends, to the sex offenders LE didn't even consider investigating, perhaps there might be an arrest and conviction.

    That being said, the calls made to the supposed investigating agency, SCSO, and the denial of said agency that they were responsible for the case, doesn't give me a lot of hope that any LE agency gives a damn about finding Hailey's killer. It makes me sick; I believe the answers are out there in this case, if anyone cared to work at it.
     
  3. sophiebelle

    sophiebelle New Member

    Messages:
    2,598
    Likes Received:
    27
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I agree 100%!
     
  4. Chinook3

    Chinook3 New Member

    Messages:
    15
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Is there a time line on this case?

    Chinook3
     
  5. nannymo

    nannymo Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,351
    Likes Received:
    5,754
    Trophy Points:
    113
    :floorlaugh: Take your pick! There are a bunch! :floorlaugh:

    I just couldn't resist Chinook! It seems like there was a new and different timeline evertime the wind blew a different direction in West Texas. You can go back through the threads and probably find half a dozen or more...

    Couldn't resist a laugh in this sad child's case. If you are not familiar with it, it will take quite a bit of reading to catch up.
     
  6. kirby

    kirby New Member

    Messages:
    165
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
     
  7. StacieC

    StacieC Verified insider - Hailey Dunn case

    Messages:
    62
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    http://cbs7.com/news/details.asp?ID=55774

    today is a year. A year ago today Hailey was found. The reporter did say this started 4 years ago, but other than that, its a good article. Best part, I'm not in it!
     
  8. Tugela

    Tugela Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,713
    Likes Received:
    439
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Although Kaempher took it upon himself to hold press conferences and the like, he didn't have anything to do with the investigation as such. Basically he was meddling by virtue of his position as city manager, and I think it very likely that he was nowhere near as much in the loop as he would have had us believe.

    Cold cases can be solved after long periods but it is very rare. In some of those cases DNA evidence long gathered is analysed and that provided the break, but that would not happen here. In other instances people get convicted in circumstantial cases, where time makes it more difficult for an accused to defend themselves. In circumstantial cases there is a relatively high false conviction rate because the conviction is based on appearances rather than evidence as such, and particularly when the conviction happens long after the crime. Remember, a conviction does not mean indisputable guilt, it just means that a prosecutor managed to get a jury to believe in guilt. In those sorts of situations the common factor typically is some sort of activist prosecutor/group that stays on it and pushes it, and typically the conviction is to give closure to the victims rather than justice based on the evidence.

    At this point I doubt there is any physical evidence to be gathered any more, and anything else would have to rely on people's memories, which, after three years, are not going to be anything approaching accurate any more. I really don't see what more they can do at this point. They can talk to people again, and perhaps get more stories, but that is all it will be, stories. Unless someone confesses of course, but chances are that won't happen. The time to have really dealt with all of this would have been in the first three weeks, and unfortunately, that was not done.
     
  9. Suthrnqt

    Suthrnqt Verified Luddite

    Messages:
    3,594
    Likes Received:
    100
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Just throwing this out there:

    Does anyone think this is a case of-- what they know and what they can prove are 2 different things.???
     
  10. Linda7NJ

    Linda7NJ Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    31,785
    Likes Received:
    6,751
    Trophy Points:
    113

    Absolutely


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  11. TobyWong*

    TobyWong* Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,096
    Likes Received:
    806
    Trophy Points:
    113
    So sad that it's been a year since Hailey was found.
    Imo a new investigation wouldn't yield much since the major players have had adequate time to figure out what holes to fill & what to fill them with. Like "what couch" or "no that wall/room was'nt painted" etc...
    Just so sad for this gorgeous girl. I hope her remains stay where they are. Easily accessible, not touched by anyone eles until they are needed or we have even better technology to tell what happened to her. I only hope her murderer(s) worry and fret every single day thinking the same thing. Jmo
     
  12. Knox

    Knox Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    23,639
    Likes Received:
    130,610
    Trophy Points:
    113
    yes!!
     
  13. carbuff

    carbuff Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    27,344
    Likes Received:
    51,764
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Most likely, yes.

    I agree that having an outside team going back to the beginning and reviewing everything might be productive. It's been an effective technique in other cases whether or not the initial investigation was botched.
     
  14. Knox

    Knox Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    23,639
    Likes Received:
    130,610
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Tugela, you and I have opposing viewpoints on most aspects of Hailey's case. I respect your right to voice your opinions. However, most of the points you make in the above three posts are painted with a generic and broad brush.

    "Caricatures put up by a bunch of middle aged woman"?
    Hailey didn't like angels?
    How do you know the women are middle aged, what an odd thing to say?

    "Starting from scratch won't really help, if there is no evidence there is no evidence".
    I strongly disagree. I have seen crime shows where another set of eyes new to the case, caught something other investigators missed entirely, or followed up on a lead with different results.

    "In circumstantial cases there is a relatively high false conviction rate because the conviction is based on appearances rather than evidence".
    I hope I am never seated on a jury with you.

    "In those sorts of situations the common factor typically is some sort of activist prosecutor/group that stays on it and pushes it, and typically the conviction is to give closure to the victims rather than justice based on the evidence".
    Do you really believe this?
     
  15. Knox

    Knox Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    23,639
    Likes Received:
    130,610
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Bringing this news story from Heather Elvis' case here. The prosecutor states, "circumstantial evidence is just as good as direct evidence to convict someone of murder with no body".

    http://www.wbtw.com/story/24823249/horry-county-police-explain-whats-nex

    They are still looking for Heather and I think LE is hoping one of the defendant's will accept a plea deal, in return for her location.

    We're not privy to the type of evidence LE has in Hailey's case. But in Heather's case cell phone calls/records/pings are playing a large role, along with video surveillance footage.

    Is there enough circumstantial evidence in Hailey's case SCSO? Is it a matter of the DA is not willing to bring forward charges?
     
  16. sreshowtime

    sreshowtime Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    6,501
    Likes Received:
    84
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Not a day goes by that I don't think of Hailey Dunn. Sometimes I pull up my map and just have a little cry when I zoom in on where (some of?) Hailey's earthly remains were located, out in that ugly field, all those days after she was made to go missing.

    I agree with Toby- let what remains there are, stay there, on the EVIDENCE shelf...

    There are days I wonder if reliable parties ever did more searching in a mile or 2 radius out from where her remains were found ( Nannymo, you ever hear anything that might have indicated such?)
    ...to see if there were more. LE didn't seem to be there very long...so I don't know if that means they found more than has been alluded to or what...I don't specifically recall that MSM ever quoted LE on exactly WHAT was found...

    Knox- the remains apparently are being held as evidence...not merely lying in a morgue waiting to be picked up...imho that they are there tells me there is something quite possibly important about them.

    Suthrnqt- I think they know but unable to prove...at this point in time....
    and I think there was another place between Chestnut and the area at the lake.....

    Hailey is gone...I believe to a far better place that we can only dream about....but...she is not forgotten. Someone knows what happened...how do they live with themselves.
     
  17. kirby

    kirby New Member

    Messages:
    165
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Can't post a link because the Snyder newspaper is "pay per view", but the latest article states Sheriff Wilson is still awaiting lab results.
     
  18. Knox

    Knox Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    23,639
    Likes Received:
    130,610
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Kirby I was just coming here to ask someone to paraphrase the article. Specifically; anything in quotes from Wilson. Was there anything else he said?

    sres, good to see you my friend. Not many know about the hundreds and hundreds of hours you spent mapping. Your heart for Hailey is evident in your post, hugs to you.
     
  19. kirby

    kirby New Member

    Messages:
    165
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    He said there was no new information.

    He said scurry county was the lead but others involved were
    FBI, Texas rangers, dps, 32 district attorney in sweet water, Colorado city police and Mitchell county sheriff.

    I don't understand why lab results are still pending.
     
  20. WideOpen

    WideOpen Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    2,537
    Likes Received:
    2,733
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I will never forget Hailey! It is so hard to believe it has been a year since Hailey's remains were found. Thank you all for being here.

    JMO
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page



  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice