ú

HI HI - Amanda Eller, 35, Trail near Makawao, Maui, 8 May 2019

Discussion in 'Located Persons Discussion' started by Moxie_McTavish, May 11, 2019.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. puakenikeni

    puakenikeni Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,333
    Likes Received:
    519
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Right, there are all types of relationships, including where it is fine, or barely tolerable, or absolute freak out justified.
    As for worry that something terrible has happened, so much depends on the missing person, and the communication and agreement on communications that exists with a couple matters.

    What’s weird to me is saying you’ve never spent a night apart, in a year, but then without any sign or communication, your SO doesn’t come home, answer calls texts or whatever. Is “independence” really a good reason not to worry, if the SO hasn’t been exerting her independence about staying out overnight for a whole year, hasn’t discussed it, you have not had a fight, just out of the blue?

    I would ave even worried about an accident at the very least. I would probably call the hospital before the police. I’d also look at the police alerts and the news. Hawaii has Nixle alerts for police advisories.

    In my 20’s, in the counter culture, calling “the man” was just not done, lol. But that was another time.
     
  2. Alohaj

    Alohaj Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    220
    Likes Received:
    795
    Trophy Points:
    93
    The information about the friend canceling because their kitten died came directly from the police.
     
  3. puakenikeni

    puakenikeni Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,333
    Likes Received:
    519
    Trophy Points:
    113
    It looks that way, but someone else could also have done that.

    I think the police said the key was hidden under the car (tire?) and not on the top of the tire, but I see it described both ways.

    I have done things like that when absent minded or distracted and then realized and have gone and unlocked the car in order to fix it.

    A person could be attacked or something in that process and the key stuck under the car.

    Until one indisputable witness puts Amanda herself in that parking lot in May 8, or even in the forest, one just cannot know if she was ever there that day.
     
  4. puakenikeni

    puakenikeni Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,333
    Likes Received:
    519
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I might be weird this way, but I’m not too big on having a theory of what happened. What I try to do is keep track of what is definite and what is not. That’s my process.

    It’s so easy for a narrative to get started, and you trace it to its roots and it is not verified at all.
     
  5. Cardinal47

    Cardinal47 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,593
    Likes Received:
    5,520
    Trophy Points:
    113
    That makes me think of what we actually do know. Amanda was seen at the post office and grocery store that morning. Her car, phone, purse and sandles she was wearing in the videos were in the car found at the park! Is that about it?
     
  6. puakenikeni

    puakenikeni Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,333
    Likes Received:
    519
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I wonder though if they also got it from Ben. I originally read it as part of Ben’s explanation. I can’t remember if it was that first press conference.

    I don’t remember the police saying they spoke directly to the friend, but would love to note that if so.

    I’m not even saying I don’t believe it. I think it’s believable. I just like to know original sources. If they think he’s a credible source, they may just repeat it.
     
    cass523, human, happyday and 4 others like this.
  7. HaikuMommy

    HaikuMommy Active Member

    Messages:
    250
    Likes Received:
    123
    Trophy Points:
    43
    I keep despairing that she left her phone in the car. Plenty of reasons to, though. Her outfit didn't look to have pockets. If she was looking for a waterfall, you usually have to trek over rocky streams -- so if you don't have pockets, you might leave your phone behind, so as not to drop it in accidentally. Especially if reception wasn't good in the area. And apparently she liked to "unplug" that way.

    As for whether she planned to swim, the "swimability" near waterfalls often depends how recently it rained. Right after rains, waterfalls can be full of runoff and carry large branches, etc., but swimming can be very nice other times. At Twin Falls, for example, you can have a very different experience depending how recently it rained.

    Anyway, since her car was locked and the key was by the tire, I think she headed into the forest and THEN something happened. I'm personally thinking 90% chance it's an accident, 10% chance Amanda met with foul play. If she came out of the forest and someone was there with a crowbar about to break into her car, for example. Or if some creep was scoping out cars and decided to follow the pretty yoga instructor into the woods instead.

    Break-ins at trailheads are not uncommon, and there was an especially bad rash of break-ins in the area two years ago (see link below). That summer, one car with a diaper bag left on the front seat was broken into and had it's windshield AND two other windows smashed in (why the rage?). Side note: I'm always surprised anyone would leave bags in plan view, but it happens. Lots of people learn the hard way that Maui has thieves and drug addicts just like anywhere else.

    Hoping and praying she's found safe, soon.

    https://mauinow.com/2017/08/01/wanted-maui-police-release-surveillance-image-of-olinda-car-break-in/
     
  8. FactFinder3000

    FactFinder3000 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    112
    Likes Received:
    741
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Well that's precisely what I was thinking. She may have had a lot on her mind.

    I'm wondering if it was normal for her to send a gift and letter to her Mother like she did.
     
    human, happyday, HulaMum and 2 others like this.
  9. Cardinal47

    Cardinal47 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,593
    Likes Received:
    5,520
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I'm thinking maybe things were left in plain view for a reason. A car break in could destroy evidence but leave brand new DNA to confuse the scene. I don't believe Amanda would leave those things in plain sight.
    I also believe she would take her phone. A phone is taken for safety and if she wanted to detach for a while she could turn it off!
     
    cass523, avid_dk, human and 5 others like this.
  10. Cardinal47

    Cardinal47 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    3,593
    Likes Received:
    5,520
    Trophy Points:
    113
    it was a mother's day gift.
     
    human, HelpingHeart and wary like this.
  11. Mizzamzz

    Mizzamzz Member

    Messages:
    12
    Likes Received:
    75
    Trophy Points:
    13
    Keep in mind that it’s not uncommon these days to have 2 phones.
    1 for work and 1 personal phone, so as to keep those 2 things separate.
    I have 2 phones. My work phone has a lot more email contacts in it than my personal phone and my work phone doesn’t have any personal contacts for my family or friends, apart from my husbands number being saved in the work phone.
    It would explain both why she wouldn’t take that phone with her & also why there were no contacts in that phone for Amanda’s parents or siblings if it was a work phone.

    This isn’t information that the general public would need to know, & potentially something the MPD would not advertise in hope that the phone gets switched on and is able to be pinged, if foul play is involved.

    As a side note, and MOO, it’s very worrying how there are now 3-4 reports of women saying that a man in a white van has tried to lure them to his van. All descriptions of this man are the same description and 1 in particular happened only a few days ago in a different trail parking lot.

    Very coincidental that the off duty fire fighter reported a white van parked near Amanda’s car around midday on the 8th too.
    Fingers crossed this is being investigated further.
     
  12. FactFinder3000

    FactFinder3000 Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    112
    Likes Received:
    741
    Trophy Points:
    93
    By 'normal' I meant routine. Was it something she generally did? Did she send her mother a gift and a letter for last year's mother's day, for example?
     
  13. Moxie_McTavish

    Moxie_McTavish Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    258
    Likes Received:
    592
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Mm-hmmmmm.
    Find him, MPD.
    White van, older man, short dark hair, dark complected, scruffy looking, has 2 dogs.

    Description (by off duty fireman around noon on 5/8?) of other vehicles in parking lot said man with 2 dogs in white Toyota van...at least that's my understanding.

    If there is foul play involved with Amanda's disappearance, this seems like the top lead to chase, given the disturbing accounts coming out from around Maui about a guy in white van w/ 2 dogs.

    EDIT: But to be fair, the accounts are not saying this guy in the white van tried to "lure them into his van." One report was that he was looking in someone's window in Napili, another woman said he tried to call her over to talk to her at the Pali trailhead, and another woman said the day before Amanda disappeared she saw a guy in a white van drive through the Makawao Forest Reserve parking lot and it looked like he was casing the place.
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2019
  14. Alohaj

    Alohaj Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    220
    Likes Received:
    795
    Trophy Points:
    93
    I believe it came out of the press conference, and if the police state it (unless it’s information they’re withholding to protect an investigation), I am apt to believe it. I could be wrong, but, having family in law enforcement, I don’t think they would release information like that based solely on what the boyfriend may have told them. My family member in law-enforcement always says “it’s not what you know, it’s what you can prove” lol.

    I don’t recall if they gave that information in their narrative, or if it was an answer to a question from one of the reporters. If I recall correctly it was the latter; they were asked and that was their answer.
     
    cass523, windrower, iluvmua and 2 others like this.
  15. OnlyFacts

    OnlyFacts New Member

    Messages:
    1
    Likes Received:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    3
    Does anyone really know why the police haven't been updating very often ?
     
  16. Mizzamzz

    Mizzamzz Member

    Messages:
    12
    Likes Received:
    75
    Trophy Points:
    13
    [QUOTE="Moxie_McTavish, post:
    EDIT: But to be fair, the accounts are not saying this guy in the white van tried to "lure them into his van." One report was that he was looking in someone's window in Napili, another woman said he tried to call her over to talk to her at the Pali trailhead, and another woman said the day before Amanda disappeared she saw a guy in a white van drive through the Makawao Forest Reserve parking lot and it looked like he was casing the place.[/QUOTE]

    I apologise if we’re not allowed to link to social media posts, but from this thread here

    A lady named Naomie Marie posted:
    “Not sure if it’s worth reporting. I went hiking Sunday 5/12. I left my car parked at the Lahaina Pali trail off of Honoapiilani hwy. When I made it back to my car there was an older man darker complected with dark here standing outside of a white van with 2 dogs inside. There was no sign that he was out there hiking. Seemed as if he was just hanging out. He was quite insistent on me coming over to his car. I ignored him and got in my car and left. I doubt there’s any connection considering the distance between the two trails but his behavior was odd and made me feel very uneasy.”

    Then in her thread she commented again to say:
    “Before I got into my car he simply just asked me to come over. I ignored him and got into my car. While I was in my car he was watching me and when I made eye contact with him
    he pointed at me and gestured me to roll down my window and then a gesture “waving me over”.”

    And also:
    “I wrote down everything in detail that I remember. Trying to not blur the lines of what I remember with what I’ve seen other people posting. I just remember thinking immediately this guy isn’t here to hike or was hiking and I felt uncomfortable enough to pull out my mace. If anything I hope what I report to the tip line will at the least have them look more into this van they spotted near her car.”

    I know I’m speculating in saying this, but if Amanda walked over to a van in a similar scenario and she was quickly grabbed & put in the back by a 2nd accomplice, I don’t think there will have been much sign of a struggle. Nor do I think they would have been looking for signs like this in the first day or 2 after she was reported missing as they would not have had reason to look for these signs initially. I’m sure by the time it occurred to them that it could also be a possibility that she wasn’t lost that there would have been plenty of vehicles & people coming and going from this area.

    It may also explain why the tracker dog picked up her scent only for a moment at the entrance to the trail, then it was lost (this information has also only been repeated by word of mouth, never directly by MPD - that I can find).
     
    cass523, sassyblue, windrower and 4 others like this.
  17. Moxie_McTavish

    Moxie_McTavish Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    258
    Likes Received:
    592
    Trophy Points:
    93
    Mizzamzz, I read those posts last night on FindAmanda page, and I'm so glad she gave her info to the police.

    However, it's still an assumption on our parts to think he was trying to "lure her into his van." The only thing she describes is him gesturing her to come over to where he stood to presumably talk with him. Would he have asked her to enter the van or tried to force her into the van? Possibly. It's beyond the scope of what we can know. We can only assume. And yes, that would be my assumption too...But it's still just an assumption, because we don't know what his actual intentions were with this young woman.
     
    cass523, sassyblue, happyday and 4 others like this.
  18. Mizzamzz

    Mizzamzz Member

    Messages:
    12
    Likes Received:
    75
    Trophy Points:
    13
    @Moxie_McTavish
    That’s a good point. I should have worded it differently and left out the luring assumption.
    I can’t edit it, but I agree with you.
     
    happyday likes this.
  19. puakenikeni

    puakenikeni Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,333
    Likes Received:
    519
    Trophy Points:
    113
    This may well be the same creepy white van guy, with two dogs. Could frequent multiple trail parking lots. Hope the police find him to at least interview and get his story.

    AlohaJ, thanks for the reply about who mentioned the canceled plans. I went back and found Ben’s mention in the press conference and the police live media update. Ben’s reply is around the 20 minute mark of the Mother’s Day PC with Sarah, Ben, the Ellers, Kimberlyn Scott (amazing person). Ben said that Amanda did not have plans for her day off because the plans she did have with a friend were cancelled by the friend. He didn’t say anything to indicate she was a mutual friend, just a friend.

    The police said Amanda had plans with a friend to show her the Haiku house where A & B had moved recently, but the friend’s kitten had been run over during “the night” and she was distraught and wanted to cancel. So “I assume” that happened Monday night and not Tuesday night, but he doesn’t say, nor does he say if the police spoke to the friend or not. So much for that for now.

    In the process of revisiting the media videos, I found several things I just want to note that struck me, unrelated details. I’m going to put ina separate post to keep this post shorter.
     
    cass523 and windrower like this.
  20. puakenikeni

    puakenikeni Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    1,333
    Likes Received:
    519
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Things I noticed:
    The police did initially think something was unusual (not the normal lost hiker), so they did process the car and scene as if it might be a crime scene. The reason they gave was the purse and packages in plain view in her car, which the police said they don’t typically see. So that is the perspective of MPD, that most people do not leave valuables.

    Then the officer says that after he spoke to “her friends” who said they all do that to “unplug,” so it seemed more like she would have done that, but they had already done some processing of the scene as if it were a crime, so that may be good if it turns out it was.

    Second he admits when pressed that the minimal dog response doesn’t jibe with her taking a hike or run from the car, as they would have expected more of a sustained response.

    He says he “can’t” say what point the dog lost the scent. Not clear if he cannot reveal due to investigation, or he simply doesn’t have the info at hand, but he does not offer to find that info and make it available, even though people really want to know that.

    He says they did canvas the Haiku area around the post office and store for more camera footage, but got nothing.

    The cell phone forensics are still ongoing. In my experience with following the Charli Scott case, MPD does not release the cell phone info or any other forensics to the public if it turns into a potential crime. That was not released until the trial, over a year later.

    He said there was no sign of a struggle “inside” her car, first, then later said around the car. From the timeline, they didn’t necessarily have any reports about a truck or van in the lot at that early time, so I can imagine that if something happened in another vehicle they did not know about yet, that was not at the scene any more, that maybe it didn’t get picked up.

    He said her key was “under the car.” Not on the tire and he didn’t say under the tire, no mention of the tire, no mention that it looked strategically hidden, just that the key was under the car. Maybe it was placed very carefully, but he didn’t say it like that, so we don’t know.”

    Her wallet had both credit cards and her ID in it, and the phone was in the purse, not separate. The slippahs she wore in the store video were also on the floorboards.

    The water bottle in the car on the seat with the backpack was “full.”

    They say the car was seen shortly after noon, which I think is from the off duty firemen, and later when the gate was locked. The employee locking the gate did go into the trail a bit and called for whoever may have left the car, and then reported the car presence on a hotline thing they have (DLNR?) at that time, per protocol when they have to lock in a vehicle.

    Note: in Ben’s statement to the media on the 12th, he said he gave the police a list of places she liked going, like the beach, waterfalls, and then the Maui Forest Reserve just “popped into” his head and sure enough the”cops” found her car there and called him.

    So he presented it like it was more of an intuitive flash he had then that it was highest on the known list of spots, or even on the list at first thought of most likely day off spots, but it came intuitively to him.
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2019
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page



  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice