Holly Bobo, missing from TN 2014 discussion #2 ***ARREST***

[Carla Lashelle]

Drug addiction doesn't qualify for an insanity defense, IMO

Not in my book.

I have had the interesting opportunity to have lived through/experience a variety of life crappy situations including psychological illness, drug abuse, assault, rape, attempted murder, and being homeless. I would never consider myself insane from drugs, psychosis, etc. And, I have been really, really, out there sometimes. Plus, I was never violent. Never hurt anyone. Never committed crimes while high or off my meds, etc. And, if I did, I would know it was wrong. I'd feel really, really, bad about it. I just don't buy these insanity defenses and excuses like drugs.

That is not to say that there are not some truly insane people out there... but ZA is not one of them.

 

[~n/t~]

http://www.jacksonsun.com/article/20140316/NEWS01/303160005/Why-wasn-t-Zachary-Adams-behind-bars-

Why wasn't Zachary Adams behind bars?
Some blame justice system in Holly Bobo's death, but Adams' history reflects normal judicial practice in state of Tennessee

From the article

But according to legal experts, it does not appear the way Adams was treated by the court system varies from typical practices in Tennessee. As happened with Adams, many offenders in the state typically serve no more than one-third of their jail sentences, and those with drug problems are often routed to treatment programs rather than jail.


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I hope they change the laws in TN. This guy should not have been walking the streets.

 

[~n/t~]

Not in my book.

I have had the interesting opportunity to have lived through/experience a variety of life crappy situations including psychological illness, drug abuse, assault, rape, attempted murder, and being homeless. I would never consider myself insane from drugs, psychosis, etc. And, I have been really, really, out there sometimes. Plus, I was never violent. Never hurt anyone. Never committed crimes while high or off my meds, etc. And, if I did, I would know it was wrong. I'd feel really, really, bad about it. I just don't buy these insanity defenses and excuses like drugs.

That is not to say that there are not some truly insane people out there... but ZA is not one of them.

So we agree

 

[Carla Lashelle]

From the article

But according to legal experts, it does not appear the way Adams was treated by the court system varies from typical practices in Tennessee. As happened with Adams, many offenders in the state typically serve no more than one-third of their jail sentences, and those with drug problems are often routed to treatment programs rather than jail.


---

I hope they change the laws in TN. This guy should not have been walking the streets.

People wonder why ZA was out... no different here in FL or most other states. My partner went to high school with a girl who was later murdered by a well known, convicted, pervert from California. The guy was convicted of rape and hacking the victims arms off with an axe. He got an early relased, relocated to FL, and raped againa and also killed. By chance my partner saw her name and photo in the newspaper and realized who it was. Another guy who should NEVER have been relased.

 

[AmandaReckonwith]

Justice for Holly (subsection of main archive) Case Archive:

http://s296.photobucket.com/user/crankycrankerson/library/Holly%20Bobo%20%20-TN-/Justice%20for%20Holly#/user/crankycrankerson/library/Holly%20Bobo%20%20-TN-/Justice%20for%20Holly?sort=6&page=1&_suid=139498837976809550035883197934

 

[jggordo]

I am finding that ZA did spend time incarcerated. Letting him out and TN's parole situation is another subject all together IMO. My point is this. The DA and Judge with it being such a small jurisdiction HAD to know even without the family pointing it out to them what dangers they were putting the community in. What is the point of handing out a sentence and putting that in place if you are not going to enforce them.

And at the end of the day, he was away from the METH to have not had a "chemical dependency" to it when let out. So going back to it was a conscious decision that HE made. IIRC he was incarcerated for 8 months one time and 6 months another. So unless he was "using" while in the joint he should have been clean and sober when he got out.

These are my opinions and observations

 

[Bernina]

Just read all the posts, playing catch up..........
Taking you all back to 1986, a little movie called "At Close Range" starring Sean Penn and Christopher Walken, based on a true story. Ironically, the actual incident took place in Pennsylvania (1960-70's), but it was filmed in Tennessee.

"Crews", "Gangs", "Mafia", etc., have the tendency to be seen as a "big city problem" by the average person. In rural communities, the only minor difference is extended family and local LE ties, and the type of stolen property that hits the black market. You rub shoulders with these "protected criminals" at the post office, the diner, gas station, grocery store, hear the gossip/rumors, and one of your kids may even comment about this or that house dealing dope or a front for stolen property.

When my kids were in their teens, they knew more about illegal activity in our rural area than the sheriff. And the sheriff would be the first to say that concerned parents who picked up the phone when overhearing their kids talking about that kind of stuff put many of their investigations on the right track.

But you had to get the sheriff's attention.

Investigators prohibiting local LE in on the search warrants and the actual searches says a lot to me. Multiple felonies committed and minimal if any convictions obtained or followed through with harsh penalties on ZA raises a red flag.

I wouldn't be surprised if Holly Bobo's murder and ZA's trial creates a ripple effect through their rural community, exposing local government corruption.....but, then again?

It seems to me that ZA's "crew" stepped on someone's toes with the pearl theft. Maybe his crew got too big for their britches and someone wanted to take them down a peg or two. And Meth makes people TALK, specially when they're "coming down" off a high, "jonesing" for more dope, adding to their "credibility" as a "bad ***", or looking at hard time.

I don't doubt for one second that CI's, running in that circle, knew who was responsible for HB's disappearance and what happened to her within a week, if not 48 hours, after she disappeared. I don't doubt that some of the local LE were aware too, but had their own motives, albeit nefarious, for keeping quiet.

That's just my opinion and experience.:twocents:

 

[Dogface]

If he can use a meth induced psychosis as a defense I will be so freaking mad! It's one thing when someone is truly a psychopath, but when you make yourself one by abusing your body with drugs that is a CHOICE! I understand addiction and at some point it's not as simple to explain as a choice, but rather a dependency, but still, at some point it was a choice! IMO that should never be a viable defense!!

 

[Lovejac]

I'm just now reading everyones comments about how the Bobo family seems to believe Holly is dead.

My opinion is this, if she were my child, it would take some seriously strong evidence for me to believe she was no longer on this earth. I think that's par for the course with most parents with missing children. Whatever proof LE gave them must be pretty big. I wish we knew what it was.

 

[R.U.Kidding!]

I am of the opinion that this kidnapping was planned by ZA. He knew what time she left for work, the surrounding area, means of escape, and how to incapacitate Holly . This was not done after a night of Meth use. I cannot believe someone whacked out on Meth would have control of thought to pull this off as a kidnapping. If he was on meth wouldn't he just go ballistic when he happened across Holly and do more damage to her right there in the driveway.

So it seems to me even if the defense wants to use the "I was high on meth, therefore not responsible" I do not think that will help. Too much forethought went in to planning this, therefore it points to "Intent" ..a plan, not just a momentary lapse into insanity......IMO

.....and as far as LE being responsible in some way for allowing ZA to roam the streets. I think this is just the way the system is, and there are always going to be slips through the cracks of people like this, unfortunately these slip ups are why there are so many crimes. It sucks!!!

 

[Carla Lashelle]

I'm just now reading everyones comments about how the Bobo family seems to believe Holly is dead.

My opinion is this, if she were my child, it would take some seriously strong evidence for me to believe she was no longer on this earth. I think that's par for the course with most parents with missing children. Whatever proof LE gave them must be pretty big. I wish we knew what it was.

Uhhhhhh murder charges would more or less cement it... And yes I am sure the parents have been told much more than we have (we know they were told things ahead of the big press conference where the charges were announced).

 

[Foxfire]

http://www.jacksonsun.com/article/2...n-Report-says-Zach-Adams-assaulted-an-officer

Zachary Adams was arrested in Natchez Trace State Park on April 4, 2011, following a traffic stop.

Adams and his passenger Robert S. Moody, seemed nervous, the report says. Adams told the ranger he was bringing Moody to look at the damage and that the two men needed to get to the other side of the park.

Hill saw a six-pack of beer bottles in the back floorboard, and two of the bottles appeared to be open.

Hill asked Adams to step out of the truck and asked if there was anything illegal in the vehicle. Adams said “no,” and gave Hill permission to search the truck.

Rangers also found a pill bottle on Moody containing seven different pills, the report said.

Along with resisting arrest and assaulting the officer, Adams was charged with possession of drug paraphernalia, drug possession, tampering with evidence, reckless driving and violation of the open container law.

Moody was charged with drug possession.

The Henderson County Sheriff’s Department was asked to respond to assist with the investigation and transport Adams and Moody to the Henderson County Criminal Justice Complex.
<sniped - read more>
______________

https://offender.fdle.state.fl.us/offender/flyer.do?personId=33260
Florida Department of Law Enforcement - Sexual Offender / Predator Flyer
RSO - Robert Shawn Moody

 

[Lovejac]

Uhhhhhh murder charges would more or less cement it... And yes I am sure the parents have been told much more than we have (we know they were told things ahead of the big press conference where the charges were announced).

I, myself, would hold out hope even if murder charges were filed. I would have to see/know what evidence brought them to that charge. It would just be too hard for me to accept without some really strong proof.

 

[Bernina]

I am of the opinion that this kidnapping was planned by ZA. He knew what time she left for work, the surrounding area, means of escape, and how to incapacitate Holly . This was not done after a night of Meth use. I cannot believe someone whacked out on Meth would have control of thought to pull this off as a kidnapping. If he was on meth wouldn't he just go ballistic when he happened across Holly and do more damage to her right there in the driveway.

So it seems to me even if the defense wants to use the "I was high on meth, therefore not responsible" I do not think that will help. Too much forethought went in to planning this, therefore it points to "Intent" ..a plan, not just a momentary lapse into insanity......IMO

.....and as far as LE being responsible in some way for allowing ZA to roam the streets. I think this is just the way the system is, and there are always going to be slips through the cracks of people like this, unfortunately these slip ups are why there are so many crimes. It sucks!!!

People on Meth can have "tunnel vision" when they embark on a specific task, to the point of obsession. Unless they are predisposed to psychosis, they will carry out what ever catches their fancy to the most minute detail.
Examples:
Meth head decides to clean the kitchen floor......becomes an all day task to the point of using a toothbrush to clean the corners and next to the floor boards.
Tweaker decides to tear down their motorcycle engine.......give them 12 hours and it's nothing but nuts, bolts, gaskets, and the few pieces that can't be stripped down any further.
A crank fiend notices a black head on their face, spends 4 hours at the bathroom mirror "popping" pores they "think" are black heads. (notice the sores on almost all tweakers' faces?)
Throw in a criminal endeavor and they'll have it planned for every conceivable disruption. There's always Plan B, C, D, etc. Part of that has to do with a touch of drug induced paranoia.

ZA carefully planned this abduction, knew exactly every how, where, when, and had the experience of his first attempt with Sullivan to bolster his 2nd attempt with HB. Camo clothes? Being there when HB was ready to leave? Little noise? Straight shot out to the woods? Leaving a trail of discarded items from HB? 3 years investigating before search and arrest warrants, oh yah, this was planned. Meth would have made the whole situation that much more horrifying and deliberate for any victim. The question is: Why? Did ZA see HB as a possible threat, or conquest to >insert whatever<? Or was she just someone who "fit" his plan?

Meth/crank/speed has been used for decades by people in various trades of construction, heavy equipment operators, repetitive tasks (ie. circuit board manufacturing) and agriculture. It has also been used in the military "legally" under the guise of "go pills", since WW2. Being so common place, legal or otherwise, you'd expect a lot of "issues" in that population of users.

Meth as an excuse? Unless ZA has a record of psychotic episodes, both during incarceration and on the outside in a mental health center, not gonna happen.

Someone who knew the specifics of this crime opened their mouth, otherwise, I don't think it would have ever been brought before a Judge.:twocents:

 

[Hatfield]

What may or may not have happened in other cases doesn't tell us what they did or didn't find.

Simply put, we don't know what we don't know. Is it possible they found something? Sure. Is it possible they didn't? Sure. Our lack of knowing doesn't tell what we don't know. And we'll know when we know.

Wait a minute. I do know that I dont know. Doesnt that count for anything?

This case continues to drive me crazy.

 

[shefner]

http://www.jacksonsun.com/article/2...n-Report-says-Zach-Adams-assaulted-an-officer

Zachary Adams was arrested in Natchez Trace State Park on April 4, 2011, following a traffic stop.

Adams and his passenger Robert S. Moody, seemed nervous, the report says. Adams told the ranger he was bringing Moody to look at the damage and that the two men needed to get to the other side of the park.

Hill saw a six-pack of beer bottles in the back floorboard, and two of the bottles appeared to be open.

Hill asked Adams to step out of the truck and asked if there was anything illegal in the vehicle. Adams said “no,” and gave Hill permission to search the truck.

Rangers also found a pill bottle on Moody containing seven different pills, the report said.

Along with resisting arrest and assaulting the officer, Adams was charged with possession of drug paraphernalia, drug possession, tampering with evidence, reckless driving and violation of the open container law.

Moody was charged with drug possession.

The Henderson County Sheriff’s Department was asked to respond to assist with the investigation and transport Adams and Moody to the Henderson County Criminal Justice Complex.
<sniped - read more>
______________

https://offender.fdle.state.fl.us/offender/flyer.do?personId=33260
Florida Department of Law Enforcement - Sexual Offender / Predator Flyer
RSO - Robert Shawn Moody

Mmmmm.....wonder what became of Moody?

 

[jggordo]

Mmmmm.....wonder what became of Moody?

Yes, and people focus on the fact of this arrest, but to me it is more significant that he bonded out on $12500.00 I believe actually the day before Holly's abduction.

 

[Mountain_Kat]

Interesting read;

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/13/m....html?_r=4&src=me&ref=general&pagewanted=all&

Can You Call a 9-Year-Old a Psychopath?

Then last spring, the psychologist treating Michael referred his parents to Dan Waschbusch, a researcher at Florida International University. Following a battery of evaluations, Anne and Miguel were presented with another possible diagnosis: their son Michael might be a psychopath.

For the past 10 years, Waschbusch has been studying “callous-unemotional” children — those who exhibit a distinctive lack of affect, remorse or empathy — and who are considered at risk of becoming psychopaths as adults.
<sniped - read more>

For those interested in further reading on this subject, here's a case that I've always found incredibly disturbing.


http://www.crimelibrary.com/notorious_murders/famous/bell/index_1.html

 

[Mountain_Kat]

If he can use a meth induced psychosis as a defense I will be so freaking mad! It's one thing when someone is truly a psychopath, but when you make yourself one by abusing your body with drugs that is a CHOICE! I understand addiction and at some point it's not as simple to explain as a choice, but rather a dependency, but still, at some point it was a choice! IMO that should never be a viable defense!!

Won't happen for a number of reasons. Here are just a few:

1. If the addiction were to prescription drugs, and they could establish a legitimate reason for the defendant to have initially been prescribed those drugs, that might be something the defense would be willing to gamble on. But NO defense attorney is going to latch on to an addiction to an illegal drug, with no medical benefits what-so-ever, as a defense strategy.

2. I would imagine the defense will hope to steer as clear from the meth situation as they possibly can. The prosecution will need a legitimate reason to introduce this in court, in other words, it has to have relevance to Holly's murder. A good defense attorney, imo, would fight like hell to keep this information out. They would argue that it isn't relevant , not that it was so relevant that it was the primary motivator in the crime.

3. The public, in general , already have very clear images of meth addicts planted in their psyches. It's an ugly ugly picture. If you were ZA defense attorney, would YOU want the jury to view YOUR client through this filter? Do you think they will find some pity in their hearts for someone who, by their own choice, turned themselves into a monster? I'm guessing "no".

MOO

 

[CarolinaMoon]

Anyway, VOLUNTARY INTOXICATION is not a viable defense in any state as far as I know.