IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #16

Discussion in 'Cold Cases' started by nikkiw319, Jul 13, 2012.

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  1. MotherOcean

    MotherOcean Well-Known Member

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    BBM --

    I have multiple theories. I'm not ready to settle on one though I do have one that really screams at me. But, neither Lyric's size nor age affects any of them.
     


  2. Jules71

    Jules71 Well-Known Member

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    They also requested video from First Security State bank. Maybe they went west on Brovan then circled north on River Forest in front of Lederman's then over by the bank and then cut thru to the Fareway grocery store. Or maybe that was before the cctv showed them the last time.

    ETA: Darn it didn't bring your map over when I quoted your post.

    Sent from my Kindle Fire using Tapatalk 2
     
  3. lemon

    lemon Heeding previous admonitions.

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    Hmm, yes that could have been their route, too. See now, I didn't know that about the bank footage request. Even if the girls weren't seen on the footage, the fact that they wanted it - To me, it implies that LE was looking for either them or the abductor to maybe be captured on it. So maybe LE does have reason to believe they were up around this area...
     
  4. katydid23

    katydid23 Well-Known Member

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    I think they often say that, just to keep the person from freaking out.

    I just think it is odd that the lakefront homeowner said someone borrowed their paddle boat without permission on that day. And no one came forward. So I think there might be something to it.

    I don't think the girls were ever on it. But I think it might have been what caught the girls attention and the perps might have used ti to their advantage.

    It would have been the perfect way to convince the girls to leave their bikes there by the gate. And a perfect way to get them to walk somewhere if they thought they were going to a boat waiting nearby.
     
  5. MotherOcean

    MotherOcean Well-Known Member

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    BBM --

    Was that info. about a homeowner saying someone had borrowed their paddle boat reported in MSM? I have been thinking it was a rumor, but I'd love to read the article or watch the video if it's available on-line anywhere.
     
  6. Jules71

    Jules71 Well-Known Member

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    Re: The paddle boat

    What if the person on the paddle boat was the look out for whoever dumped the bikes? So maybe instead of it being used as a lure, there was someone in the boat in contact with whoever was leaving the bikes --telling him the coast was clear.

    Sent from my Kindle Fire using Tapatalk 2
     
  7. Sunlight

    Sunlight New Member

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    I think the paddleboat is a shiny object. MOO
     
  8. TeenyTaurus

    TeenyTaurus Member

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  9. nikb

    nikb Active Member

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    I don't have a specific theory in mind at this point, but here are the reasons I feel like it could be important:

    - In terms of witnesses, from a distance, I'm not sure it would look like two little girls riding bikes. Especially with Lyric reportedly being on a mountain bike. I keep thinking back to the young boy fishing at the lake and Aunt T. asking him if he saw "two little girls" on bikes. He very well might've seen them, but from a distance and maybe even just a quick glance, he didn't realize they were both kids. This makes a huge difference in figuring out if they were at the lake that day.

    - In terms of finding the girls, it's important to know what they both look like. Early on I saw quite a few photos of Elizabeth but it seemed like it took longer for ones of Lyric that were anything but a close up head-shot. When I first saw a full-length pic of her, I personally was expecting to see a child that looked younger and er..uh.. how to put this?... less 'developed' I guess (please no one take offense, I don't mean anything negative by this whatsoever). Before seeing full-length pictures I imagine that if I saw Lyric I'd have had no clue it was her because I'd think the child was older than 10. Elizabeth seems to me to be more consistent in her recent appearance - I'm sure it's because she's just enough younger that she's not changing so quickly. I sincerely doubt they're anywhere near where I live, but I do still look for them when I see kids out and about, just in case.

    - If the abductor was a freaky pervert looking for young girls it makes me think it's more likely that the abductor knows the family and the girls, or is at least familiar with them. Again just because from a distance, it doesn't seem like they'd appear to be two young girls.

    - There's also the difficulty factor... Elizabeth's so tiny she'd probably be fairly easy to pick up and run with. Lyric would be more difficult. Which makes me think (as I've thought all along) that they went willingly or at least semi-willingly.

    All MOO...

    ETA: I don't know that "pick up and run with" the kid is common at all for abductions - I can't actually think of an abduction that was like this. It was just one of those thoughts that ran through my head.
     
  10. nikb

    nikb Active Member

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    Huh... this sparked a thought I hadn't had before. Although I think I just talked myself out of this idea, I'll post it just in case it helps us think of anything.

    Would the girls have willingly gotten into a vehicle along with their bikes, so they could be driven to the lake for their bike ride? So they'd have a little longer to ride? It'd have to be someone they knew well in that case. The reason I talked myself out of it is it seems like it'd take longer to load and unload the bikes than to just race down to the lake.
     
  11. craftybatchy

    craftybatchy Verified Odd Duck

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    It is my understanding that Lyric did not take her glasses with her - they were found at the house.
     
  12. ktgirl

    ktgirl Verified College Instructor

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    After following the Mickey Shunick case, I really wish LE would release any video footage of the girls on their bikes that may exist.

    Mickey's abductor was seen on camera quickly switching lanes when he saw her riding her bike and following her down the street she was cycling on. The images of his vehicle, I believe, were instrumental in eventually connecting him to her kidnapping and murder.

    Maybe there's someone trailing behind (even far behind) the girls in the videos or someone giving them second looks. Or maybe sometime later, the perp on foot or the perp's car drives by in route to the trail/lake area. LE in Mickey's case asked the owners of several vehicles seen driving near her to contact them in case they've seen anything (and I assume to rule them out as perps). Eventually all were cleared except a 4 door late model Z71. People on the look out for RSOs and/or shady behavior with such vehicles reported some strange stuff Mickey's killer did (such as whiting out his RSO status on his driver's license). Allegedly someone in his family also reported his shady behavior as well.

    Perhaps releasing pics from the camera of Lyric & Elizabeth could help jog someone's memory, find potential witnesses (who didn't see the abduction but who could perhaps have mundane but pertinent info), or even lead to someone spotting a person (or vehicle) in the area who had some shady behavior in the days after the girls went missing.

    Just a thought. I wish they'd release the pics of the girls from the camera.

    I wish there was some sort of break or new info in this case. So sad.
     
  13. MNDad

    MNDad New Member

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    Would your theory work if some part of the "known" timeline was ficticious and it didn't matter what time they got down there?
     
  14. nikb

    nikb Active Member

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    Me too. :( For that matter, I'd love to see ANY pics of the girls on the bikes, even from days or weeks before. I think seeing what they looked like side by side on their bikes might really help jog someone's memory.
     
  15. nikb

    nikb Active Member

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    I wouldn't say it's a theory, more of a fleeting thought, but yeah... all kinds of theories work if we count just the LE timeline. My thought wouldn't work at all if I include Mr. C's sighting, and barely works if I include Mr. G's sighting. Well unless one of them was involved I suppose but I think that's extremely unlikely and I know it's not "sleuthable." What I was thinking of at first is if the girls truly hadn't been to the lake before maybe they stopped and asked a familiar person for directions, then the person said "hey jump in my car/van/truck/whatever, I'll just take you there." The sightings in between 12:11 and 3:58 are why I talked myself out of this idea so quickly, along with how close the lake is.

    But hmm... I wonder if they followed someone to the lake? Someone who knew the way and drove there, and said "follow me, I'll help you get to the lake."

    I really don't know of course. I think my last couple of ideas are unlikely scenarios for what happened, but I wanted to share the thoughts since they're a little different from what's been thrown out before and maybe someone will think of something that helps find these girls.
     
  16. Aunt B

    Aunt B Member

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    Another thought as people discuss the "bikes staged" angle and different routes the girls could have possibly taken on their bikes.....there has been a lot of great info shared about the types of dogs used in these investigations. What I can't help but wonder, is.....didn't LE have the dogs track from the actual house to see what route the girls DID take? That would seem to answer a lot of questions, not least of which being whether the girls had actually been ON the trail at all.
     
  17. JaimeInLA

    JaimeInLA Team Juan

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    Just caught up on the last thread and this one, and I wanted to say that I am SO on the same page as you. I have been since the beginning.
     
  18. JaimeInLA

    JaimeInLA Team Juan

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    Can anyone find a link to today's JVM?

    Also, was the supposed Fairway sighting on the day of the abduction?
     
  19. MotherOcean

    MotherOcean Well-Known Member

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    Yep. I think that is very possible.
     
  20. Thinkzerz

    Thinkzerz Well-Known Member

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    Why do you feel it is unlikely that one may be lying. It is possible. imo
     
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