IA IA - Johnny Gosch, 12, W Des Moines, 5 Sept 1982 - What happened? - #1

[miles_draken]

I remember the first time I realized that people take children. It was September 1982 in the city of Des Moines Iowa that an 11 year old paperboy named Johnny Gosch was taken while working his Sunday morning paper route. What followed was a completely botched investigation by the police department and a mother who made it her lifes work to make sure nothing like this ever happened to anyone else's child. Noreen Gosch has gone on to write legislation for missing children. Her own child Johnny was taken from her for 14 years. When she finally saw him again it was only briefly. He now lives under an assumed identity, fearful for his life. This is worthy of anyones time to read. It is a shocking account with more twists than anything Hollywood could come up with. God bless Noreen Gosch in all of her work, and God bless Johnny and all the other children like him who have met similair fates at the hands of these terrible people. I would welcome posts from anyone who knows more about this case. I've investigate what I could on the web. Here is a link to the web site Noreen Gosch started. I invite everyone to read their incredible story.

www.johnnygosch.com

 

[2sisters]

I read the story before about the man claiming to be Johnny coming to see her. Has it been confirmed as him? I wondered if it was a hoax when i read it, not that she was involved but someone was tricking her for fun. Some people might think that was funny and play with her that way.

 

[miles_draken]

According to Norreen it was indeed Johnny. She claimed that she answered the door and saw this grown man she didn't know with the childs eyes she had loved. It was by all accounts her son. She didn't admit to seeing him until on the stand testifing in a case. I think it was kept secret for something like 3 years if memory serves me correctly. There is so much more that continues to happen with this case after the book was written. As recently as last year Norreen found a blow up doll with a single bullet hole in the head placed outside her apartment door. It is an ongoing and sad saga. At one point her P.I. attended a child slavery auction hoping to buy JOhnny back, but he was not one of the children. This entire saga can be cross referenced with the Franklin Credit Union Cover-UP. What a sorted tale indeed.

 

[less0305]

This was an incredible story to read. I had absolutely no knowledge of this information....but at the time I would have been in my 20's and who knows if I was keeping up on political affairs and such. Gee, that is truly an amazing story.

 

[lisag]

I have a hard time believing it was actually Johnny who came to see her. Something sounds weird here...
Why would he not come forward and help have these people arrested...
Why would he not want to have a relationship with his mother ??
I am just not sure about this...

If it is him, it doesn't sound like he has actually escapes his hell, as he still has to hide....

I am on the fence here...

 

[VespaElf]

Lisa I agree.
This story is "fantastic" isn't it?

Child Slave auctions,assumed names,a vast international conspiracy-GIVE ME A BREAK!!!!!!!!

Where is the FBI? Why didn't the P.I tell them about this "auction" and since Johnny is an adult why would he have been there for "sale"?

This is a cruel hoax,a kooky conspiracy theory gone awry or someone so beheld by grief theyve gone mad.


Im not on the fence..........I don't buy it at all.
Yes Johnny went missing but everything else stinks of b.s!

 

[2sisters]

That's why I made a post on this forum. I am curious about proof, I read the conspiracy theory and it doesn't add up. I am so sorry for the Gosch family that they have not only lost a child but have been sucked into this.

 

[miles_draken]

all the evidence gathered was done by Norreen Gosch and her team of Private Detectives. I have thoroughly researched this and listened to her on many radio broadcasts, I firmly believe this story to be accurate. I don't know about the higher level government stuff, but read the Gunderson Report on the Franklin Credit Union scandal, it's very convincing. FBI and LE didn't assist much in this case from the beginning, there was no law back then, and they used their option to wait 72 hours to do anything. FBI never entered Johnny's case as a missing person, their response was they had no proof a crime had been committed. Just remember folks, truth is stranger than fiction!

 

[VespaElf]

Ever listen to AM Radio's "Coast To Coast" show?

There's "experts" on there too so you're telling me that if they sound convincing enough they're telling the truth?(for those who don't know "Coast To Coast" is a totally off the wall radio show with people calling in to discuss their alien abductions and how the CIA faked the moon landing!).
What reasearch have you done anyway? Reading Noreen's materials? Thats more than slightly biased no?
Noreen has my prayers and my sympathy and I belive fact is usually stranger than fiction but this far rereaching child slavery conspiracy is just cukoo .

I can read numerous books about all sorts of things and listen to a myriad of "experts" and "eyewitnesses" and "investigators" and I can belive what they say BUT that doesnt make it true.Look at the "satanic panic" in the '80s.Alot of innocent people were accused and convicted of being involved in a mass satanic child molestation conspiracy based on "investigators" and "experts" and lo and behold it wasn't true!

I am not trashing the Gosch family.They have been through hell but devoting time to this nonsense takes time away from real investigations.

If this story is true please tell me why hasen't Noreen and her"investigators" gone to the FBI? Why isn't NCMEC shouting about this from the rooftops? Wheres AMW?


When you can answer these questions I might be further inclined to listen.

 

[blaster]

It is a very ignorant thing to disbelieve in child slavery. This kind of thing happens all over the world and throughout history. So go ahead why don't you go to the press and discredit Johnny and Noreen Gosch I'd like to see what the reply would be, and for your info the FBI were investigating this and from what I've seen some of you should do a little researching yourselves before you junior investigators screw with someones life. As long as there are people like you kids like Johnny will never go home.
Special Agent FBI Ted L. Gunderson's report
:waitasec:

 

[miles_draken]

You are correct, the FBI did get involved in this case some time later. THey were told by Des Moines PD that they didn't need their help in the case, as they were treating it as a runaway, even though several eye-witnesses saw the car and mysterious man. This wasn't a runaway. It is amazing to me in a forum like this that people are so quickly to disbelieve a story like this. What exactly about this is unbelievable? A few years ago people would have said it unbelievable that terrorists could do the damage to this country that they've done. THings are only unbelievable until the masses believe. I don't know how much of the reports NOrreen and her investigators have uncovered is factual, but I truly believe her. She's crusaded for over twenty years now to help other children. Because of her there is no longer a 72 hour wait and see period, and the FBI become involved a lot more quickly. You can pick and choose what you want to believe from what has been presented with 20 years of research and investigation, but why is this any more unbelievable than the book " A Beautiful Child"? I know this is a true account of a strange case, should we dismiss the Johnny Gosch case as bull in comparison?

 

[blaster]

CNN NEWS
The day my God died and on and on........yahoo has 469,000 refs. of child sex slavery. But, none of this really happens and children don't really go missing they just get a little misplaced that's all. :liar:

 

[Ghostwheel]

CNN NEWS
The day my God died and on and on........yahoo has 469,000 refs. of child sex slavery. But, none of this really happens and children don't really go missing they just get a little misplaced that's all. :liar:

No one said this doesn't happen. They have stated their opinions that they don't think it happened in this particular case, BECAUSE it seems unlikely that if such a thing would happen, the the person to whom it happened to would just walk away and nothing would get settled, and no one would be investigated or arrested. They might have stated their opinion a little more gently, but it is still a valid opinion.

I thought there used to be a thread on this with a lot of really good information.
Website is here:
http://www.johnnygosch.com/

I believe Noreen believes this was her child. I didn't know him, but my inclination is to disbelieve his claims BECAUSE if he was so worried about the slavers in his past that he cannot come home, why would he knowingly endanger his mother by even coming by the house? That would be incredibly foolish, both for his safety and hers. The people who operate these rings are dangerous, from all I have read.

 

[2sisters]

Everyone on this forum has opinion and thoughts of certain cases. Nobody's theory is "ignornat". Someone's ignorant theory could solve a case. Yes the story is far fetched and yes I suppose possible. If this story is true then I urge Johnny Gosch to come forward and tell his story publicly and stop this from happening to other children right now before it continues on. If he survived that, then he needs to come forward and stop it. All I want to know is why this story is not more publisized on mainstream media. As far as the Sharon Marshall case, if there were not so much evidence on her case then it would not be belived and if there were nothing solid to back it up then I admit, I would not belive her story. I think the people on this forum are quite helpful and caring and it is people like this that bring children home and solve cases.

 

[VespaElf]

No one said this doesn't happen. They have stated their opinions that they don't think it happened in this particular case, BECAUSE it seems unlikely that if such a thing would happen, the the person to whom it happened to would just walk away and nothing would get settled, and no one would be investigated or arrested. They might have stated their opinion a little more gently, but it is still a valid opinion.

I thought there used to be a thread on this with a lot of really good information.
Website is here:
http://www.johnnygosch.com/

I believe Noreen believes this was her child. I didn't know him, but my inclination is to disbelieve his claims BECAUSE if he was so worried about the slavers in his past that he cannot come home, why would he knowingly endanger his mother by even coming by the house? That would be incredibly foolish, both for his safety and hers. The people who operate these rings are dangerous, from all I have read.

Thank you GW and 2Sisters,
I know all too well the horrors that befall children in our world.I have never or would ever deny this but I do not belive thats what happened in this case!!


AND INSTEAD OF ATTACKING ME JUST ANSWER THE QUESTIONS!!!!!

Where is NCMEC is this? Where is the FBI? (all "Miles" did was say they were involved but gave no follow up) Where are any other "investigators" NOT paid for by or involved with but totally independant from Noreen?

Having an obvious troll call me "ignorant" doesnt answer those questions does it?

 

[lisag]

Blaster - you should think before you speak, or type !!

I never said I didn't believe in child slavery.. I am sure that it does exist. And it may have happened with Johnny...
But I dont believe that he suddenly came home as an adult man, visited his mother once, told her not to tell anyone and that he was still endanger...
Knowing what he "went through" you would think he would want to tell - to help arrest the SOB's that did this... so that it would not happen to another child again.. I am not buying it..

No one is trashing the Goschs's and no one wants to stop them finding answers... I believe that Noreen BELIEVES it was her son... I think someone is playing with her mind and THAT is what could hinder the investigation - not "posters" like us.

JMHO

 

[exoromeo]

Parts of the story sound plausible....parts sound a little "fishy."

For example, it mentions Michael LaVey (Anton LaVey's son)....well, Anton had three children, none named Michael. LaVey fathered three children, two daughters named Karla and Zeena, and one son named Xerxes. (Born Xerxes Carnacki LaVey on November 1st, 1993 to Anton LaVey and Blanche Barton. LaVey's only son).

Sorta off-topic, but relevant to my post, there was a guy in California named Anthony Jess LaVey (supposedly). He was (again supposedly) the son of Anton and had converted to Christianity. He went around preaching on the religious circuit about Satanism, the occult, etc. When contacted and asked for documentation to support his claims, Jess "LaVey" responded that he was unable to provide evidence due to satanic conspiracies against him.

So, the LaVey part definitely adds a credibility issue to at least one person involved (or at least mentioned in the story).

 

[miles_draken]

The reason Johnny can't come home, which is the main theme of the story, is that he is in hiding and fearful of his life from this syndicate of child pornographers and kidnappers who would do anything to protect their lifestyle. From what I gathered from the story there have been other people "silenced" who were involved. I believe his fears would be justified. Also, he has his mother, father, and siblings to think about protecting as well. I am off to do more reading on this to see if there has been any recent updates. Thanks for posting everyone, this is a great forum!

 

[lisag]

The reason Johnny can't come home, which is the main theme of the story, is that he is in hiding and fearful of his life from this syndicate of child pornographers and kidnappers who would do anything to protect their lifestyle. From what I gathered from the story there have been other people "silenced" who were involved. I believe his fears would be justified. Also, he has his mother, father, and siblings to think about protecting as well. I am off to do more reading on this to see if there has been any recent updates. Thanks for posting everyone, this is a great forum!

So what you saying is that he is too fearful for his life and the lives of his family to come home, to talk to authorities and give names.. But he is not fearful for all the other children this could happen to if he does not come forward ??????????????

 

[miles_draken]

We don't know how we would react to any situation until we were in it. Remember, this kid has been supposedly brainwashed and tortured. There comes a time when self preservation out weighs everything else. It is easy to sit here and think that we would help these other children even if it meant our lives, but until we are in the situation we don't know for sure. Also, Johnny has atleast 2 siblings that I know of, and parents. SHould this be his cross to bear?