ID - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered - Bryan Kohberger Arrested - Moscow # 56

[MassGuy]

Basically, they looked at the photos we saw and took a massive leap, per their standard protocol. I mean, it’s def possible that’s blood, but you can’t confirm that from the photos. And you’d think they would have removed them before, as they could have contained the killer’s DNA.

EXCLUSIVE: Blood-saturated mattresses wrapped in white covers are hauled out of Idaho house where four students were knifed to death in their beds as investigators finally begin removing victims' belongings after suspect was charged​

Idaho police begin clearing rental home where students were murdered

Idaho State Police began clearing the Moscow home where four University of Idaho students were stabbed to death - a day after their alleged killer was formally charged.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[sleuther123]

For those from the prior thread who were saying the white car is a chevy (it is, the car behind the reporter) maybe this clarifies a bit: it's the car driving nearby in the upper right hand corner of the video. Apologies if someone already clarified this in the prior thread but it's hard to keep up!

View attachment 393285

This is interesting. The angle of that back window seems different to BK's car though..

 

[Gemmie]

Re: where X’s body was found, I actually interpreted this part of the PCA to mean that she was found on the floor in the bedroom (i.e., as the officer was going down the hall approaching the bedroom, he saw her body laying on the floor in the bedroom).

Especially since the next line is “Also in the room was a male…”

But it’s not entirely clear.

Very good point. It didn't say "Also in the hallway was a male...".

Which brought me back to the actual affidavit.... I haven't seen a bazillion affidavits like a lot of you likely have, but the few I've seen usually have small pieces blanked out (like names, etc.). But this affidavit has the entire page 2 redaced, or blank, not just some spots here and there. That's got me to wondering why, of all places in the affidavit, is an entire page redacted after mentioning the sole deceased male in the house?

It says:
Chapin was also deceased with wounds later determined (Autopsy Report provided by Spokane {1 full page REDACTED} County Medical Examiner _____________ dated December 15,2022) to be caused by "sharp-force injuries."

What could a whole page redaction mean for the sole male? They didn't do this for the 3 women so I find this extremely odd. It makes me wonder if BK didn't like seeing a make in X's bed and did things other than just stab him to death.

122922 Affidavit - Exhibit A - Statement of Brett Payne.pdf | PDF Host

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[LaineyJ]

ID - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered - Bryan Kohberger Arrested - Moscow # 55

More recently, I've noticed investigators cut and take samples versus the entire mattress. Also, I think it possible these mattresses in the photos could be from rooms other than the victims. JMO Well, I can see body-shaped stains on one of them, along with what looks like blood on the...

www.websleuths.com

Bringing this post over from the previous thread.

H.S. friends say accused Idaho killer Bryan Kohberger was bullied in school

Kohberger is charged with the murders of four University of Idaho students. His study of criminology was an attempt "to understand humans and … himself," according to a friend.

www.yahoo.com

"...Now Bree, like many who knew him, struggles to connect the person they once knew to this unspeakable crime, "Where did it go wrong? What happened? …Why didn't I see it ?"
Sad.
I feel for everyone who crossed paths with this man !
Hopefully people who knew and trusted him won't be too hard on themselves .
Even if they saw massive red flags, there isn't much one can do to help if the person in question will not seek help themselves ?

From reading this thread, it sounds like his crimes may have blindsided even his own family ?

While I abhor bullying, this apparently occurred while BK was heavier -- and possibly in his high school days ?
Was BK more accepted during his university years ?
BK, like others, could have tried to put it behind him.
The excuse of being bullied hasn't worked well for others who have been convicted, and it's not going to help him in his defense; imo.
Not an excuse.
M00.

Eta : Curious what the defense will bring to the table.

• Past bullying by others will be a weak defense, imo. Many of us were bullied and it didn't lead us on a violent path.
• BK could bring up a troubled childhood, but with his family right there they may object if asked to testify.
• Paranoid delusions or a blackout of sorts ? -- Doubtful, as BK took steps to cover up his crimes, shows planning.

Yeah I can’t see having been bullied be a mitigating factor (does that generally usually work for those who’ve committed random murders?) for a variety of reasons but he’s out of high school for over a decade now and these kids had nothing to do with that. And of course in general it’s just not an excuse obviously. Just saying

 

[Zella]

I realize this has likely been mentioned before, but I thought LE stated the victims were asleep when they were murdered. I'm struggling to understand how someone could order DoorDash at 4:00a.m.,be watching TikTok, and then be so asleep a few short minutes later that they were murdered without making a sound?, This all took place within approximately 25 minutes? Also, how could one of the other victims state that someone was in the house, playing with a dog, and then be so sound asleep within a few brief and killed? It just doesn't seem like there would have been no screaming, etc. And why the roommate waited several hours to call...in shock or not, that is hard to understand.

If I'm not mistaken, the statement was that some of them died in their beds. That doesn't preclude one of them from being awake, and it seems pretty clear that X was not asleep and not in her bed. She got her food delivery a few minutes later, was on her phone, and was likely the source of some of the talking overheard.

Also, I don't think K was actually playing with her dog. I think that was what DM thought she heard, but she was actually hearing K and M being stabbed to death. MOO I suspect K and M likely were asleep by that point.

 

[RAISINISBACK]

This. Right. Here. Hon, I was a party animal. My house and about two others were the houses to be at when it was goin' DOWN. Some nights there would be people sleepin' over and I'd wake up the next day and wonder who is THAT?! These kids are tame in comparison. I can still turn it on when I get a chance. The weekend has already started here.

I'd have thought one of my bunch had drug home a one-nighter, and let them see themselves out. He's just still masking (in this era) and was just leaving. He probably did spook her, she wasn't expecting to see him there.

I have a firm feeling that the back slider off the kitchen was the main entry/exit point and that area around the kitchen, was a hangout area. It's where all the fun would be happening. Probably why D moved up to that floor. Easy access to everything.

I do believe he was after X and M (the two who worked together at The Greek).

D was awakened at 4:00
At 4:12 X is on her phone.
She heard someone, and it could have been X, (as the Exhibit A Statement reads), say; there's someone here. What if she then walked toward the kitchen, b/c she'd just ordered food? Could it be the driver returning? She meets BK in the hall.
D then hears crying from X's room and a male voice saying, It's ok, I'm going to help you. X is found in the small area by the bathroom and her bedroom.

At 4:17 the home, which has the audio capture was stated as being very close. Less than 50'. The audio picks up barking, a whimper, and a thud. I believe this to be cuddle bug Murphy, who barked at BK, and then was whimpering from being kicked/grabbed/hurt somehow, and tossed into the other room. BK was not there to kill Murphy.

Edit to add link to Exhibt. As OP said, that door shut quick!

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I think the target was M. I think he saw her at that restaurant and liked her so he followed her home. The first time he was at the Kings rd house was at 10:34 PM in August. Someone on here checked the time the restaurant closed and it was at 10:00PM. Consider the time it would take for the employees to empty the cash drawer, clean up and set up the tables for the next day. That probably took 20 minutes or more. He followed her home, then watched the house. He probably asked around of the other kids in the area and learned her name. Her bedroom window had a huge M in it with a pair of pink boots, so easy for him to figure out her room by just going around back or standing in the street behind the house, since it was almost eye level with her room. I think he was inside the house during one of those open door parties and knew the layout to her room. I also think he waited until K moved out and he thought M was alone on that floor. He also had to get a night when there was no party happening.

One thing that seems to be forgotten on here is K had a new car. She just bought it so no way did BK know that was K's car. I think he knew she moved out and did not expect her to come back that weekend. It was sheer coincidence she came back to show M the car. He probably thought it was someone staying the night with BF or DM. He thought M was alone on that top floor so easy in, easy out for him. I actually think K was in her room with the dog. I think he got surprised in the middle of killing M by K coming into M's room when she heard a noise (or dog started barking) and that is why he left that sheath on the bed and why SG said K's injuries were different. He killed M lying in bed asleep and K while standing, (That would account for the slashing vs stabbing type wounds if she was standing) then knocked her down or threw her on the bed. (Keep in mind M appeared much more intoxicated than K in the videos so probably went to sleep faster.) This was the K "playing with dog noise" DM heard.

X was awake and heard the noise upstairs also. I think BK was coming down the stairs and heard X tell E "there is someone here". He had no way to know if they saw him or not so he went toward her voice. (Keep in mind X worked at that restaurant also and he may have thought she would recognize him.) Remember this all happened very fast. I think he attacked E first, maybe as he was getting up out of bed. He stabbed E several times and E fell to the floor. This was the loud thump picked up on video/audio. I think X hid behind E and was shocked by what was happening, probably whimpering and crying at first. Then when E went down she tried to run. BK caught her, maybe covering her mouth and told her "it's okay, I am going to help you." This is why X was in the door or hallway.

BK then walked toward DM but didn't see her there (I am assuming her room was dark and if the graphics are correct she would have been partially obscured by her bedroom door.) He then exited the house.

This is all pure speculation based on the PCA and SG's statements.

ETA: BK's original plan may have been to rape M with the knife at her throat. That is why it is important to remember K's new car that BK would not have recognized as K's, leaving M alone on the top floor.

JMO

 

[Ghostwheel]

No. After clearly placing zkernoodle in the bedroom in paragraph 3 of page one, it even reiterates it in graph 4, placing her in bedroom a second time with: "Also in the bedroom was a male."

This is your opinion based on how you read it. The words were:
"OFC Smith and I then walked upstairs to the second floor. OFC Smith directed me down the hallway to the west bedroom on the second floor, which I later learned (through Xana's driver's license and other personal belongings found in the room) was Xana Kernodle's, hereafter "Kernodle" room. Just before this room there was a bathroom door on the south wall of the hallway. As I approached the room, I could see a body, later identified as Kernodle's, laying on the floor. Kernodle was deceased with wounds which appeared to have been caused by an edged weapon. Also in the room was a male, later identified as Ethan Chapin, hereafter, "Chapin". Chapin was also deceased with wounds later determined..."

"As I approached the room, I could see a body, later identified as Kernodle's, laying on the floor." Not laying on the the floor of the room, but the floor as he approached the room. Could have been anywhere on the approach OR in the room.

" Also in the room was a male, later identified as Ethan Chapin". Also in the room, in addition to Xana's driver's license and other personal belongings found in the room, not necessarily also in the room with Xana herself.

This is not clear and open to interpretation, IMO. If it said "As I approached the room, I could see a body, later identified as Kernodle's, laying on the floor of her room." that would be clear but he did not. Maybe he meant to, only he can possibly know. Or maybe he meant the body was half in the door and half out the door. Or in the hall. Again, unless clarified, we cannot know for sure. JMO.

Xana's body was found on the floor. That much is clear.

 

[S. Gammon]

Snipped by me.

Where has this been stated?.

If I'm not mistaken, the statement was that some of them died in their beds. That doesn't preclude one of them from being awake, and it seems pretty clear that X was not asleep and not in her bed. She got her food delivery a few minutes later, was on her phone, and was likely the source of some of the talking overheard.

Also, I don't think K was actually playing with her dog. I think that was what DM thought she heard, but she was actually hearing K and M being stabbed to death. MOO I suspect K and M likely were asleep by that point.

Yes, I think Z was awake and not in her bed when she was murdered. I think E must have been murdered before her, or he would have woken up and tried to protect her. Granted, he could have been passed out, but I have to think he would have been the biggest physical threat to the suspect and taken out first.

 

[CSIDreamer]

Basically, they looked at the photos we saw and took a massive leap, per their standard protocol. I mean, it’s def possible that’s blood, but you can’t confirm that from the photos. And you’d think they would have removed them before, as they could have contained the killer’s DNA.

EXCLUSIVE: Blood-saturated mattresses wrapped in white covers are hauled out of Idaho house where four students were knifed to death in their beds as investigators finally begin removing victims' belongings after suspect was charged​

Idaho police begin clearing rental home where students were murdered

Idaho State Police began clearing the Moscow home where four University of Idaho students were stabbed to death - a day after their alleged killer was formally charged.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Its on the left edge, too. Look at that. JMO

 

[VicKnit]

This. Right. Here. Hon, I was a party animal. My house and about two others were the houses to be at when it was goin' DOWN. Some nights there would be people sleepin' over and I'd wake up the next day and wonder who is THAT?! These kids are tame in comparison. I can still turn it on when I get a chance. The weekend has already started here.

I'd have thought one of my bunch had drug home a one-nighter, and let them see themselves out. He's just still masking (in this era) and was just leaving. He probably did spook her, she wasn't expecting to see him there.

I have a firm feeling that the back slider off the kitchen was the main entry/exit point and that area around the kitchen, was a hangout area. It's where all the fun would be happening. Probably why D moved up to that floor. Easy access to everything.

I do believe he was after X and M (the two who worked together at The Greek).

D was awakened at 4:00
At 4:12 X is on her phone.
She heard someone, and it could have been X, (as the Exhibit A Statement reads), say; there's someone here. What if she then walked toward the kitchen, b/c she'd just ordered food? Could it be the driver returning? She meets BK in the hall.
D then hears crying from X's room and a male voice saying, It's ok, I'm going to help you. X is found in the small area by the bathroom and her bedroom.

At 4:17 the home, which has the audio capture was stated as being very close. Less than 50'. The audio picks up barking, a whimper, and a thud. I believe this to be cuddle bug Murphy, who barked at BK, and then was whimpering from being kicked/grabbed/hurt somehow, and tossed into the other room. BK was not there to kill Murphy.

Edit to add link to Exhibt. As OP said, that door shut quick!

122922 Affidavit - Exhibit A - Statement of Brett Payne.pdf | PDF Host

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Isn’t the exit off the kitchen a deck? I didn’t notice any stairs?

 

[MassGuy]

Its on the left edge, too. Look at that. JMO

My guess is they were confident in the sheath DNA, but I’m still perplexed, as you take everything that could be evidence.

But yeah, that does look like blood. I’m just annoyed they worded it the way they did, but not surprised.

 

[Honeybirdette]

Can someone explain what the difference is between a status hearing (what BK has next week) vs a preliminary hearing.
Will we find out further evidence? Any sign of which way he’ll plea at the status hearing?

 

[Ghostwheel]

I think so too. Since he used the knife to kill and had no sheath to put it in, it had to be carried bare to where ever he carried it (even if he wrapped it up in his jacket when he got to the car or whatever).

I bet this will be a big exercise in DNA detection in car upholstery, carpet and every other surface. Carpet likes to keep its DNA.

He at least steps in blood, as well.

What if....the blade was wiped off, then wrapped in some bedding or towel that was clean then put into something of his own (if he had one)? Dump the knife at point A, dump the bedding at point B, dump the thing that belonged to him at point C. What are the chances that the thing that belonged to him would have enough foreign DNA to even find in his own car?

 

[Zella]

<modsnip - off topic>

<mod note - VANS> seem kind of like an odd thing to wear to a quadruple homicide IMO.

Yes, I think Z was awake and not in her bed when she was murdered. I think E must have been murdered before her, or he would have woken up and tried to protect her. Granted, he could have been passed out, but I have to think he would have been the biggest physical threat to the suspect and taken out first.

I've wondered if she was in the bathroom, so he came across E in the room first and then her when she came back in.

But I do tend to agree with the people who've noted the order of the victim names in the affidavit, which suggest E was killed last. In that case, maybe she was up in the room, at the door, when BK came in and E truly was sound asleep.

 

[Honeybirdette]

I’ve been wondering, BK defence team halted the clean up of the crime scene the day he was arrested.
Is it possible BK will visit the crime scene? Before a trial. He might insist on seeing it for himself - would he be allowed? Can’t help but think he’d want to go, and probably enjoy seeing it. Ugh

 

[IceCreamSundae]

I’m a bit shocked that it seems LE knew he may be dangerous, and yet PD along the route were not informed. Either of those traffic stops could have become complicated- if BK had been in a different kind of mood and felt trapped.

JMO

True. I didn’t think of it that way, but you are correct. Scary.

 

[Brunette]

Isn’t the exit off the kitchen a deck? I didn’t notice any stairs?

It’s not a deck it’s more like a paved landing. Because the house is on a hill, it’s level with the higher ground that slopes upwards.

 

[KPO]

I think Gavin DeBecker describes this phenomena through several examples in his book The Gift of Fear. He gives examples of how people's instinct tells them something is wrong or dangerous but they have been socialized not to trust their instincts. For example, you're a woman, and at the end of the day in a building that's mostly empty, the elevator arrives at your floor and the door opens. It's a large man you don't know and you feel uneasy. Do you get into that elevator--a steel, soundproof box, or do you wait for another elevator or someone to go with you? Most people get into the elevator because we are socialized to be polite.

I am definitely going to read this book, it sounds fascinating! That's a very relatable situation. Even if I was uncomfortable, I would get on the elevator unless the man was foaming at the mouth.

 

[Gardenista]

Very good point. It didn't say "Also in the hallway was a male...".

Which brought me back to the actual affidavit.... I haven't seen a bazillion affidavits like a lot of you likely have, but the few I've seen usually have small pieces blanked out (like names, etc.). But this affidavit has the entire page 2 redaced, or blank, not just some spots here and there. That's got me to wondering why, of all places in the affidavit, is an entire page redacted after mentioning the sole deceased male in the house?

It says:
Chapin was also deceased with wounds later determined (Autopsy Report provided by Spokane {1 full page REDACTED} County Medical Examiner _____________ dated December 15,2022) to be caused by "sharp-force injuries."

What could a whole page redaction mean for the sole male? They didn't do this for the 3 women so I find this extremely odd. It makes me wonder if BK didn't like seeing a make in X's bed and did things other than just stab him to death.

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They updated the PCA and the page is no longer redacted. There is no new info though, so it was likely just and error

https://coi.isc.idaho.gov/docs/case/CR29-22-2805/122922%20Affidavit%20-%20Exhibit%20A%20-%20Statement%20of%20Brett-Payne.pdf

 

[Copper107]

I suggest everyone read the PCA and make their own conclusions. It's slightly open for interpretation depending on how one reads it. It does not say definitively "Kernoodle was found on the floor of her bedroom", so there is room for interpretation and each interpretation is an opinion of the individual until that is clarified.

Quoting from the affidavit it says on pg 1 pp 3: as I approached this room, I could see a body, later identified as Kernodle's, laying on the floor. The affiant continues in pp 4, Also in the room was a male.......

As Ghostweel says it does not specifically state she was on the floor of her bedroom. However, none of that matters as crime scene photos will show exactly where the victims were situated in their home.