ID - 4 Univ of Idaho Students Murdered - Bryan Kohberger Arrested - Moscow # 69

[ExpectingUnicorns]

No, this would not be a substantially related matter. It is a totally different case and circumstance.

But the clients are substantially related because she has represented the parent and now the accused murderer of the parent's child. Even though the substance of the cases are not related the two clients are substantially related.
I am opposed to giving the accused even a whiff of having any excuse to question the outcome of the trial if he's found guilty. (Isn't that even why the gag order is in place?)

 

[Helechawagirl]

If this is true, then the death penalty is pretty much already off the table.

I don’t follow the logic?

 

[Twistinginthewind]

<snipped for focus>

I have said before that the State Public Defender may have an interest in maintaining confidence in his office that puts him in a difficult position.

The Chief Public Defender assigned to BK's case is female:

Kootenai County Chief Public Defender Anne Taylor​

Public Defender | Kootenai County, ID

"Taylor was appointed Kohberger's provisional defense attorney shortly after his arrest – and became his official public defender at his first appearance in the Latah County Courthouse after he waived extradition in Pennsylvania and returned to Idaho."

Idaho murders: Bryan Kohberger attorney withdrew from representing victim's mom

 

[ExpectingUnicorns]

These are excellent questions.

The rule applies to substantially related matters, and on their face the charges against the parent are entirely independent of the murders. The fact that the parent's child is a murder victim does not, in and of itself, establish a substantial relationship between the two legal matters IMO.

Nonetheless, the client always has an opportunity to object to an attorney's withdrawal on the grounds that it will adversely affect their representation. IDK if that occurred, or whether AT received the parent's consent to withdraw in advance of filing the motion. Regardless, the judge in the parent's case is responsible to assure that the parent's interests as a defendant are not materially harmed by the substitution of counsel. I infer from the fact of the judge's approval of the substitution motion that no such harm was found.

All that said, there may be issues down the line if the parent disclosed information about the murdered child in confidence to AT, that could be useful in BK's defense but that AT is prevented from using because of her obligation to keep the parent's confidences as a former client. It's hard to imagine what that information would be at this point.

All MOO (non-attorney)

RBBM
Thank you for your well formed reply. I'm praying that that the parent's consent is on file to preserve the administration requirements of the courts. I also hope that the parent understood that when/if they signed the form it was in order to release their counsel to defend the accused murderer of their child.

 

[passionflower]

The Chief Public Defender assigned to BK's case is female:

Kootenai County Chief Public Defender Anne Taylor​

Public Defender | Kootenai County, ID

"Taylor was appointed Kohberger's provisional defense attorney shortly after his arrest – and became his official public defender at his first appearance in the Latah County Courthouse after he waived extradition in Pennsylvania and returned to Idaho."

Idaho murders: Bryan Kohberger attorney withdrew from representing victim's mom

Does anyone know why she defended BCK mother?

 

[Ccging]

I don't think we know if he was hired or not.

I was going to say this. There are some that think some of the wording in one of the documents, I believe the sealed warrant, where it discusses a threat to LE or something along those lines, makes some believe he may have in fact been hired. But why would LE withhold that information?

 

[al66pine]

The office of atty rep'ing BW, Anne Taylor, is in Coeur d'Alene in Kootenai County, in the state’s panhandle, so nearly 2 hrs drivetime (one way) to Moscow.

A longish haul for atty-client in-person visits.
___________________________
Moscow and Coeur D'Alene are 1 hour 51 mins far apart, driving non-stop. 84 mi. (135 km) US 95. (Note, US highway 95, not Interstate 95.)

Distance between Moscow, ID and Coeur D'Alene, ID

Distance between Moscow and Coeur D'Alene in miles and kilometers. Driving distance and how to go from Moscow, Idaho to Coeur D'Alene, Idaho. How long does it takes to arrive.

www.distance-cities.com

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

OK. Thought you meant a regular ALIBI.

But photos in a gym prove zero for his defense attorneys. Prosecution could explain that.

How?

Because it doesn't matter if he went to various places in Moscow, he could do both!

By both I mean his going to places but also him having plenty of time to leave those places and drive over to King Rd.

Most places were closed likely when he was in Moscow. He went late at night and into the early morning.

There could be 2 hours of video of him in a gym and then video after that of him stopping in a late night bar, but bars often close at 2:00am.

Anyway, even after going to multiple places he easily could have driven, like I said, over to King Rd to case-out the victims and their house.

Unless he spent the night 12 times with a friend who will testify to it, the defense cannot prove he did not drive over to King Rd 12 times.

The prosecution does have video of a car that looks like his driving around King Rd the morning of the murders. They probably have other car footage.

All the prosecution has to do is show the jury that it is reasonable to believe BK had the opportunity 12 times to drive over to King Rd. Some jurors will think he did.

We will see if a friend testifies that BK was with him/her 11 times late at night and early in the morning. And one time during the day.

Means ✓
Motive
Opportunity ✓

Bolded, italicized, and underlined by me because I believe this is absolutely crucial. In the US, it isn't up to the defense to prove he didn't. It's up to the prosecution to prove he DID. I feel like this is one of the problems with our justice system and one contribution to wrongful convictions.

JMO.

 

[pittsburghgirl]

See that’s the issue right there, IMO— we are not privy to any possible exculpatory evidence. Which is as it should be, also IMO.

OK. Be the defense attorney for a minute. You have documentation on video that your client accused of the heinous murder of 4 young people is absolutely innocent because you can PROVE he was somewhere else--video plus the testimony of the gym manager and maybe others from a 4 am workout. Do you let your client sit in jail awaiting trial or do you show law enforcement he's innocent?

 

[pittsburghgirl]

If BK had an ALIBI they wouldn't have arrested him, an ALIBI proves you could not have been at a crime scene when a crime occurred.

If BK had an ALIBI It would mean the killer took BK's knife sheath with him or BK touched the killer's knife sheath at some point in time before the murders.

And thus BK would know the killer.

 

[Helechawagirl]

Does anyone know why she defended BCK mother?

The victim’s mom, not bck

 

[BeginnerSleuther]

OK. Be the defense attorney for a minute. You have documentation on video that your client accused of the heinous murder of 4 young people is absolutely innocent because you can PROVE he was somewhere else--video plus the testimony of the gym manager and maybe others from a 4 am workout. Do you let your client sit in jail awaiting trial or do you show law enforcement he's innocent?

I think that exchange was about the 12 pings, not the night of the murder. JMO.

 

[ExpectingUnicorns]

I think I should explain why it bothers me so much that a lawyer can represent a person accused of murder even though they had represented the parent of the murdered victim in the past.
I had a lowly administrative position for a few years in the DOD Air Force Audit Agency. I had to be processed through a secret security clearance to do so. I was only the secretary for the regional inspector general.
This was necessary, as anyone working in the agency needed to have a total history on file to preclude any conflict of interest in any and all audits. (LOL, even the secretaries?!!?!)
DOD Auditor General policy is that not only there should be no conflict of interest in any program, inspection, file, or ruling - but there should be not even be a "perception of conflict of interest." This was almost the agency's motto.
It just boggles my mind and ethics to think that our judicial system, which deals with more life and death matters than an audit agency, should be held to lesser standards!

 

[pittsburghgirl]

I don't think that would be a good use of taxpayers' money if there are public defenders who are death penalty qualified in the state who are able to take the case. I don't think the state attorney general office could justify it.

I recall two death penalty cases here in Pittsburgh where private attorneys were hired to defend the accused; they were top flight defense attorneys. They didn't get their usual fees but fought hard for two clients who were obviously guilty. I knew one of these guys. If I recall correctly, the court actually asks death-qualified attorneys to take cases. Here is an interesting discussion of this issue that lays out how many attorneys should be on the defense team (minimum) and the kind of experience they should have: Standards for the Appointment and Performance of Counsel in Death Penalty Cases (Black Letter) | National Legal Aid & Defender Association

 

[MsBetsy]

Only time I was on a jury judge said DNA was considered circumstantial.

He can say I was looking to buy a knife and sheath at one time, my DNA could have transferred at the store (wherever) then.

Yes, DNA evidence is circumstantial since we can make inferences about the sheath. I think the example used early on is that the sheath could have been stolen from BK by the perp.

So other evidence is needed to prove that only BK could have been responsible for the murders.

IMO

 

[Montecore1]

Does anyone know why she defended BCK mother?

It was a victims mother and the reason (and the name) are stated in the Fox 13 link above...

 

[Cassady]

No, this would not be a substantially related matter. It is a totally different case and circumstance.

IMO the potential for conflicts here is with the past confidences of the victim's mother by the attorney currently representing the defendant.

What if through her previous representation of the victim's mother she was aware that they "worked" with LE and provided intel that led to the arrest of bigger players in the drug trade. Now, in the current case the defendant may want to explore alternate theories on who committed the murders. The mother of one of victims snitching on drug dealers would be a good avenue to explore.

If the attorney possesses this or similiar information do they withhold this information from the current client or use the information that was obtained from the previous representation? That situation could create a real nightmare for the attorney and is why these situation can and do present conflicts of interest....IMO.

 

[Rigatoni999]

Very interesting read. thanks!

If there is additional evidence tied directly to the 4 victims either in his car or in his apartment, game over.

<modsnip> He knows what's there. They are going to find loads of evidence. He's cooked. IMHO.

 

[Chloegirl]

<modsnip - quoted post removed>

it is bad for BK, and we do not want him to have an excuse not to get a fair trial or file an appeal, etc.

 

[ExpectingUnicorns]

<modsnip - quoted post removed> it is bad for BK, and we do not want him to have an excuse not to get a fair trial or file an appeal, etc.

Exactly.