ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 15

[layer]

Thought it would be interesting to see how many different "profiles" the paid professionals are coming up with. Keep in mind they DO NOT have the data LE has. They are working with the same info we have but have their knowledge and experience.

1. Incel theory - Carole Lieberman (Forensic Psychiatrist)

Idaho students' killer may be an "incel" who felt rejected—psychiatrist

Police have not yet identified a suspect in the killings of four University of Idaho students who were found dead in their beds on November 13.

www.newsweek.com

Forensic psychiatrist Carole Lieberman said she is confident the slayings were not a random attack or the work of a serial killer. The "multiple stabbings and bloody mess are signs that it was personal and that the killer was enraged," Lieberman told Newsweek.

• Personal
• Enraged
• Not random or serial
• Felt rejected or would be suitor

Regarding this incel theory.
Can anyone point to a case where an incel attack was followed by an escape? It seems like they want to get caught and get credit, much more like the workplace and school shooting mass killers. Not like this...

 

[WildWest]

IMO, the suspect is a male student who attends The University of Idaho and knew the victims and the layout of their home because they'd been there before. The victim's home was known to be a party house.

LE believes the suspect used a KA-BAR brand combat blade knife. Many KA-BAR brand knives are used for hunting.

I believe the suspect was skilled with this knife due to the magnitude of this crime, which leads me to think they are a hunter.

The male student population at The University of Idaho is 5,670. I've been unsuccessful in obtaining how many male students have hunting licenses in Moscow, but I'm assuming this is a very narrow pool.

Over 50 years I've only lived in college towns (not by desire, just cooincidence), all the younger locals drink/party/date/talk with the college kids at the bars and parties (food trucks). Imho it could be either. I do wonder about a Frat member though...

 

[PitkinGirl]

Was the 2015 Moscow murder solved?

Yes, right away. John Lee killed his (adoptive) mother, his landlord and the Arby’s manager.

 

[tara83]

“This person was asleep unfortunately, (and) was not getting the calls,” Goncalves’ mother, Kristi Goncalves, recently told TODAY. “If Kaylee was in imminent danger — her or Maddie — they would have called 911. They would not have been calling this person.”

Sorry; my quote didn't show up the way they usually do. In a week, K's mother has gone from "they'll be getting back together and probably get married and have children" to calling him "this person." That says a lot! Great find Cota332!

I think people are reading way too much into everything.

 

[Miss Jennifer]

I think people are reading way too much into everything.

I agree. It's because we have such limited information, unfortunately.

 

[LAhiker]

I'm thinking about what police said about asking for any videos/photos because what ISN'T in them could be important. I'm trying to wrack my brain--what is an example of something being absent that could be significant? the only thing i'm thinking is if someone who would normally be at work, for example, wasn't seen in a certain space like in the background or something. A car could also apply to this.

If a suspect's alibi was that they were at home asleep at a particular time, but their car wasn't in its usual spot at that time, that might indicate they were lying.

JMO

 

[Cryptic]

E believes the suspect used a KA-BAR brand combat blade knife. Many KA-BAR brand knives are used for hunting.

I would respectfully disagree with the last point.

Ka Bars or Ka Bar like combat knives would probably be less likely used in hunting due to a combination of weight, blade design, and the blade being too long. Many hunters would likely find them cumbersome for many reasons.

The above, of course, does not mean that Ka Bar type combat knives are never used in hunting. But at the end of the day, Ka Bars are probably more likely owned by:

- Wanna'be rambos looking for something tough 'n bad- you know what.

- People who are just "into knives" and / or know the Ka Bar's historic association with the USMC.

- People who are need a multi use wilderness camp tool. As @positive related, Ka bars can be used as a multi purpose knife, and... as a pry bar, a light axe, a tree saw, a machete and.... a hammer. The famous Buck Folding Hunter? Not so much.

 

[isabella88]

There may have been one main target but perhaps others were killed because if left alive their first thought/suspect would be the person who did this. I think Ethan was collateral damage not to sound insensitive.

Yes!

 

[PriorTheCreator]

Regarding this incel theory.
Can anyone point to a case where an incel attack was followed by an escape? It seems like they want to get caught and get credit, much more like the workplace and school shooting mass killers. Not like this...

Robert Aaron Long
2020 Toronto machete attack

are a couple.

I dont think the want for attention is required. There are plenty who just want certain people to suffer.

 

[Wallendo]

“This person was asleep unfortunately, (and) was not getting the calls,” Goncalves’ mother, Kristi Goncalves, recently told TODAY. “If Kaylee was in imminent danger — her or Maddie — they would have called 911. They would not have been calling this person.”

Sorry; my quote didn't show up the way they usually do. In a week, K's mother has gone from "they'll be getting back together and probably get married and have children" to calling him "this person." That says a lot! Great find Cota332!

My interpretation is that she doesn't want the ex-BF dragged into this mess.

 

[greenfrog]

I am so with you on this! That’s why i think this was someone known to them - very well known to them. Someone in their circle, someone who was very familiar with the house, whether or not these were soft sleepers, knew the dog (i think the dog was sleeping on the first floor in one of the uninjured roomate’s rooms). If this was a stranger then this person didn’t care whether he was caught or not, very experienced or an idiot. Or maybe all 3. This was such a risky killing for all the reasons you stated. It is quite baffling!!

I also agree with both of you. As I stated in an earlier post, I would also assume someone in the house might be armed since weapons are a dime a dozen in Idaho. Very odd.

 

[Olivia Reed]

I have been studying the area that Moscow PD has requested video footage from:

West Taylor Ave (north boundary)
West Palouse River Dr (south boundary)
Highway 95 south to the 2700 block of Highway 95 S (east boundary)
Arboretum & Botanical Garden (west boundary)

A couple of things stood out to me:
They are basically looking at the area south of the university and not including the University itself. Is it because there are enough cameras on campus that they didn’t need any more footage or they didn’t spot any unusual movement there?
The north boundary of the area they are looking at is Taylor Rd. This is the road that runs between Greek Row and the victims‘ home.
The west boundary is the Arboretum/Botanical Gardens
The south boundary, W Palouse River Dr, is basically the southernmost east-west road in town.
The east boundary is Highway 95 S. This makes sense and squares off the area EXCEPT they want footage that goes all the way down 95S past W Palouse River Dr to the 2700 block. This is at the approximate location of Wasankari Construction which is at 2730.
When Moscow PD released their map, they showed a squared off area, but they weren’t showing W Palouse River Dr as the southern boundary. Why? Granted the 2700 block is less than a mile from the intersection but I think something, a vehicle, has caught their eye on 95 south of town and they are trying to track its movements that night.
Does Wasankari Construction have a video camera that showed something that caught their interest that night; a vehicle that may have been observed one or more times between 3:00 am and 6:00 am near the crime scene and then seen heading south out of town on Hwy 95?
I’ve attached 2 maps; the one released by Moscow PD and one I drew to explain what I am trying to say. As they say, a picture is worth a thousand words.
Thoughts?

Perhaps they are looking for 'the car that was supposed to be there but wasnt' that Kaylee's Father mentioned in his recent interview!

 

[WildWest]

My interpretation is that she doesn't want the ex-BF dragged into this mess.

Interesting, reminds me of Kesley Berreth's Mom

 

[mickey2942]

Excellent post.

I don't think any profiler can make an accurate analysis without having the same level of knowledge that the profilers working on the case have. Even with their advanced training, they're making guesses just like us, except they get paid to do it on TV.

I consider all their opinions with an open mind, but I don't think any of them has offered any real new insight.

MOO

I actually reviewed the Jayme Closs thread, and several articles written about her Kidnapping, October, 2019. She was gone for approximately 87 days. Until she rescued herself from escape from her abductor.

It seemed like the profile was all over on that case. And many tips of sightings were completely wrong.

It is a good case to review, especially when LEO asked about anyone on the road at that time, and they actually passed the kidnapper with Jayme in the car on their way to the scene!

 

[Strong1]

So there have been a couple different scenarios about the killer. Was he an experienced killer? Was he a novice that snapped? LE have stated that it was a "sloppy" murder site and that the killer left a "mess of evidence". If this is true this to me this probably rules out an experienced killer in my opinion. So that leaves us with a possible rage killing by an inexperienced killer. Being inexperienced eventually they will say something to someone. Either out of guilt or in drunken state. Sometime these people can't help themselves. We can only hope that whomever they tell goes to LE.

 

[Olivia Reed]

My interpretation is that she doesn't want the ex-BF dragged into this mess.

J is totally innocent in my opinion, have you seen his photo in the daily Mail? the mother is accurate ' the girls would have called 911' if they sensed danger, both intelligent educated girls, from my perspective!

 

[Charlot123]

Why has there not been a reward for information offered?

Good question.

1) I think, to limit the number of useless calls somewhere out of, say, Pennsylvania, “it is my brother-in-law who has just been discharged from prison and he is very violent”.
2) because it is a student town; chances are, the man is not living that far away; the students understand the danger. They will provide certain information, because they are scared and angry.
3) it is tragedy for the University. All the staff, the professors, the counselors would cooperate.
4) the inhabitants of Moscow, a quiet town, don’t want killers to roam their territory, and many have children, too. They’d help.
5) they got the money for investigation
6) they hope to get enough clues from the crime scene
7) they have FBI to help
8) I bet the parents are involved to the maximum

Just good luck to them!

 

[Cota332]

View attachment 383266
Moo, This floor plan is what reinforces my belief that this was a targeted killing. If the killer had entered an unlocked door, he would have to deliberately make a left, and then another left (basement stairs visible) to go to X and Es bedroom. Same with going to the third floor- an effort were made to get to these rooms. It also makes sense why it’s likely that no one from each floors may have heard anything.

Hi, just found this floorplan on TheDailyMail that slightly differs from the one you have here. Should the one from TheDailyMail be accurate, it seems that entering E&X's room was even more deliberate than the other floor plan suggests, as the killer had to pass the laundry room as well.

 

[layer]

LE have stated that it was a "sloppy" murder site and that the killer left a "mess of evidence".

Have they, though? I know K's parents said they were told that, but I haven't seen LE state that.

 

[MesquiteO21]

If a suspect's alibi was that they were at home asleep at a particular time, but their car wasn't in its usual spot at that time, that might indicate they were lying.

JMO

I’m *hoping* that by asking they actually do in fact have a POI in mind and are trying to get ahead of a possible alibi...but that could very well be highly wishful thinking on my part.