ID - 4 University of Idaho Students Murdered - Moscow # 20

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Bliss_Perth

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I think people here (including myself) were speculating that luminol was possibly being used since the lights were off for a period of time. It is possible but I don’t think they would be looking for much since they were there for such a short period of time.

From what I saw, one of the people who entered the house was carrying an evidence collection kit (small black box). If they were testing with luminol, I feel like they would have had more equipment and more people. It’s still possible though if they just wanted to do a quick scan of an area.

I’m more inclined to think they were collecting physical evidence that may have come up in an interview or, as someone else has stated, DNA evidence.

MOO

They could have been, here's a older pic from the 16th of last Month checking the Queen st apartments (yellow ones)

light.jpg
 

Jade

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@Knox @SteveP :) .


(not to be confused with the interview by Brian Entin that airs tonight)

INTERVIEW WITH KAYLEE'S MOM AND DAD

3rd December.

Reporter - Joining me now on set, the parents of Kaylee Gonsalves, C. and S. Thank you all so much for being with me. You guys have been so transparent and strong for the public. C., you called the person that did this, the bogeyman.

Mom - Yeah.

Reporter - What did you mean by that?.

Mom - It's literally like what nightmares are made of. Like when you're a little kid and you think of the bogeyman. That's just how I feel. Like, that's just.. the horrific details of everything. Them just having a good time, going home and going to bed and this happening to them.

Dad - Best friends crawling into bed.

Mom - Just crawling into bed and the bogeyman comes.

Dad - Every girl in America knows what that's like.

Mom - The bogeyman doesn't meet you at McDonald's. I mean, the bogeyman comes and snatches you out of your bedroom.

Reporter - S., we've been talking. I've been talking to folks in the community. You said something that stuck with me. You said, until this person is caught, you can't sleep in your bed.

Dad - No. I can't just lay in my bed and do nothing. That's not the way I raised my family. That's not the way I raised my girls and my son. You don't be a victim. You stand up for yourself and you do everything in your power to make sure people hear you. They're going to hear Kaylee. They're gonna hear Maddie. They're gonna hear these..

Mom - The other 2 as well.

Dad - I'm careful saying anything about them because I need to be careful because I can't speak on somebody else's child. But these two girls, I'm not trying to be a glory hound, but these two girls, I'm going to do what I can do. And we're not being victims. We're going to fight. We're going to figure out how to make sure that we hold everybody, you know, accountable and we keep eyes and attention on this and get this thing resolved.

Reporter - S., you have made it very clear to our audience that you are supportive of law enforcement. You support the investigation, but recently I've been watching and talking with you and you're getting frustrated. What does that frustration come from, Sir?.

Dad - They put certain people between you and the officers that are making things happen. And those people are like lawyers and they don't want to say anything and they don't have the guts to come up and be alpha and be like leaders and say, 'hey, we might say something that's wrong, we're going to take that hit'. So the officers, they looked me straight in their eyes, the lead detective look me in his eyes. I have no doubt he's working as hard as he can, but somebody isn't communicating. There's nothing being released. It seems like they're trying to suppress the story. We want to put rewards out. They're like, 'don't do that'. Yeah, I get it your town doesn't want to have reward posters posted all over when you come and you do, your rush (?). You're not gonna get a lot of students if they see those things, but this community is not gonna heal until this guy's pulled off the streets. It ain't gonna happen. Think it through. It's not gonna happen. He has to be off the streets. We all are working for the same thing.

Reporter - When was the last time you all heard from the police?.

Mom - Thursday.

Dad - Thursday, we looked at phone records. We want to be accurate. We don't want to sell anyone out.

Mom - About 3:00 o'clock on Thursday.

Reporter - And then did you all get an update from the police about the investigation?.

Mom - There was nothing. We have no updates for you.

Dad - There was no update. They needed us to sign a waiver form so that they could investigate something..

Mom - Some mail.

Dad - ..that was mail related. So, we're working with them, we're not selling them out. We love our law support.

Mom - And the FBI, everybody that's here. We just have no information, as family, and it gets tough day after day after day. I mean, everyday you just wake up and think today's the day we're going to hear something and you see these 'oh, there's a break in the case', and it'll just be something stupid.

Dad - A 6th person on the lease that was never there. Stop playing games. This is serious. These are peoples lives and this is the future of this community. There's going to be 10,000, 15,000 kids that come into this community next year, or they don't. So, be serious.

Reporter - I had the opportunity to speak to some of my sources and I've been told that there were differences in the way that the victims were killed. Some were more severe than the other and this week we heard the targeted attack walk back and then reverse it back to him being a targeted attack. What can you tell us about the targeted attack?.

Mom - They have told us that it was targeted but they told us they can't tell us who. We asked specifically and they said 'we'll try to get that information to you' and they got back to us a day or so later and they said 'we're sorry we can't give you that information', but then a day later we saw on the news that it was not targeted, or they think the whole house was targeted, but..

Dad - I'll cut to the chase. Their means of death don't match, they don't.

Reporter - Maddie's and Kaylee's cause of death, it does not match based on the autopsy report?.

Dad - They don't match.

Reporter - Would it indicate that one of them..

Dad - It doesn't have to go up the steps. Let's stop playing games, guys. I need somebody to step up and be an alpha. Be somebody to be a leader. Don't make me do it. I don't wanna do it. It doesn't have to go up those steps. Their points of damage don't match. I'm just going to say it. It wasn't leaked to me, I earned that. I paid for that funeral. I paid for that it's my right. You ain't taking that from me.

Mom - Calm down.

Dad - If you don't want to say nothing, that's your bit, but don't say I'm leaking anything. I paid that bill. Sent my daughter to college to get an education, she came back in a box and I can speak on that.

Reporter - I was also told from sources that are close to the investigation because there was a lot of roommates in there, and this was horrific for those roommates that were there as well.

Mom - Yeah, absolutely.

Reporter - The preservation of this crime scene. Witnesses tell me that it may have well been been preserved because the phone was passed around between one of the fraternity members and the girls. One of them, unfortunately witnessed the death.. the body there. Can you confirm that?.

Mom - We cannot actually. We know nothing about that whole phone call. We've asked and I mean I know that a lot people want to know but that's just not urgent, we're just like, somebody called 911. Somebody was reported unconscious. We don't really know. I mean we've heard so many different things and nothing has been clarified or been told to us at all. I don't know if I personally have asked anything about that. I don't know if you've asked anything about that, but we know that this is getting three weeks in and it's starting to get.. we don't want it to go cold. We're reaching out. I reach out to friends down in California today that have connections that we're hoping to raise some money to get a reward to get a private investigator.

Dad - Third party.

Mom - Third party.

Reporter - Why go the private route. Do you all worry that at the end of this week that this case may be cold?.

Dad - We're scared.

Mom - We're scared, we're scared.

Dad - You tell me you don't want a photo up there with the reward offering information - that kind of sounds like you're trying to like suppress the story. I mean, why do you not need help?. But hey, I could be wrong and you officers, I apologise if I'm wrong, please forgive me, please forgive me. But if you don't have the information - people do know, if they don't. Then you know.. this is a community that is IT based. These guys live a digital footprint like we've never.. all us older people, we don't know how much that digital footprint could be helpful. So, that's what we asked for. I hope like a DNA family lineage - if they could come out here and just start taking.. this town is not that big, we could figure out this. And it might not be him, it might be a family member. We have family all going to the school together, you know, there's cousins, there's aunts, there's uncles. We could find this guy just with volunteers.

Mom - Lineage companies where our..

Dad - Put Idaho on the map.

Reporter - C., S., we're going to stay on this case.

Dad - Thank you.

Mom - Thank you.

Reporter - We're not going anywhere. You guys have been candid with us. We'll keep asking questions. Any resource that we have available. Our audiences is praying for you guys. Thank you all. It was big for you guys to come back to Moscow tonight. I know it took a lot of courage to do it.

Mom - Yeah, it took a lot.

Reporter - I'm hoping we can get some answers for you. Thanks so much for joining me tonight.

Dad says steps.
Referring to going through steps to get information and relates to an alpha stepping up with information,imo.

Dad does not say upstairs.

All imo
 

cottonweaver

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If their targets were on the 2nd floor, there was no need for the perp to go to the 3rd floor. So the conclusion is that someone from the 3rd floor was targeted.

but this is the same pattern with Steve and assumptions.

- As a military member posted recently, might be logical for a perp to work & ' clear' floors from top to bottom ( am not claiming that perp is ex military, nor that a methodical nature or pre-planning is exclusive to military training )
- we don't even know if perp entered on floor 2 or simply via floor 1 front door ( possibly next to two locked bedrooms? ) and worked his way upwards to the top

I just don't know how any of this can be more than assumptions & speculation at this stage
( same thing happened with ' Kaylee has a stalker' which later was retracted)
 

whirrledpeas

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If they were gathering evidence last night, why weren’t they wearing shoe covers and other appropriate gear?
At this point, crime scene technicians would have collected and photographed everything needed so there is no longer a need to protect the crime scene for possible contamination. Good question though!

MOO
 

Tracey4AU

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Watching the Fox News interview of SG this morning, he was most definitely referring to the STAIRS OF THE HOUSE and the perp not having a reason to go up there unless M or K was the target when he spoke with Lawrence Jones last night. It is clear in this morning’s interview.
 

pentimento

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Actually, the logic is the exact opposite. If the killer "didn't have to go to the third floor", that means the perceived target was on the second floor. If the target was on the third floor, the killer WOULD have to go there to find his target.
Except that the statement was made in the context of the wounds being different between M & K, implying that one of them was killed more brutally and hence was likely the target. He didn't have to go to the third floor unless his target was up there. I can't see him complaining why the killer had to kill M & K so unfairly if he were only after E & X -- like, why kill my daughter too, she had nothing to do with it?. He stated emphatically the M & K's wounds don't match. From the entire conversation, he is clearly hinting around that his daughter was the target, otherwise it would appear that he was whining about why M & K where included, which I don't think he would do to the other families. Sorry, I just can't see it any other way. JMO.
 

MsBetsy

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Great find!! This quote from the article really stuck out to me :
I would think the opposite is true. It can take longer if the suspect is not among their close friends. Between the four of them they must have known hundreds of people just from going to class together and socializing.
 

thatssoamy

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Dad - It doesn't have to go up the steps. Let's stop playing games, guys. I need somebody to step up and be an alpha. Be somebody to be a leader. Don't make me do it. I don't wanna do it. It doesn't have to go up those steps. Their points of damage don't match. I'm just going to say it. It wasn't leaked to me, I earned that. I paid for that funeral. I paid for that it's my right. You ain't taking that from me.
RSBM

From reading this imo he's not talking about the killer going upstairs in the house. He's talking about LE. It's clear he's saying it doesn't have to go up the ladder, meaning the persons higher up. I think he's asking for anyone on the case to speak up, that that person doesn't have to go up the ladder to the person above for permission.

Jmo
 

Emerald1328

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I'm not gonna watch, but shouldn't the press be more mindful?
Is this story a "cash cow"?

LJ is younger than my kids! (He's only 29) Yikes! I don't know if LJ has the maturity to sustain a long term assignment with victims in this type of situation. He's not an attorney or a victim's advocate. He's a political commentator. There really is nothing in his background that has prepared him to speak at length with grieving parents who have recently lost their children to violent homicide.
BBM…yes, yes it is.
 

JaimeInLA

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Watching the Fox News interview of SG this morning, he was most definitely referring to the STAIRS OF THE HOUSE and the perp not having a reason to go up there unless M or K was the target when he spoke with Lawrence Jones last night. It is clear in this morning’s interview.
Is there a link to that interview yet?
 

Ozoner

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Except that the statement was made in the context of the wounds being different between M & K, implying that one of them was killed more brutally and hence was likely the target. He didn't have to go to the third floor unless his target was up there. I can't see him complaining why the killer had to kill M & K so unfairly if he were only after E & X -- like, why kill my daughter too, she had nothing to do with it?. He stated emphatically the M & K's wounds don't match. From the entire conversation, he is clearly hinting around that his daughter was the target, otherwise it would appear that he was whining about why M & K where included, which I don't think he would do to the other families. Sorry, I just can't see it any other way. JMO.
Even if M and K's wounds don't match, that doesn't necessarily mean anything. After killing the first one, he might have been winded and might not have had much energy left to expend on the other one.

It also could be (for instance) that one of the girls was sleeping on her back and was stabbed through the heart or in the throat while the other was sleeping on her stomach and would therefore have been stabbed in the back.
 

DoctorPsychMike

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Just like to point out that it was the FOX reporter who actually broke the news of one person's wounds being so different. He said he had gathered that from his sources, or community, paraphrased. Then he got K's dad to confirm and add a little more. It was not the father who brought that subject up, imo. Reporters know how to feed words to get "news", then the headlines will inevitably say something like "Breaking news!!! K's father says _____". Fill in the blanks.
I thought the reporter failed miserably. The fact that we don't know if SG meant that the killer must have been targeting the third floor, or didn't have to do that because his target(s) were on the 2nd floor, shows that the reporter needed to ask a clarifying question. I did not perceive these comments as relevant to the LE chain of command. He said "he" didn't need to go up the steps twice. Who? The lead detective? It makes more sense to me that he is referring to the perp.

Also, it would have been nice if he had gotten clarification about the means of death comments... K vs. M? E/X vs. K/M?
 

shane13

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but this is the same pattern with Steve and assumptions.

- As a military member posted recently, might be logical for a perp to work & ' clear' floors from top to bottom ( am not claiming that perp is ex military, nor that a methodical nature or pre-planning is exclusive to military training )
- we don't even know if perp entered on floor 2 or simply via floor 1 front door ( possibly next to two locked bedrooms? ) and worked his way upwards to the top

I just don't know how any of this can be more than assumptions & speculation at this stage
( same thing happened with ' Kaylee has a stalker' which later was retracted)
Re stalker: Maybe not.
IMo SG may believe many things that LE publicly states or rules out is not the case.
E.g., i n the grub video, one of the girls takes a selfie when someone is right behind her. There so many troubling things in that video.
We know SC has said 1 or more people were ruled out too hastily. That implies he thinks 1 of them is the perp.
Of course LE could be putting things out publicly so as not to let perp know they are planning to nab him soon. Meaning they do believe someone is a POI and maybe have agents 24/7 on him.
JMO.
 
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sds71

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pentimento

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Even if M and K's wounds don't match, that doesn't necessarily mean anything. After killing the first one, he might have been winded and might not have had much energy left to expend on the other one.

It also could be (for instance) that one of the girls was sleeping on her back and was stabbed through the heart or in the throat while the other was sleeping on her stomach and would therefore have been stabbed in the back.
You could be right of course, but my point was what the father was trying to communicate very emphatically and very emotionally in the interview. JMO.
 

Sandy007

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I already replied to this question to someone else.

No, we don't know, of course.

But.

There were various pictures published from the house mostly its windows, few of which have no blinds/curtains on.
( I believe I do not have to go and find all these images, this topic was discussed in details and many images circulated. If I have to, I will. )

So, If the lights were on, and/or intruder used a headlight or torch, then an innocent person/dog walker, walking by the street or neighbourhood, would have been altered by what was going on in the house looking thru its unobscured windows and could have altered the police. Or it could have been a neighbourgh, suffering from insomnia.

By the way, it happened to me once. I was up late at night, studying for my uni exam. So, I do not know why, but I looked thru the window and spotted a torch light moving in the building opposite my windows. There were large modern offices and it was unusual at 2 am someone with torch to move around. I contacted the police straight away, they arrived in 3 mins, I was still on the phone with the dispatcher and the force arrested burglars trying to steal computers.

So, based on logic and probabilities, and let me sress again - this is JMO, taking into consideration the level of preparation and planning by the killer, there were minimum if at all interior lights and minimum using of torch, at least at the communal areas of the house, especially the ones with unobscured windows.

I still may be wrong, of course. Only time will tell.
I do not like quotting myself, but as I want to add something to the post above, I will make an exception.

Here is the amendmend:

If the lights inside the house were on, even the bathroom lights, how the killer could have been sure that all tenants went to sleep, so it would be safe for him to enter the property?

Remember, the girls on the 3rd floor texted the ex-boyfriend till 2:52 am and then switched their phones. The attacks happened sometime between 3 and 4 am, I.e. shortly after the girls were awake and presumambly fell asleep.

As 4 people were attacked, and it takes time to kill one person, then the other and so on, at least first victim was killed closer to 3 than 4 am. Which gives very short window of opportunity to the killer

However, the killer was fairly confident that everyone in the house was asleep, and he may have known that because all or almost all lights inside the house went off one by one before he decided to step in.
 
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Emerald1328

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My family member was murdered and the LE is expected to locate a killer while compiling sufficient evidence for a conviction.

They will share information when they have conclusive information and they will advise when they have made an arrest. They may advise if they have a POI but will not give names because the last thing they need is someone taking the law into their own hands.

My family has no justice because of a compromised investigation and we never will. I would suggest that four families deserve justice and I fear that one devastated man could be causing more problems for investors than he’s solving right now.

If LE feels he is sharing too much information with the media, it may also impact how much information they share with him.
BBM…and that likely means they would share less info with Maddie’s family too, since they’re so close. Is that fair to Maddie’s family?
 

everybodhi

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There is no obligation for LE to give him any info that could compromise the investigation of K’s death, much less the deaths of E, X and M.
The issue is not his discretely asking LE for info.
The issue is him publicizing new case facts to the public.
LE does not have an end goal to find the killer. LE has an obligation to get the evidence that will lead to a DA being able to prosecute and put the murderer away- or get him the death penalty.
K’s father’s concerns do not rise above in importance to that of LE or the DA.
In fact a judge could put out a Gag Order so he or no one else couldn’t talk to the public about the case. IF a judge does that and he continues to speak, he could go to jail.

So the games being played in the public view and what is happening behind the scenes may not be at all the same thing.

All have one goal in common- to catch the guy. My guess is they are working together and a lot of this is not what it appears To be.

Addition after watching his interview Fox and Friends this AM…
He shared a third piece of info not confirmed by LE. Hmmm, I’m not sure what he thinks he is accomplishing but if justice can’t be serve because he keeps talking, a Gag Order would make sense.

JMO



JMO
I don’t think our constitution’s first amendment allows a judge to gag the public or an individual citizen of the public. They can’t even gag the press.
A gag order can cover LE, prosecutors, defense attorneys, and all employees working on the case.
It can gag witnesses during a trial.
But a gag order would solve the problem even though it’s not government officials on the case leaking, it would spell it out that no one outside officials on this case is allowed access to information.
But it’s still unlikely because officials haven’t made a mistake to require a gag.
 
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mayhem911

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SG now says that the way they died was different. Not even sure what that means because the coroner reported four homicides by stabbing. Maybe one was beheaded we don't know. In same interview with Lawrence Jones on Fox he says the killer didn't have to go up the stairs. But the killer didn't have to do anything. He chose to do everything that he did. So I wouldn't read too much into any comments unless it's a LE update. Remember they are still working behind the scenes painting the picture.
 

NuttMegg

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I thought the reporter failed miserably. The fact that we don't know if SG meant that the killer must have been targeting the third floor, or didn't have to do that because his target(s) were on the 2nd floor, shows that the reporter needed to ask a clarifying question. I did not perceive these comments as relevant to the LE chain of command. He said "he" didn't need to go up the steps twice. Who? The lead detective? It makes more sense to me that he is referring to the perp.
Imo K's father was saying. (Widely paraphrased, my interpretation)

The LE liasion doesn't have to constantly brush me off by telling me he has to go up steps in the hierarchy to get permission to tell me things I need to know. Step up, man, be an alpha.

Note he used present tense.

K's father, IMO does not always make the sense we would like to hear, because he is trying with all his might to work in the system, but with his broken heart he alludes to bits and pieces.

Imo
 
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