ID - DeOrr Kunz Jr, 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #17

[CanadianWells]

As far as 'exposing' her tubal...the way I see it is that he was giving that information to explain why he came up with this secret adoption theory (which I think is pretty far-fetched, but at this point I'd love for it to be true if it meant that little sweetheart is still alive.) You know if he'd just given the theory, people would be saying,"That's impossible. Why would you even have such an idea?" So IN MY OPINION, he was flow-charting where his idea came from. Explaining what made him feel that way.

Also, let's face it...at this point the gloves are off. The parents have stiffed this guy for money, while raking in lots of cash through donations, told a film production crew that they fired him, (I wonder what reason they gave?) and have been deemed suspicious and involved by: two private investigators, the sheriff, the FBI, etc.
their stories have been inconsistent from the beginning, and God knows what else. Remember, we know only a tiny fraction of what the authorities know. Since we're all WSers, find me a case where all of the information has been released to the public as it is discovered.
I predict (hope and pray) that IF these parents are involved one of them cracks, and soon. Since LE feels they definitely are, they're applying any and all pressure they can. It seems they played nice with them for a good long time and the results of that have been futile. It's time to ramp up the game so they can find that toddler.

lots of good perspective here, and I appreciate it. I sure hope you're right that one will crack soon.

 

[Ava Adore]

As far as 'exposing' her tubal...the way I see it is that he was giving that information to explain why he came up with this secret adoption theory (which I think is pretty far-fetched, but at this point I'd love for it to be true if it meant that little sweetheart is still alive.) You know if he'd just given the theory, people would be saying,"That's impossible. Why would you even have such an idea?" So IN MY OPINION, he was flow-charting where his idea came from. Explaining what made him feel that way.

Also, let's face it...at this point the gloves are off. The parents have stiffed this guy for money, while raking in lots of cash through donations, told a film production crew that they fired him, (I wonder what reason they gave?) and have been deemed suspicious and involved by: two private investigators, the sheriff, the FBI, etc.
their stories have been inconsistent from the beginning, and God knows what else. Remember, we know only a tiny fraction of what the authorities know. Since we're all WSers, find me a case where all of the information has been released to the public as it is discovered.
I predict (hope and pray) that IF these parents are involved one of them cracks, and soon. Since LE feels they definitely are, they're applying any and all pressure they can. It seems they played nice with them for a good long time and the results of that have been futile. It's time to ramp up the game so they can find that toddler.

Oh, believe me, I agree that they are shady and have made some really mind boggling decisions. I have just seen this happen before, like with the Maura Murray case, where the police name some a POI or suspect, and all of these wild theories (ie not really having any credibility behind them) happen and members of the family get harassed and it kind of turns ugly. I just think we have to check ourselves constantly to make sure we aren't making statements that aren't even merited (saying his mom didn't love him or wasn't a good parent because she didn't want another kid). I just don't think tubal surgery necessarily connects to abduction for adoption, you know?

I know in the Maura Murray case, the harassment and wild accusations got so bad that her father/family stopped talking to anyone pretty much.

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[iluvmua]

Does Jessica have a lawyer yet?

 

[white rabbit]

aeronomy, teatime...great posts.

adoption has NOTHING to do with this missing child, IMO. little deorr IMO was murdered. JMO.

 

[Ava Adore]

Does Jessica have a lawyer yet?

I believe they said she doesn't yet.

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[Arnie M]

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Here I go again

I must point out some things from the VILT interview that may not be as bad as they look

Vernal is baby DeOrr's father's name and I am to use that from now on

--- Vernal is camping and DeOrr goes missing
--- Vilt said he knew Vernal from fixing his car in an autobody shop
--- Vilt said he liked Vernal and it was Vilt that approached Vernal
--- Vilt said he would only charge expenses and not for the hours he spent investigating
--- Vernal says yes , based on knowing $1,900 had been raised via go-fund
--- Vernal finds out the $1,900 has been absconded by the person who raised it on go-fund
--- Vernal is now expected to pay Vilt himself and I doubt he could afford it
--- Vilt also wants to offer a $25,000 reward
--- Vernal does not want him to offer a reward.
--- Makes sense to me , where was Vernal going to come up with all that money ?
--- as it turns out Vilt did not get paid by Vernal
--- I dont think Vernal would have said yes to use Vilt except for knowing the $1,900 was available
--- We cannot blame Vernal for the $1,900 disappearing , nor blame him for not paying it himself
--- I dont think Vernal initially suspected abduction ... no need for nation wide reward
--- Remember it was Vilt who proposed the abduction - black Rubicon - theory which was proven false

Sorry Vilt , you lose that round and Vernal remains standing , at least to me.

I am not saying Vernal is innocent , just saying he is not guilty of these invented fictions and scenarios.

It appears Vilt approached Vernal as a friend and walked away as a non-friend , and Vilt complains of an unpaid bill

Vernal needed help , called the sheriff and searchers , and they came , without requiring payment

Mr Vilt seems like a nice guy and I wish him well , but if he tries to play victim here I think that is wrong

Whether Vernal is involved in DeOrrs disappearance or not , is beside the point

thanks.

http://www.eastidahonews.com/2016/01/former-kunz-p-i/
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[bessie]

As far as 'exposing' her tubal...the way I see it is that he was giving that information to explain why he came up with this secret adoption theory (which I think is pretty far-fetched, but at this point I'd love for it to be true if it meant that little sweetheart is still alive.) You know if he'd just given the theory, people would be saying,"That's impossible. Why would you even have such an idea?" So IN MY OPINION, he was flow-charting where his idea came from. Explaining what made him feel that way.

<rsbm>

Thank you. That's exactly what he was doing, flowcharting, which did not conclude in a presumption of murder.

It's time to drop it, and move on.

 

[Ava Adore]

Also, did we establish if they're married yet? Wouldn't marriage protect them from testifying against one another?

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[atthelake]

Trisha's radio show tomorrow? I had not seen that posted anywhere thank you. If somebody can throw up a link ...that would be great.. Or perhaps it's up thread and I need to keep swimming..

Tricia's radio show link.
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...Bowerman-in-the-case-of-missing-DeOrr-Kunz-Jr

Thanks SC mom !

 

[Midge Montana]

Neither here nor there, but going back a few pages to the question of the possible shoulder injury...
Have there been other shirtless photos of the little guy? I wonder if Jessica had a traumatic delivery? I say this because my own son was injured at birth. He was stuck and they had to 'rip' him out of me. This resulted in Erb's Palsy, damage to the brachial plexus a network of nerves in the shoulder. To this day his arm looks almost identical to that picture, with winging of the scapula, abnormal supination and imbalance in the shoulder size and shape. I noticed that the first time I saw that photo. I don't see any signs of abuse in any of the photos I've seen. Of course that means nothing, but I see a well-nourished and cared for child.
My first thought was accidental death (IMO hot car death) and panicked cover up.

 

[Sillybilly]

Also, did we establish if they're married yet? Wouldn't marriage protect them from testifying against one another?

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It appears husband-wife privilege would be exempt for the reasons given in my previous post:

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...round-10-July-2015-17&p=12312295#post12312295

 

[Ava Adore]

Neither here nor there, but going back a few pages to the question of the possible shoulder injury...
Have there been other shirtless photos of the little guy? I wonder if Jessica had a traumatic delivery? I say this because my own son was injured at birth. He was stuck and they had to 'rip' him out of me. This resulted in Erb's Palsy, damage to the brachial plexus a network of nerves in the shoulder. To this day his arm looks almost identical to that picture, with winging of the scapula, abnormal supination and imbalance in the shoulder size and shape. I noticed that the first time I saw that photo. I don't see any signs of abuse in any of the photos I've seen. Of course that means nothing, but I see a well-nourished and cared for child.
My first thought was accidental death (IMO hot car death) and panicked cover up.

I'm so sorry that happened to you!

That's also the first thing I looked at when this case started, was past photos of him. He seems like a happy little guy and well taken care of. That doesn't mean an accident with a cover-up couldn't have happened, of course, but kind of dismissed the whole adoption two years later for me.

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[Ava Adore]

It appears husband-wife privilege would be exempt for the reasons given in my previous post:

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...round-10-July-2015-17&p=12312295#post12312295

Ahh. Thank you for that. Sometimes I miss posts in high traffic threads. But that makes sense and makes me feel better.

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[ILOKAL]

This seems like a much larger puzzle piece to me than the other stuff we're focusing on! Hear here.

Maybe it's because we only have one side of that story. Sometimes, money is GIVEN. And other times, money is "given"! JMO

 

[Aunt_Tulip]

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Here I go again

I must point out some things from the VILT interview that may not be as bad as they look

Vernal is baby DeOrr's father's name and I am to use that from now on



--- I dont think Vernal initially suspected abduction ... no need for nation wide reward
--- Remember it was Vilt who proposed the abduction - black Rubicon - theory which was proven false




http://www.eastidahonews.com/2016/01/former-kunz-p-i/
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RSBM - just trying to keep my recollections clear. Weren't Vernal and Jessica the ones to bring up abduction right off the bat before Vilt was ever even in the picture?

 

[Sillybilly]

RSBM - just trying to keep my recollections clear. Weren't Vernal and Jessica the ones to bring up abduction right off the bat before Vilt was ever even in the picture?

July 13 2015
http://webcache.googleusercontent.c...-well-find-you-son/+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ca

After three days of intense searches, Deorr&#8217;s parents believe their 2-year-old was kidnapped Friday as the family was camping in Leadore

 

[haven71]

RSBM - just trying to keep my recollections clear. Weren't Vernal and Jessica the ones to bring up abduction right off the bat before Vilt was ever even in the picture?

Yes, they did.

Thinking about IR right now. How I thought he was high on drugs when he answered the door when NE showed up on his doorstep for a video. Maybe he was, but maybe he was not.

But after this interview, he seems simpleminded. in this new interview NE asks how the past 6 months have been for him. I would've expected him to say a circus, or being hounded by the media, or something of that nature. But he seemed clueless as to the implication. He said something like "it was just kinda boring" without mentioning the case at all.

I have never thought IR was involved. Even when I thought he was high on drugs (which he may have been, who knows). He sure came across as a nice and straightforward guy in the video, I really doubt he has anything to hide.

 

[Midge Montana]

Maybe it's because we only have one side of that story. Sometimes, money is GIVEN. And other times, money is "given"! JMO

What does that even mean? Sorry I seem dense, but could you explain what you mean about the two different 'given' s. The way I understood, the PI wanted to donate the money from his own pocket. I didn't hear anything about repayment but since he was being generous enough to donate his time (not cheap) I wonder if he expected the reward money to be repaid? Maybe the parents will rebut his statements, as I know they are concerned about their image in the media. I know I would be too, if I were in the middle of this.

 

[SweetT]

Vilt was going to use his own funding for the 20K reward right? I don't think it was expected for Deorr Sr to pay for that unless I am mistaken.

 

[Arnie M]

Trying very hard to think of a plausible explanation for the parents not wanting Vilt to take this case nationwide for exposure and also why in God's green earth would they be against him putting up $20,000 of his own money as a reward?!?!

Can someone PLEASE help me out with that?

Hi Midge ... maybe my post #627 will answer a few questions. thanks.

Specific to your question there is much more to the reward money issues

Rewards are almost never offered right away

--- remember police and searchers and the general public are already on the lookout , no reward money required
--- besides it would be foolish to offer a big reward early in a case that is expected to be solved right away.
--- typically witnesses come forward because they are good people trying to help , they do not do it for money
--- typically rewards are offered if a case starts to go cold , it gives the public a heads up to keep looking
--- in crime and missing person cases police are already inundated with hundreds of pest tips , but they must listen to them all for the one good one in there somewhere
--- when a reward is offered the hundreds of pest tips becomes thousands of pest tips.
--- having said that , there is a time and place where rewards are offered right away , and usually are advertised nation wide , during serious known abduction cases or kidnappings when urgency is required.

Hope that makes sense. And even thought the DeOrr case is becoming a "cold" one (unsolved after 6 months) I dont think any big rewards are offered . I could be wrong. best wishes.

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