ID - DeOrr Kunz Jr, 2, Timber Creek Campground, 10 July 2015 - #17

Discussion in 'DeOrr Kunz, Jr.' started by bessie, Jan 22, 2016.

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  1. kammiemc

    kammiemc New Member

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    Over the past six months I have read so many posts from people who have never met this family saying how clearly loving they were toward their son based on pics. I tortured myself by going back through cases of moms who killed their children to see if I could tell anything from their pics. (Not saying at all that I think this was homicide!) Based on pics, Casey Anthony looked like the sweetest, cutest, most loving mom there could possibly be.


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  2. Ava Adore

    Ava Adore New Member

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    I agree. I wasn't saying the pics have convinced me of their innocence, just that we couldn't deduce from pictures that he was being abused or not loved because they don't show that (was responding to someone else's post).

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  3. Sillybilly

    Sillybilly Administrator Staff Member Administrator

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  4. neesaki

    neesaki Well-Known Member

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    Just catching up, this is an interesting theory. I had thought of the trafficking angle a while back, but had pretty much discounted it. Now this. Interesting too that Klein didn't state he had ruled out "abduction". He stated he had ruled out "forced abduction". Apologies if I'm repeating something already posted, I'm pretty far behind.
     
  5. Ava Adore

    Ava Adore New Member

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    When did DeOrr senior obtain a lawyer? Is it possible someone advised him that nationwide attention wasn't needed yet for the reasons stated by Arnie?

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  6. Midge Montana

    Midge Montana Well-Known Member

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    Hmm...I still don't think those are good reasons for parents to be AGAINST free reward money being offered to find their precious child. I'm simply trying to, as a mom, put myself in their shoes. I would welcome any and all legitimate forms of help. They were not adverse to accepting money from various ******** campaigns and whatnot.
    I guess I could *maybe* understand them not wanting to take out a bank loan for it, but to have it donated would be no skin off their noses.
    I don't see how any of your reasons would harm the case whatsoever. From a LE perspective maybe they would be inundated with tips, but that would be LE's problem and WAS LE against the reward being offered?
    Also, do you know when this offer was made? As for getting nationwide exposure...wasn't it the parents' suggestion that an abduction had taken place? (Excuse me if I'm mistaken I only picked up on this case three days ago and do have some confusion about a few things.) Did they strongly feel that the person(s) that had abducted the child were staying very close to that area, not going out of state, etc.? What would lead them to believe that?
    Thank you for your answers.
     
  7. ZooSleuth

    ZooSleuth Former Member

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    He got a lawyer Monday when the news that the parents are suspects broke. Deorr Sr. claimed to Vilt that the sheriff told him not to do the reward and get national attention. That was most likely a lie.
     
  8. TeaTime

    TeaTime Well-Known Member

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    I have a few very dear friends that voluntarily gave physical custody of their children to their ex-husbands and retained only rights of visitation. They did it for all the right reasons; the father made much more money; the father owned the house which was in the school district, in which the children were raised thus far, in a neighborhood full of their friends and even parental grandparents; the mothers had no money to pay for litigation of custody issues and knew that there would be a monthly battle over child support payments; the mothers could afford only to rent a studio apartment and had no means to provide suitable housing for their kids; the fathers loved the kids and they him; he was also a great parent. It didn't make them bad mothers any more than it makes the fathers bad parents when the tables are reversed and the mother has physical custody and dad gets visitation. Society needs to get over this sexist prejudice. I was painful for my friends as people always looked sideways at them. No one looks sideways at the dads though.

    I think Jessica could not have fought for custody anyway and therefore surrendered those rights. Good grief, she wasn't even 22 yet, probably unemployed and had no way to pay the hourly rate of an attorney for a long and drawn out legal battle. I think it is smart for a 22 year old woman, already the mother of 3, to have her tubes tied. Why should she take BC pills which have horrible side effects for many women and are known to cause cancer later in life? There is no crime in not wanting MORE children. There is no crime in not wanting ANY children.

    It proves nothing and was despicable of Vilt to announce this to the world as if there was anything relevant to it.

    Furthermore, isn't it nice that Vilt has a letter stating all sorts of nasty things about these two? I mean they had no say in what he wrote. He could write anything to them, it proves nothing.

    Self-serving letters are not reliable.

    Just who was going to put up the money for a reward? Someone had to put it up. You can't just offer a reward and not pay if the child is found. It doesn't work that way. I can say with 100% certainty that neither DK, JM or any of their families could come up with a $20K reward fund. Not many people can.

    If Vilt was so discouraged by the behavior of the parents, he should have just walked off the case and kept his mouth shut. So what if the parents said they fired him? Did that change the outcome of his investigation? I hope not, but it seems to have flavored his opinion of them. He has no facts that point to criminal activity, his letter simply reveals that he doesn't like or believe the parents. Oh well, stand in line Vilt.

    I have been thinking about Kleins' 4 hour statement and have no idea what to make of it.

    Who was that young woman in TX that said she handed her 10 month old baby over to a couple in a park and it was arranged by another woman? She is in prison right? How about the child in Chicago that was given to a couple that came to the door and asked for him? This is a common story among child murderers but, there is not one case of it being true. I guess this was just one theory Vilt had, not one he lingered over.
     
  9. Ava Adore

    Ava Adore New Member

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    [emoji106] [emoji106] [emoji106] [emoji106] [emoji106] [emoji106] [emoji106] [emoji106] [emoji106]

    Yes.

    Also, I felt Vilt was spewing a bit of vitriol over the "being fired" comment.

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  10. bessie

    bessie Verified Insider

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    Per Vilt:

    I offered a $20,000 reward, and they did not want me offering the reward. They said that the Sheriff didn’t want it. They said the Sheriff didn’t want to go public, and the Sheriff never mentioned that to me and so… I started finding little…little things that they were inconsistent.

    Perhaps there is some truth in this statement, and the Sheriff did discourage them from offering a large reward. I've always felt that was a possibility because it's not an uncommon stance among LE agencies. We know that since late July, SB was convinced there was no abduction. And if, as some have suggested, he suspected the parents early on -- at least by August -- he might have had concern about wasting resources, and leading the investigation off track. Just a thought.

    Be prepared to meet resistance from law enforcement. Some law enforcement agencies disapprove of reward offers because they can result in a torrent of false leads. Keep law enforcement informed of any decision you make regarding a reward, and if you sense concern or resistance, point out that all it takes is one solid lead to recover your child. Also, the desire for reward money could motivate an abductor to keep a child alive.

    http://www.ojjdp.gov/pubs/childismissing/ch6.html
     
  11. Arnie M

    Arnie M Well-Known Member

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    Hi SweeT .... hopefully my posts #627 and #641 will help , but you also bring up a good point

    At first Vilt said HE wanted to post a reward , and even to me , it sounded like his own money and I thought that was pretty amazing and generous , and I gathered that he did it based on saying Vernal had fixed a car for him , he liked Vernal , and jumped in to help.

    However , he was also asking that expenses be paid back , gas money , phone calls , things like that.

    Something does not add up here.

    It is like holding out a generous $25,000 in one hand and also be a tightwad asking for a few hundred back in the other hand

    But there is more. Mr Vilt wanted to post a $25,000 reward , be paid expenses to investigate , presumably to find DeOrr , then what ??? .... find DeOrr and claim his own reward ?????

    Something does not add up here.

    That is like saying hire me to solve your case but I cannot solve your case unless a reward is offered to bring the public in to solve your case.

    I am being cynical of course , But if I was to make a guess I bet Vilt was counting on maybe go-fund money to pay him plus cover the reward , which to me would have been fine.

    I would have no problem with Mr Vilt being paid , nor Mr Klein being paid. It is just ironic that those 2 PI's have lit more wildfires than some of the wild stuff on Facebook

    .
     
  12. Midge Montana

    Midge Montana Well-Known Member

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    Good question for the sheriff!
    Personally, I think Vilt should have put up the reward regardless of the parents declining the offer. ANYONE can put up a reward, I don't think parental permission is needed. I may be wrong though.
     
  13. Ava Adore

    Ava Adore New Member

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    I believe they can, so maybe this proves he was expecting them to fund it in some sense ?

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  14. bessie

    bessie Verified Insider

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    Nate Eaton's interview with Sheriff Bowerman, August 18, 2015

    9:27
    Nate Eaton:
    “Where do you guys go from here?”

    9:30
    Sheriff Bowerman:
    “Well, we wait until we get our report from the FBI. That’s going to be critical…and…uh…We’re still asking the public, uh, to help us if they have any information to identify a 2 ½-year-old with blonde hair. I’m not sure that’s a positive thing for our office because every 2 ½ –year-old with blonde hair looks just like Deorr, and so I’m asking the public if they know a family and they didn’t have a 2 ½-year-old prior to this time period, that’s what I want to look at closely, but if it’s somebody they don’t know, to contact their local law enforcement and have them follow-up for us, because this is overwhelming for our small office.”

    10:20
    Nate Eaton:
    “Yeah, have you guys just been bombarded with tips?”

    Sheriff Bowerman:
    “Absolutely! Absolutely!”

    10:24
    Nate Eaton:
    “What are your thoughts about the private investigator? Is that just something the family is doing on their own to…?

    Sheriff Bowerman:
    Yep! Yep! Totally uh…Kuddos to them for, you know, looking for more help. Um, I can only do so much, and maybe he can turn up something that we’ve missed, uh, but I think, you know, he primarily thinks it’s an abduction, and I think that’s very remote
     
  15. gliving

    gliving Woof

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    So anxious to hear Tricia's interview with Sheriff Bowerman.

    The PIs are annoying static. I really don't want to hear anything more from them. Their 15 seconds are up.
     
  16. neesaki

    neesaki Well-Known Member

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    Klein ruled out all forms of abduction and adoption ? Well I sure missed that. I should go back and delete my last post, LOL.
     
  17. Midge Montana

    Midge Montana Well-Known Member

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    RSBM.

    Bingo.
     
  18. Elle*Bee

    Elle*Bee We're all just stories in the end.

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    (Snipped by me) It's been reported that Vilt was putting up the reward money. I've always wondered whether he has the ability to raise funds or has them on reserve. I have no idea whether the family would be expected to repay the reward money.

    As JM apparently not wanting more kids, doesn't necessarily mean she doesn't want the kids she has. (If it's revealed that she has NO relationship with her older two, then that might give me pause. But I'm just not ready to color her with a kid-hating, bad mom crayon. Am I suspicious of her and DK? Yeah, because of all the twists and turns and holes.)
     
  19. bessie

    bessie Verified Insider

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    Yes, but large rewards can be a double-edged sword.
     
  20. wodalo2

    wodalo2 New Member

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    If I had to guess, I would say for the same reason you would praise a search and rescue team that had not found you missing son... this was an answer to why say no to the $20,000 reward...

    Also, I saw in the "re-enactment video" that dad had a holstered sidearm. Surely he would have also worn it camping. And if so, surely he would have had it while the three slept in the back of the Suburban and surely would have taken it off. Did he have a lockbox? Has this been checked or discussed? Was it checked to see if it had been fired by LE?

    I'm not suggesting the child might have gotten a hold of it, because then you'd have to haul to town to try to get him to a doctor. Unless it was too late, then you might need to haul to a store to get something to clean any blood, something that wouldn't be questioned for having blood on it like, I don't know, female items? Then haul all the way back to clean the Suburban.

    Sounds pretty out there. I'm grasping at straws. If some crazy, unthinkable thing like that happened, imagine what other campers would thing seeing a truck haulin' all over the place, and how surprised you would be to find out there were traveled roads above, that you could clearly see the whole campsite from.

    Has this been discussed? I will now go back to keeping my opinions to myself.
     
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