Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 16, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *Arrests* #47

[Hatfield]

Right.

Cut-throat defences where the accused all blame each other are reasonably common, but we have to aware of the limits of the approach - especially due to impact of 100s of years of common law decisions on party offences.

In this case, the accused have the advantage of one of the principal actors being dead. And the fact that it was AC who shot Charles is significant.

But without getting too far into the weeds, the Prosecutor is allowed to present the murder spree as a joint enterprise and he has plenty of evidence for that - especially due to the concealment of bodies, lying, and the fact that the murders happened at different times.

So LV may have more luck with Charles where AC pulled the trigger, and it may be hard to prove murder, let alone a joint enterprise. But the kids are much more difficult, because obviously if AC killed one of her kids, she became a conspirator when he covered it up and buried the body at her Affair Partners place. The second murder becomes unexplainable, and I think it will be very hard to get any jury to believe she only decided after the killings to keep it all secret.

Dear Chad has a similar issue. Even if he covered the murders up to help AC, how can he explain doing it twice? And how can the sudden and convenient death of his wife be explained?

So in practical terms, I think simply blaming AC for everything is likely to fail, unless the accused are prepared to testify, and have some way to prove AC acted alone in the actual murders. If they don't testify, then I see no way to get an exculpatory version in front of the court beyond mere speculation

JMO
Good points.

I really hope the judge can keep those two and their shared or not shared lawyers from talking with each other. The more they can communicate the more their stories will match up.

Its going to be important to identify contradictions and mistruths in either of their stories and so keeping them separated will be important from this point onwards.

The fact the bodies were in CD's backyard and with all of LVD's statements to others and whatever LE can get from Cell Phone and text messages should be enough to get both of them convicted for Conspiracy to commit murder. The actual murder charges are going to be the tough one to pin on them if they both blame AC.

I am keeping up the hope that LE can find enough evidence that pins them both with real murder charges eventually. CD for his wife's murder and Lori for her children's murder and Charles murder as well.

 

[JolietJake]

I have a few questions for the legal experts who frequent this site. It appears imminent that the two of them will be getting more serious charges at some point soon. Assuming both will be tried separately, is there a pecking order in who goes on trial first? If so, is this decided upon by the courts, an agreement between lawyers, or a rule based on who got charged first? Could the prosecution use that as a tool on deciding when to press additional charges and in what order to either CD or LV?
I'm curious how this would work in a case like this. Thank you in advance.

 

[Colorado303]

JMO
Good points.

I really hope the judge can keep those two and their shared or not shared lawyers from talking with each other. The more they can communicate the more their stories will match up.

Its going to be important to identify contradictions and mistruths in either of their stories and so keeping them separated will be important from this point onwards.

The fact the bodies were in CD's backyard and with all of LVD's statements to others and whatever LE can get from Cell Phone and text messages should be enough to get both of them convicted for Conspiracy to commit murder. The actual murder charges are going to be the tough one to pin on them if they both blame AC.

I am keeping up the hope that LE can find enough evidence that pins them both with real murder charges eventually. CD for his wife's murder and Lori for her children's murder and Charles murder as well.

I wonder if sitting in his car Chad had the foresight to call Lori and let her know he was about to be sent to the hoosegow, or if his calls just stopped and her lawyer had to break the news to her. It must have come as a shock what with him telling her the public was supporting them and all. I would have loved to see the look on her face when she learned he was off to the slammer.

I’m really curious what those two talked about for all those hours while Lori was in jail and Chad was still free. Surely they weren’t stupid enough to say anything blatantly incriminating but perhaps there’s something in there that prosecutors can use.

There probably was talk about Chad’s progress (or lack thereof) on raising bail for Lori. That would be fun to hear.

Beyond that, did they talk about dark spirits, the end of the world, recruiting the other 143,994, etc? Or was it just hours and hours of I love you, I love you more, no I love you more?

 

[gumchew]

I wonder if sitting in his car Chad had the foresight to call Lori and let her know he was about to be sent to the hoosegow, or if his calls just stopped and her lawyer had to break the news to her. It must have come as a shock what with him telling her the public was supporting them and all. I would have loved to see the look on her face when she learned he was off to the slammer.

I’m really curious what those two talked about for all those hours while Lori was in jail and Chad was still free. Surely they weren’t stupid enough to say anything blatantly incriminating but perhaps there’s something in there that prosecutors can use.

There probably was talk about Chad’s progress (or lack thereof) on raising bail for Lori. That would be fun to hear.

Beyond that, did they talk about dark spirits, the end of the world, recruiting the other 143,994, etc? Or was it just hours and hours of I love you, I love you more, no I love you more?

I don't think you can call people in jail, right? Isn't that a one-way (outbound only) sort of thing?

 

[Peach Pie]

...In the custody battle for #TyleeRyan, Joseph Ryan alleged in court docs obtained by
@wickedtruthbomb
that #LoriVallow believed Tylee was Lori's dead sister reincarnated. Stacey Cox died in 1998 at age 31.
@LawCrimeNetwork

I wonder if the mysterious death of LVD's sister will be revisited now.

 

[Forever Young]

I wonder if the mysterious death of LVD's sister will be revisited now.

Yeah, and what did she think about Tylee needing to die if she thought Tylee had been Stacey in her last life? JMO, makes me think "I offed you once, and I'll off you twice".

 

[passionflower]

Anyone hear what LVD mother thinks of all the deaths in her family? A daughter, son , son in law and grandchildren? I’d go nuts!

 

[indicolite22]

Anyone hear what LVD mother thinks of all the deaths in her family? A daughter, son , son in law and grandchildren? I’d go nuts!

I can imagine what she thinks about Charles' death. Lori's sister was clear about that in their interview. If Alex didn't kill Charles, the latter would have killed Lori - or something to that effect. The family is probably content with the official explanation that Alex died of natural causes. I wonder if they blame Chad for the children.

 

[Peach Pie]

That mother and sister on the news interview earlier on... They gave me chills.

Then again, I can't even imagine being in a similar position where it looks likely that one of your grown children or siblings is guilty of heinous murders. I could definitely see some self-delusion kicking in there and wanting to grasp at any other possible explanation.

Also, what they thought, said and did publicly vs. privately could well be completely different, especially when there was still that small chance that the children had just been put in hiding with someone else.

 

[Diddian]

I can imagine what she thinks about Charles' death. Lori's sister was clear about that in their interview. If Alex didn't kill Charles, the latter would have killed Lori - or something to that effect. The family is probably content with the official explanation that Alex died of natural causes. I wonder if they blame Chad for the children.

They can THINK that, but they can't claim it is rational thinking since they are now as aware as the rest of us that Lori has amply demonstrated her vast and brazen capacity for lying to shift the responsibility for her own murderous actions onto those who end up dead as a result.

 

[SiberianSleuth]

Anyone hear what LVD mother thinks of all the deaths in her family? A daughter, son , son in law and grandchildren? I’d go nuts!

But she already was nuts.
MOO

 

[indicolite22]

They can THINK that, but they can't claim it is rational thinking since they are now as aware as the rest of us that Lori has amply demonstrated her vast and brazen capacity for lying to shift the responsibility for her own murderous actions onto those who end up dead as a result.

It was rational to them that Lori was a good mother who would never hurt her kids. I doubt they now think that she killed everyone else too. IMO they will try to find a scapegoat for the kids.

 

[Colorado303]

I don't think you can call people in jail, right? Isn't that a one-way (outbound only) sort of thing?

Good point. I guess she had to call him. Wonder if she called him while he was sitting in the driveway. I also wonder if her pod mates got annoyed at her hogging their shared phone. It would be nice if she wasn’t having an easy time making friends there. Now that word is out that her kids were found buried in her new hubby’s backyard perhaps she needs to look over her shoulder.

 

[Colorado303]

They can THINK that, but they can't claim it is rational thinking since they are now as aware as the rest of us that Lori has amply demonstrated her vast and brazen capacity for lying to shift the responsibility for her own murderous actions onto those who end up dead as a result.

I suspect they’re taking a “don’t confuse me with facts” approach.

 

[Diddian]

I suspect they’re taking a “don’t confuse me with facts” approach.

Always a sign that "rational" is nowhere in sight.

 

[acutename]

sorry- always way behind in this case- bringing this forward from thread #46:

chwilfrydedd said: ↑

Can I just throw out there as a lifelong member of the LDS church that I, and everyone I know does not view getting married 10 days after meeting or two weeks after a spouse dies as normal! When mentioned that we view ‘quick’ marriages as ‘normal’ months are usually involved, not weeks! And usually the quick part is after the engagement part!

I do agree with this. In "normal" LDS families they date for a significant period of time (ie: a year) then a period of engagement, plans to marry in the Temple to receive endowments and become sealed for time and eternity, and have a big reception (often at a family home, the ward or even Stake house - depending on the size of the crowd).
In this regional area (small town & mostly rural), LDS closely knit families do not look upon this quick of a nuptial as a positive thing in most cases and would be highly suspect of covering up (a pregnancy perhaps) something scandalous.
MOO


Proud member of the AFKBPOFPOPL

very curious from the outside, how does LDS view remarriage for people after a divorce or a spouse dies? Since LD (CRVD) was supposedly on her 4th or 5th marriage, I have to think that she was way outside the "ideal" situation even apart from the situation with her children and all these other developments (simple word for criminal goings on). And not to condone murder(!), but I also wonder if she was really not doing well taking care of the children and did not try to reach out for help, just let things get beyond out of control.

 

[GoneGoldfishin']

sorry- always way behind in this case- bringing this forward from thread #46:

chwilfrydedd said: ↑

Can I just throw out there as a lifelong member of the LDS church that I, and everyone I know does not view getting married 10 days after meeting or two weeks after a spouse dies as normal! When mentioned that we view ‘quick’ marriages as ‘normal’ months are usually involved, not weeks! And usually the quick part is after the engagement part!

I do agree with this. In "normal" LDS families they date for a significant period of time (ie: a year) then a period of engagement, plans to marry in the Temple to receive endowments and become sealed for time and eternity, and have a big reception (often at a family home, the ward or even Stake house - depending on the size of the crowd).
In this regional area (small town & mostly rural), LDS closely knit families do not look upon this quick of a nuptial as a positive thing in most cases and would be highly suspect of covering up (a pregnancy perhaps) something scandalous.
MOO


Proud member of the AFKBPOFPOPL

very curious from the outside, how does LDS view remarriage for people after a divorce or a spouse dies? Since LD (CRVD) was supposedly on her 4th or 5th marriage, I have to think that she was way outside the "ideal" situation even apart from the situation with her children and all these other developments (simple word for criminal goings on). And not to condone murder(!), but I also wonder if she was really not doing well taking care of the children and did not try to reach out for help, just let things get beyond out of control.

As far as I remember, there was never really much judgement when someone remarried after a spouse died. There weren't very many divorced people in my ward growing up, but when they did quietly get married again, people would outwardly be nice but gossip behind the scenes.. Its probably the same now.
As for the bolded part, they had live in nannies, so I am not sure what other help you mean as far as taking care of the children. Moo.

 

[Ohmeohmy]

Tylee Ryan told therapist her father molested her; Mom Lori Vallow said she would choose ‘death’ over giving Tylee to dad Joseph Ryan [DOCS]

 

[Redvines86]

Tylee Ryan told therapist her father molested her; Mom Lori Vallow said she would choose ‘death’ over giving Tylee to dad Joseph Ryan [DOCS]

I think that article was written whether intentionally or not to make it sound like JR actually molested Tylee, whereas the actual documents themselves that Tricia read on her WS youtube show that Lori was making it sound like JR had been sexually abusing the children. The documents definitely show that Lori's crazy went way, way back. MOO

 

[gumchew]

Good point. I guess she had to call him. Wonder if she called him while he was sitting in the driveway. I also wonder if her pod mates got annoyed at her hogging their shared phone. It would be nice if she wasn’t having an easy time making friends there. Now that word is out that her kids were found buried in her new hubby’s backyard perhaps she needs to look over her shoulder.

Oh, to have been a fly on the wall for that conversation!