Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 16, Tammy Daybell, 49, Sept & Oct 2019 *Arrests* #62

Discussion in 'Currently Awaiting Trial' started by Patch Tuesday, Dec 20, 2019.

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  1. Gigiky

    Gigiky Well-Known Member

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    The reason I ask the question about AC shooting CV. And seeming not to be charge. Is because it appeared it wasn't until after AC dies, Lori goes to jail and the children were found. Then they are now charging Lori with conspiring with AC to murder CV. If this is the way it went down all I can say is, Way to drop the ball.

    Also wondering if AC was cremated?
     


  2. indicolite22

    indicolite22 Well-Known Member

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    Let's not forget that Lori told everyone (including their families and the police) that Charles was cheating on her. Of course MG also knew that he had been declared a zombie. We don't know which came first. During the time Lori vanished for 58 days Charles wrote a letter to Lori in which he denied that he had been unfaithful. He learned about her claim from Kay.
     
  3. indicolite22

    indicolite22 Well-Known Member

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    Vallow family reported to Arizona DCS twice in 2019, agency confirms


    One reports was made in February by JJ's school. The second is mentioned in the FBI communications from December.

    "DCS confirms it received two communications about the Vallow family in 2019, but claims that neither resulted in an investigation because there was no showing of abuse or neglect."
     
    Last edited: Sep 7, 2021
  4. kshultz06082

    kshultz06082 Super Snooper

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    You win the best comment of the day trophy!
     
  5. Satchie

    Satchie Well-Known Member

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    Yes, there was an ongoing investigation by Chandler police into the killing of CV. It had not been completed when the whole issue about the children became foremost and the FBI took over to pursue that element.

    It appears that as soon as CV was killed, some members of the extended family began to contact Chandler police alleging it was a planned conspiracy, and began feeding them emails, text messages, and the parts of the story they knew about.

    Police investigations take time, especially when none of the players: AC, LV, CV, actually lived, or continued to live, in the community. All their previous history and ongoing activities were in other jurisdictions, so Chandler police would have had to get all the details from other police departments, particularly Gilbert police, try to confirm/piece together the story, before they could even begin to compile evidence of the conspiracy.

    Arizona has a 'stand your ground' law, so the fact that CV did not live in the home, but Lori did, and her brother claimed to be protecting her against assault in her own home, IMO saved him from being arrested. I think LV/AC knew this, and scripted the killing to happen that way, luring CV to to home.

    This link refers to the ongoing communication between Chandler police and extended family members. Lori Vallow Daybell case: A breakdown of evidence in 2,500 emails released by Chandler Police | 12news.com
     
  6. indicolite22

    indicolite22 Well-Known Member

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    The investigation did find that Charles was shot the second time while lying on the floor and that no resuscitation was attempted, so I'd like to think that the conclusion wasn't going to be self-defense, irregardless of the increased publicity due to other cases.
     
  7. Ruminations

    Ruminations Eating ice cream.

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    I agree - but Alex himself did tell LE that he left the room where the murder occurred, got his gun, then returned after allegedly being hit by a bat in the back of his head hard enough to break skin, but not hard enough to prevent him from doing the above. Alex did not tell LE that CV chased him. LE asked, and Alex never really answered, why he didn’t just stay in room where he had had his gun.

    It was obvious that no aid was rendered to CV once down.

    Alex did not live there either, and I think his version of the story was that Lori and children had left the house by the time of the shooting. (I have to double check it. The stories conflicted; I may have mixed up who said what when.)

    Then, bringing the trio to the station, no body was upset which LE also noted.

    There are a number of other reasons not to believe self-defense, but I am trying to recall the reasons obvious to LE on the scene/before the decision to release them, especially Alex, instead of taking anyone into custody.

    It might be about the culture of AZ, and that it was not Charles’ residence*. It might be because Mow and/or the bishop pulled some strings, IMO.

    (*It was his bill, however, and for all I know he was on the lease.)

    Later, AZ seemed to be onto him- or seems to have decided this crime spree was too serious to do a solid for the nice family- depending on whether there was influence or not. That became apparent when the body cams from the day Alex died came out. It does seem pretty obvious that EMT’s and hospital staff did everything they could to keep him alive while he was dying. I know saving lives is what they do, and he was young- but it seemed like they were working on their own family member with their efforts.

    “Luckily” -I don’t wish death on anyone, but I’m over it in this case- they still apparently got a lot of evidence from his home even though he died. At least, that is what I gather from the Daybell prelim hearings.

    I lean towards believing that Alex died a natural death, but I could be persuaded rather easily with a new argument or new evidence. If it was murder or mission-related suicide, someone is regretting letting him die in his own home. What a trove that was for LE. If Alex took one for the team, he should have jumped into those falls in the middle of the night after giving Zulema reason not to report him missing for a day or so. After burning the burner phones.
     
    Last edited: Sep 7, 2021
  8. Satchie

    Satchie Well-Known Member

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    I agree. But the police case would be even stronger if they could tie in the motive, which from their point of view at that stage, was probably the life insurance.

    I wonder how much AC was aware of the investigation by Chandler police and that his brother, in particular, was feeding them info against him.

    It seems the family was awhirl with members telling each other what other members were saying/doing.

    And then on Oct 2, Brandon B went to Gilbert police accusing AC of shooting at him, tying it to how AC'd killed CV. If he hadn't been talking to Chandler police, I bet he was after that.
     
  9. Satchie

    Satchie Well-Known Member

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    Just occurred to me, perhaps some of that info came from the analysis of AC's phone, which was sent to the FBI after his death. Little Chandler PD might not otherwise have had the resources to get that evidence.
     
  10. Bluedaisy100

    Bluedaisy100 Well-Known Member

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    Did ZP receive any life insurance proceeds after Alex's death.? Seems to be something of a pattern among this bunch.
     
  11. Satchie

    Satchie Well-Known Member

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    It's hard to sort out/remember what was originally known, vs what is now known because of the, likely, thousands of hours of police investigations.

    IIRC, Tylee said in her witness statement that she'd gone outside before the shooting happened, but I'm fairly sure Lori didn't tell Chandler PD she driven the kids to Burger King...I'm pretty sure she claimed to have been there, but I'm not going to look for that now.

    I think the trio were creating unimaginable havoc for everyone they had contact with, I don't want to blame anyone for not understanding how deceptive and destructive they really were. I mean, if we had to live in a world where more people were like them, I'd be in favour of an imminent apocalypse, too.
     
  12. alexwood

    alexwood Well-Known Member

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    Isn't there a status hearing tomorrow? Lori's treating physician should have filed his progress report. Of course, we can't look it up on the court website. Everything is sealed and hush-hush!
     
  13. alexwood

    alexwood Well-Known Member

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    I'd be surprised if Alex had any life insurance. I don't think he was working at the time and any life insurance he had would probably have been through an employer. Maybe I'm wrong about his being unemployed -- but he just had that vibe about him. ZP was the breadwinner? Hence the marriage -- or at least one of the reasons for the marriage?

    ETA: Alex was awaiting future payoffs from other life insurance policies on his "hits"?
     
  14. Gardenkeep

    Gardenkeep Former Member

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    Yes. At least it's on my calendar.
     
    angelainwi, LinasK, Cool Cats and 3 others like this.
  15. Satchie

    Satchie Well-Known Member

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    Just as an offhand comment, most people receive life insurance after their spouse's death, so it's not just a cult thing.

    But I agree with others, Alex had no dependents, and wasn't working. And, would be more suspicious than most people, if his new wife insisted he buy a large policy.
     
  16. Satchie

    Satchie Well-Known Member

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    According to Zulema's police interview, Alex hadn't been working since he'd moved to Idaho. It's on p. 31 in the lengthy download linked in this story:
    Detectives close investigation into Alex Cox's death - Local News 8
     
  17. kshultz06082

    kshultz06082 Super Snooper

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    I'm pretty sure they knew people to buy life insurance from since Charles and Brandon both sold insurance at one point. I doubt they bought Alex's life insurance thru Charles or Brandon recently, but they could have in years previous. They would have only had to change the beneficiary when he married Zulema. Unfortunately, ZP has immunity and is one of the few cult members that has mostly managed to stay out of the television limelight so I doubt we will hear anything from her until the trial(s).
     
  18. SleuthD-o-doubleg

    SleuthD-o-doubleg Well-Known Member

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    Local update: MM was at the women’s detention center today.

    *sorry for late response
     
  19. pizzaman12

    pizzaman12 Well-Known Member

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    You can buy life insurance regardless of your employment status
     
  20. MsJosie

    MsJosie Well-Known Member

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    SleuthD-o-doubleg I would like to thank you very much for all these updates on MM being at the detention center. It’s a piece of the puzzle we all want solved. Thank you!
     
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