Found Deceased ID - Joshua Vallow, 7, & Tylee Ryan, 17, Rexburg, Sept 2019 *mom arrested* #38

[Satchie]

Maybe she was killed at Yellowstone and put in the trunk for the ride home. Hence that's where she was last seen. Perhaps C & L were planning to kill one or both kids and hide them at Yellowstone but then saw how crowded it was and had to change plans.

I thought AC was with LV and the kids at Yellowstone. Can you link to any stories that indicate CD was there?

I think everyone has forgotten about AC, but he may have been the one helped Lori solve her unwanted kids problem, just as he helped her with unwanted ex-husbands.

 

[skoogmagoo]

I cannot in any way fathom that either of them have shame. Not in the least. Jmo

I agree, they have no shame, but I think Chad may be at least embarrassed that he got caught.

 

[des2021]

Personally I can’t wait to see who turns on who first. One of them is gonna flip to try and save their butt. And then we will know who the real ring leader of all of the deaths was. I’m not saying whoever cracks first will tell the truth. But it will tell us who is the weaker one of the two. I just hope the prosecutor doesn’t give them a plea deal any better than life in prison. MOO

 

[KonaHonu]

That might make suspicion but it doesn't make probable cause.

There was a time when I was 16/17 that I seemingly dropped off the face of the earth to anyone in the US for many months. It was all legit. My extended family knew where I was and I was participating in a major, positive, life-changing experience. But I could imagine a situation where neighbors and so forth noticed I was no longer around and started asking questions. Frankly, I don't want to live in a country where nosy neighbors, grandparents, and so forth can just express concern to police and that constitutes probable cause. Probable cause requires actual evidence of both a crime being committed and the target likely being the perpetrator.

Now in my situation my parents would have cooperated but given that I was on another continent, it would have been impossible for me to be "produced" in 5 days or even to make contact.

I'm not anti-police or anti-government. But it should be HARD for the police to get a warrant to intrude on people's lives. This is one of the most fundamental rights Americans have and our Supreme Court has spent much of the last 240+ years reigning in the police and strengthening rights against the police. I think recent events will bring a new sea change but that is another issue. We have terms like "probable cause," "articulable suspicion," "Terry stop," and "Miranda warning" because of past police overreach and abuse.

Even in the last few years we've gone from seeing police openly and routinely grabbing peoples' cameras and smashing them to avoid being filmed to a situation where cops are jailed for assault for that kind of unconstitutional behavior. Police need to meet very clear standards before acting whether it is a search, a stop, or an arrest. And I think it is a very good thing that it is hard to demonstrate probable cause. It should be harder IMO.

Imagine if we lived in a country where police could just show up at your neighbor's house, chat for a bit, possibly leading your neighbor, and get some token statement that your neighbor thought your behavior was odd and they could search. I don't think any of us would like that.

While we might all wish the Idaho police had acted quicker, I think the Idaho police have acted very professionally in this case to diligently establish clear probable cause at every step. I think it is their hard work that has led to high bail when arrests were finally made because they only acted when the probable cause was clear and convincing. This is an extremely complicated case, probably the most complex that any LEO working on it will face in their career. No one would want to see it blown because evidence is thrown out because of bad policing! It may seem simple at times but there is an awful lot going on here and many many jurisdictional and other issues to consider.

If we are patient we will see first degree murder changes again both Lori and Chad, and we will see convictions, but only because everyone did their job professionally without rushing the process.

 

[Michael0808]

I agree, they have no shame, but I think Chad may be at least embarrassed that he got caught.

Maybe. But I don’t think that he thinks he’s caught. Jmo

 

[KonaHonu]

I think Natalie is some kind of special angel. Her instincts as a mother were invaluable and her courage in the face of bizarro world, inspiring. And now this amazing photo. There are unsung heroes in this story. She is one of them in my opinion.

Based on my research, IP definitely traded down!

 

[MoM3tzger]

How is this even possible?
SEARCH WARRANT Questions -

On June 10, 2020, the Prosecutor filed a Motion to Seal in Chad's case (Freemont County/State of Idaho #CR22-20-0705). In the motion, is requests: "the motion to seal the Affidavit for probable cause for and arrest warrant....The State’s requested motion to seal does not include the defendant or defense counsel. The State will provide the affidavit t0 the Defense..."

On June 10, 2020, the Judge signed an Order that states: "IT IS HEREBY ORDERED and this does Order that the affidavit for probable cause...is sealed..."

According to an online records search of Chad's case, Attorney John Prior, is the ONLY attorney listed on his case--which makes him Chad's Defense counsel and therefore, it can be assumed he has been, or will be, provided a copy of the Search Warrant.

And also on June 10, 2020, Mark Means, Lori's attorney of record, filed a Motion for Release to Defense Counsel Re: Search Warrant No.: 2020-68 in Lori's case (Madison County/State of Idaho Case #CR33-20-0302) which states: "...Mark L. Means and moves this Court for an order of release to Defense Counsel the filed documents...regards to the Search Warrant No. 2020-68 issued/signed by the Court on 6/5/2020....Please note that by way of this Motion DEFENDANT does not requests this matter be unsealed but released said records/documents to said Counsel under seal and or order of this Court."

Assuming Lori's Attorney, Mark Means, in his motion is referring to the search warrant in the Daybell case (Freemont County/State of Idaho Case #CR22-20-0755) that was served on the Daybell property that resulted in discovery of he children's remains....

Question 1: Was the search warrant really signed June 5 (five days before the search!)?

Question 2: If so, how would Lori's attorney know what date the SEALED search warrant in Chad's case was signed?

Question 3: While both cases are in the Seventh Judicial District of the State of Idaho and both defendants, Lori and Chad, have pending criminal cases against them by the State of Idaho, why would Lori's attorney file a request to HER court in HER case which is in Madison County to unseal a document that was filed in HIS case which is currently assigned to the Magistrate Court in Fremont County?

Question 4: Does the Judge in Lori's case even have jurisdiction over the Magistrate Court in Fremont county where the warrant Chad's case was ordered to be sealed?

Mercy y'all...MM's work makes my head hurt. I look forward to your replies. Thanks for playing!

Attached are the documents mentioned above for your review (and reading enjoyment):
>State of Idaho vs Chad Daybell - Case #CR22-20-0755
Motion to Seal
>State of Idaho vs Chad Daybell - Case #CR22-20-0755
Order to Seal
>State of Idaho vs Lori Vallow - Case #CR33-20-0302
Motion for Release to Defense Counsel RE: Search Warrant No: 2020-68

 

[KonaHonu]

Personally I can’t wait to see who turns on who first. One of them is gonna flip to try and save their butt. And then we will know who the real ring leader of all of the deaths was. I’m not saying whoever cracks first will tell the truth. But it will tell us who is the weaker one of the two. I just hope the prosecutor doesn’t give them a plea deal any better than life in prison. MOO

I dunno, I want to see them both get life. I think whoever flips will get a ligher sentence. I think there will be enough evidence to convict both of first degree murder. No reason to offer a plea bargain.

 

[KonaHonu]

How is this even possible?
SEARCH WARRANT Questions -

On June 10, 2020, the Prosecutor filed a Motion to Seal in Chad's case (Freemont County/State of Idaho #CR22-20-0705). In the motion, is requests: "the motion to seal the Affidavit for probable cause for and arrest warrant....The State’s requested motion to seal does not include the defendant or defense counsel. The State will provide the affidavit t0 the Defense..."

On June 10, 2020, the Judge signed an Order that states: "IT IS HEREBY ORDERED and this does Order that the affidavit for probable cause...is sealed..."

According to an online records search of Chad's case, Attorney John Prior, is the ONLY attorney listed on his case--which makes him Chad's Defense counsel and therefore, it can be assumed he has been, or will be, provided a copy of the Search Warrant.

And also on June 10, 2020, Mark Means, Lori's attorney of record, filed a Motion for Release to Defense Counsel Re: Search Warrant No.: 2020-68 in Lori's case (Madison County/State of Idaho Case #CR33-20-0302) which states: "...Mark L. Means and moves this Court for an order of release to Defense Counsel the filed documents...regards to the Search Warrant No. 2020-68 issued/signed by the Court on 6/5/2020....Please note that by way of this Motion DEFENDANT does not requests this matter be unsealed but released said records/documents to said Counsel under seal and or order of this Court."

Assuming Lori's Attorney, Mark Means, in his motion is referring to the search warrant in the Daybell case (Freemont County/State of Idaho Case #CR22-20-0755) that was served on the Daybell property that resulted in discovery of he children's remains....

Question 1: Was the search warrant really signed June 5 (five days before the search!)?

Question 2: If so, how would Lori's attorney know what date the SEALED search warrant in Chad's case was signed?

Question 3: While both cases are in the Seventh Judicial District of the State of Idaho and both defendants, Lori and Chad, have pending criminal cases against them by the State of Idaho, why would Lori's attorney file a request to HER court in HER case which is in Madison County to unseal a document that was filed in HIS case which is currently assigned to the Magistrate Court in Fremont County?

Question 4: Does the Judge in Lori's case even have jurisdiction over the Magistrate Court in Fremont county where the warrant Chad's case was ordered to be sealed?

Mercy y'all...MM's work makes my head hurt. I look forward to your replies. Thanks for playing!

Attached are the documents mentioned above for your review (and reading enjoyment):
>State of Idaho vs Chad Daybell - Case #CR22-20-0755
Motion to Seal
>State of Idaho vs Chad Daybell - Case #CR22-20-0755
Order to Seal
>State of Idaho vs Lori Vallow - Case #CR33-20-0302
Motion for Release to Defense Counsel RE: Search Warrant No: 2020-68

Both cases are being heard in Madison County apparently since Eadins is a Madison County judge.

Means wants to see what evidence they have. I wouldn't read too much into what motions he files. It seems likely Lori will be entitled to see that information at some point through discovery but at this point likely not.

 

[des2021]

How is this even possible?
SEARCH WARRANT Questions -

On June 10, 2020, the Prosecutor filed a Motion to Seal in Chad's case (Freemont County/State of Idaho #CR22-20-0705). In the motion, is requests: "the motion to seal the Affidavit for probable cause for and arrest warrant....The State’s requested motion to seal does not include the defendant or defense counsel. The State will provide the affidavit t0 the Defense..."

On June 10, 2020, the Judge signed an Order that states: "IT IS HEREBY ORDERED and this does Order that the affidavit for probable cause...is sealed..."

According to an online records search of Chad's case, Attorney John Prior, is the ONLY attorney listed on his case--which makes him Chad's Defense counsel and therefore, it can be assumed he has been, or will be, provided a copy of the Search Warrant.

And also on June 10, 2020, Mark Means, Lori's attorney of record, filed a Motion for Release to Defense Counsel Re: Search Warrant No.: 2020-68 in Lori's case (Madison County/State of Idaho Case #CR33-20-0302) which states: "...Mark L. Means and moves this Court for an order of release to Defense Counsel the filed documents...regards to the Search Warrant No. 2020-68 issued/signed by the Court on 6/5/2020....Please note that by way of this Motion DEFENDANT does not requests this matter be unsealed but released said records/documents to said Counsel under seal and or order of this Court."

Assuming Lori's Attorney, Mark Means, in his motion is referring to the search warrant in the Daybell case (Freemont County/State of Idaho Case #CR22-20-0755) that was served on the Daybell property that resulted in discovery of he children's remains....

Question 1: Was the search warrant really signed June 5 (five days before the search!)?

Question 2: If so, how would Lori's attorney know what date the SEALED search warrant in Chad's case was signed?

Question 3: While both cases are in the Seventh Judicial District of the State of Idaho and both defendants, Lori and Chad, have pending criminal cases against them by the State of Idaho, why would Lori's attorney file a request to HER court in HER case which is in Madison County to unseal a document that was filed in HIS case which is currently assigned to the Magistrate Court in Fremont County?

Question 4: Does the Judge in Lori's case even have jurisdiction over the Magistrate Court in Fremont county where the warrant Chad's case was ordered to be sealed?

Mercy y'all...MM's work makes my head hurt. I look forward to your replies. Thanks for playing!

Attached are the documents mentioned above for your review (and reading enjoyment):
>State of Idaho vs Chad Daybell - Case #CR22-20-0755
Motion to Seal
>State of Idaho vs Chad Daybell - Case #CR22-20-0755
Order to Seal
>State of Idaho vs Lori Vallow - Case #CR33-20-0302
Motion for Release to Defense Counsel RE: Search Warrant No: 2020-68

I know the answer to 2 of your questions! Whoo Hoo! Lol! Yes the warrant was signed on the 5th. We don’t know why they waited a few days to actually serve the warrant though. And Means would have seen the date the warrant was signed by the court documents. It shows the date it was signed and why the prosecution asked for it to be sealed. But that’s it. Someone did post the warrant here at one point and we saw the exact thing Means saw. I’m sure if you google it might come up since all of the news stations had it at one point. Hope I helped a little bit! MOO

 

[KonaHonu]

Question for an attorney: Given that Lori and Chad are facing charges for teh same underlying situation, can teh judge actually order them not to communicate since an effective defense may relay on them collaborating? Seems unconstitutional.

 

[MoM3tzger]

...This is an extremely complicated case, probably the most complex that any LEO working on it will face in their career....

...If we are patient we will see first degree murder changes again both Lori and Chad, and we will see convictions, but only because everyone did their job professionally without rushing the process

@KonaHonu I appreciate your post and was reminded of this quote:

The wheels of justice turn slowly, but grind exceedingly fine.

Don't they?

Edited to add: Tammys autopsy has not been released.
The idaho attorney general is investigating Chad and Lori for conspiracy, attempted murder and or murder.

Source: Justin Lum of Fox 10 article published June 12,2020

 

[Michael0808]

So ironically enough me and my husband were married in Hawaii by the exact same company who supposedly married Chad and Lori. The wife plans the wedding, the husband performs the ceremony, and the son is the photographer. I don’t know if I can say names here because they are not POI’s. They did an amazing job and are lovely people. But I know for a fact that after we signed all the paperwork at the wedding, they submitted the paperwork to the state for us and we received our marriage certificate in the mail within 2 weeks. And we live in California. So if it’s a real marriage and not just a spiritual one, there has to be proof out there. And I wonder why we haven’t seen one reporter find it. MOO

Because marriage records in Hawaii are sealed and not public record until 75 years from the date the marriage is registered.

 

[MoM3tzger]

...Yes the warrant was signed on the 5th.

Means would have seen the date the warrant was signed by the court documents

@des2021 Thank you for the reply. I'm at a loss for which court document states the date the warrant was signed. I have read every word of every document filed with the court that is public in these cases and I simply don't recall seeing that. I will give it a good google search (ugh...here goes my next hour or so!). Again, thank you.

 

[KonaHonu]

It was never mentioned in MSM for this case before now. Anyone who knew it had to have sleuthed Lori's parents apart from WS posting rules. Now we are finally allowed to mention where they live since it's in MSM.

Actually I read it on here! Possibly before a nonsleuthable post was deleted.

Because marriage records in Hawaii are sealed and not public record until 75 years from the date the marriage is registered.

Hawaii only releases marriage records to certain eligible parties. I posted about this earlier with an authoritative link. Even LE are ineligible. They can't even be subpoenaed per se but they can be obtained by court order. But Idaho courts have no authority in Hawaii so it would likely be a multistep process. I'm fairly certain it will be done but probably only in the dotting i's and crossing t's stage because it is not immediately relevant to the criminal trial.

 

[Astro71]

I think everyone has forgotten about AC, but he may have been the one helped Lori solve her unwanted kids problem, just as he helped her with unwanted ex-husbands.

Yep! Then IMO she got rid of him because she didn’t need him anymore.

 

[MoM3tzger]

...Yes the warrant was signed on the 5th.

Means would have seen the date the warrant was signed by the court documents

@des2021 Thank you for the reply. I'm at a loss for which court document states the date the warrant was signed. I have read every word of every document filed with the court that is public in these cases and I simply don't recall seeing that. I will give it a good google search (ugh...here goes my next hour or so!). Again, thank you.

 

[Michael0808]

Be safe all! Taking my Covid self to bed lol! Thank you for an interesting day of sleuthing, discussion, and engagement in my quarantine. Amazing site. Be safe!

 

[des2021]

Because marriage records in Hawaii are sealed and not public record until 75 years from the date the marriage is registered.

Oh I know. But how many times has a reporter gotten their hands on documents that are not public? It happens all of the time. Where there is a will, there is a way. MOO

 

[skoogmagoo]

I’ve mentioned that in this thread. I’ve wondered if the case influenced him. The timing was mere months apart. Actually, I’d be super curious if I was a site owner here if CD had a profile or an IP address that had visited here.

In ML’s case, AJ lived in a populated neighborhood with Airbnb guests around the time he attempted burning. He later disposed of her body in a canyon. He wasn’t caught because of the burning however. I would bet CD thought he could do it better.

I think CD did whatever Lori told him to do.