Found Deceased IN - Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #157

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girlhasnoname

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We're all entitled to our opinions, but I find it surprising to read over and over again about RA's innocence and rights being violated. I've never seen a murder suspect so defended in all of the cases I've followed here on WS. It's not unheard of to seal the PC/AA, I can name at least 5 off the top of my head.

RA was arrested based on a PC/AA document signed by a Judge following an extensive search of his home. He himself said he would obtain his own legal counsel at his arraignment so he wasn't appointed one by the Court. That's on RA, not the State.

He has since asked for and has been provided with competent legal representation by the State, they've seen the PC and know why he was arrested. The decision not to release the documents to the public at this time is certainly not going to be taken likely, nor should it be. We, the public, do not have the right to know anything beforehand if the Court finds it detrimental to the the proceedings.

I'm going to have faith in this arrest and subsequent prosecution because Abby and Libby deserve justice, THEY are the victims here. I think we'll all be appalled when the facts of this case are known, and I'm glad I won't have wasted one second defending the monster(s) accused of their murders.

MOO
 

NoSpoonFeeding

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We're all entitled to our opinions, but I find it surprising to read over and over again about RA's innocence and rights being violated. I've never seen a murder suspect so defended in all of the cases I've followed here on WS.
I'm not one that has expressed concern about the proceeding thus far, but I certainly haven't interpreted the concern of RA's rights being protected as anyone defending a murder suspect. The concept of presumed innocence is not the same as claiming someone is innocent. In all fairness, the concern is also that the process not be derailed and end up with a favorable ruling for the accused.
 

ss90

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About Allen not lawyering up sooner (remember, at first they were looking for other than public options) I'm not that surprised, that is especially if he's innocent. Not all people react the same way, for some it can also take time to comprehend what's happening, quilty or not.

I, myself, have first hand experience. About a year ago I was wrongfully arrested for stabbing someone (attempted killing). I was in pure shock, pretty much emotionless and almost thinking if I was dreaming. It was the police who had to convince me that I actually really need representation, since I was pretty much thinking it was a mistake and soon they will realize it, waiting things to play out. After two days I was actually ready tell them about anything, even say I did it, if they'd just let me go.

So for this I have a little sympathy and at least try to wait for evidence before jumping into conclusions. I'm not saying RA is innocent (and I dont even believe so), but so far we just dont know.
 
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The Observer

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Exactly, does he mean the case is just too media saturated?
MOO no one threatened him.
Whether people believe he was being 'dramatic' or not, people on numerous social media platforms were in fact posting pics of his family and doxxing him. Certain people take their thirst for information, clicks and views too far.
 

FromGermany1

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In this video Carter discusses the 2 sketches. “Isn’t that amazing. He looks a lot like one and a little bit like the other depending on the eye of the beholder, right?" At this point the sketch of YBG is overlaid that of OBG. It’s interesting to see that facially they’re not as different as you may think.

bbm
My opinion also re the similarity, one doesn't expect.
The overlaying though (which I saw once) didn't look like RA at all, I think. Because of that, I am very curious of the future development. Is there someone in the play, who is looking more like the sketch/es than RA? Who of them all may be the real killer? And as always: WHY did it happen??
 
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asyousay

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bbm
My opinion also re the similarity, one doesn't expect.
The overlaying though (which I saw once) didn't look like RA at all, I think. Because of that, I am very curious of the future development. Is there someone in the play, who is looking more like the sketch/es than RA? Who of them all may be the real killer? And as always: WHY did it happen??


That’s the issue through loads think it does look like him. Then you have loads who say it doesn’t. The sketches I can see him in both and I see his build in bridge guy.


I believe they have their guy and it was him alone. I don’t believe it will be completed when you get down to it either.

MOO
 

mrjitty

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I am honestly amazed people think KAK is part of this. I would have thought after nobody ever suspecting RA that putting 2+2 and coming up with 5 won’t work here. MOO


He has not been charged in this case and he has been in jail for years at this stage. Only one man has been charged with two counts murder here and his own Lawyer has come out and said “they haven’t seen mentions of anybody else in the sealed documents”.

Reisch has some good points from time to time but I also feel he is prone to hype things up for the ratings

if this connection exists - surely that will be apparent in the AA
 

Laughing

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In this video Carter discusses the 2 sketches. “Isn’t that amazing. He looks a lot like one and a little bit like the other depending on the eye of the beholder, right?" At this point the sketch of YBG is overlaid that of OBG. It’s interesting to see that facially they’re not as different as you may think.


IIRC, a poster here made a similar overlay of the sketches, several years ago?
 

Ontario Mom

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In order to get a search warrant, LE have to convince a judge or neutral and detached magistrate that they have probable cause to believe evidence of a crime may be found there or that criminal activity is occurring at the place to be searched.
This information is provided to the judge in affidavit form and the property owner will only see what is to be searched when he is shown the warrant.

LE can only search the places, e.g. house, backyard and property etc. listed in the warrant, but that doesn't mean they can only seize those items. If, in the course of their search, they come across evidence of a crime that is not listed in the warrant, they can often seize it.
My point was addressing RA's possible act of surprise as to why they might be searching his home.

If he is in fact the murderer of those girls, he didn't even need to read the search warrant to know exactly why they were there. He's probably been waiting for that very knock on the door for the last 5+ years.

And once his wife read it, assuming she did, there's no way he could have blown that off as to "I have no idea why they're here". She would have also known exactly why they were there, since they all read basically the same, and are usually pretty detailed on the crime(s) being investigated and why LE believes evidence of the crime may be at the location.

jmo
 

Ontario Mom

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To keep sealed or to unseal, THAT is the question! :)

I keep flip flopping on this one. I think it’s important that there is transparency and that the public has a right to know how strong the evidence is. However, minors and witnesses need to be protected so….redact, heavily if needed.

RA’s lawyer commented on the statement by the prosecutor that they believe “others” may be involved. He responded that is news to him. From that I think we can conclude that the AA does not speak to these “others” that may be involved since his lawyer no doubt had a copy of the AA before the hearing. How then would releasing the AA compromise their independent investigation of the “others” if they are not mentioned in RA’s AA? Surely LE have not arrested RA on flimsy evidence merely hoping to prove others were also involved and that they (RA and the others) will implicate each other in this heinous crime? I keep reminding myself that a Judge signed off on the arrest. Then I remind myself that he “exited, stage left!”

Once again, I find myself having a hard time articulating what is going through my head at the moment.

To keep sealed or to unseal. I can’t make up my mind :rolleyes:!

MOO MOO
I go back and forth as well. While I agree transparency is critical (especially after all this time) it's not nearly as important as protecting the integrity of this investigation (also, especially after all this time, and all the work that's gone into it after 5+ years).

So, if the PCA can't be redacted enough to serve both transparency and the public interest, as well as protect the investigation, then I have to side with keeping it sealed. Either way, the public will see it eventually.
 

Ontario Mom

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Whether people believe he was being 'dramatic' or not, people on numerous social media platforms were in fact posting pics of his family and doxxing him. Certain people take their thirst for information, clicks and views too far.
Unfortunately I've seen some of the trash those "content creators" post and I don't blame the judge one little bit for recusing himself. He put the safety of his family first, and I'd have done the exact same thing.
 

Dutch77

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That’s the issue through loads think it does look like him. Then you have loads who say it doesn’t. The sketches I can see him in both and I see his build in bridge guy.


I believe they have their guy and it was him alone. I don’t believe it will be completed when you get down to it either.

MOO

RA and both stretches look very “average” so people can see the similarities or differences. If there was a very distinct feature like a Rey large nose or distinct jawline, it would be clearer.
 

helpfulcharlie

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Unfortunately I've seen some of the trash those "content creators" post and I don't blame the judge one little bit for recusing himself. He put the safety of his family first, and I'd have done the exact same thing.

There's that, and there's also the possibility that judge #1 has other reasons for recusing. Possible examples include: stress level/medical conditions, family plans or situation, career change plans, or maybe something in his private life that he would prefer not be uncovered by the sudden hyperfocused scrutiny. Not casting stones, just noting that there are all sorts of reasons that could have caused that decision to be made. It also might be that judge #1 felt enormously unqualified for such a high-stakes case and stepped aside for someone more experienced to take over.
 

GoBuckeyes

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MOO she was provided a redacted PC to see what the DA proposed, presumably she already has the interacted PC.
I might be wrong, but I read it that the DA's proposal is to keep it sealed and that this judge has only the redacted PCA from which to make her ruling??
 

Trebor5591

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<snip>We, the public, do not have the right to know anything beforehand if the Court finds it detrimental to the the proceedings. <snip>
In my opinion, concentration on the public's "right to know" is looking at things from the wrong angle. Court proceedings in the USA are deigned to be public more as a mechanism to keep judges, prosecutors and LE honest than to satisfy the public's "right to know". Without having court proceedings and police arrest justifications public, we are heading in the direction of having show trials as are common in nations like Russia and Iran. Every instance where public records are "sealed" is a worrisome step in the wrong direction. My opinion only.
 

GoBuckeyes

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GoBuckeyes

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In my opinion, concentration on the public's "right to know" is looking at things from the wrong angle. Court proceedings in the USA are deigned to be public more as a mechanism to keep judges, prosecutors and LE honest than to satisfy the public's "right to know". Without having court proceedings and police arrest justifications public, we are heading in the direction of having show trials as are common in nations like Russia and Iran. Every instance where public records are "sealed" is a worrisome step in the wrong direction. My opinion only.
I agree with you!! Transparency is supposed to be there, must be there, to ensure accountability.

Personally, I'd put China at or near the top of the list of the show trial countries, and, yes, not the direction we want to head, not at all!!
 
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