IN - Abby & Libby - The Delphi Murders - Richard Allen Arrested - #167

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All this Odinist stuff is clearly garbage.

Odinists tend to be Volkisch - an Odinist wouldn't sacrifice two young girls of the (white) folk who could have plenty of healthy bouncing Aryan children.

Besides which, there's no religious reason to sacrifice another person. It's not a sacrifice unless *you* give something up - it's merely an offering to your god(s). Historically the Vikings (who Odinists emulate) would slaughter livestock in their rituals. The animal blood would be used to consecrate the space and the meat would be eaten by the celebrants.

It's either a meth riddled fantasy, desperate play, or mental illness. It's like saying Jonestown was a Christian massacre. Jonestown clearly had nothing to do with Christianity, and in the same way, this doesn't have anything to do with Odinism. I'd bet my last dollar.

Rant over, I'll return to my usual easy going self shortly.
 
Unfortunately the car description was never set in stone. LE had everything from a smart car, to an older model care, etc. Maybe RA parked in back of the store at CVS too?

McDonalds is across the street from CVS, I'd say LE never ventured past there after getting their lunches, hah.

JMO
Well, they had a car described by a witness that they claim fit the description of the one they saw on camera; I think that one would have been a good one to start looking for. I wonder how many dark colored cars there are in Delphi?

The Google map seems to show all parking areas of the CVS building are clearly visible. The McDonalds drive through, where you stop to order, looks like it is in line with the parking lot. I don't see how they could have not seen his car.
 
Let flip the script and ask why on earth RA didn't continue to come to LE and set the record straight-about where he was and what he saw. Why did he not leave the trails the way he came? Why did he change his appearance shortly after the murders? What did he tell his wife? Why didn't he, as a member of the community and a father of a daughter work harder to clarify misinformation if he wasn't benefiting from it? If he recognized his likeness in the video and photo that was circulated, why did he not officially object to the misinformation?

I also found it interesting that the Press Release by defense stated that he walked the trails often. I wonder if this was a known fact to his family and friends, if cameras can confirm. I wonder if anyone else ever saw him on the trails on other days and if he was wearing similar clothing. I wonder if his car was recorded entering and leaving at certain times of the week or day.
 
One victim was being catfished by a guy who did some pretty suspicious things before, during, and after the murders. According to MS's source, he looked up a gas station in Delphi on 2/13, but the footage was lost.

The other victim was dating the son of an Odinist, who posted creepy stuff online, while one of his buddies confessed to spitting on the girls.

The man who owns the property where the bodies were found lied about his alibi.

The man accused of the murders went to LE but his statement was misfiled and his recorded interview, if it exists, is lost.

I feel sorry for the investigators...
 
Murder Sheet has a podcast interview with Fig Solves. In it, A states that she still backs her source that the river search was KAK/Delphi related. Her brief discussion begins at/around the 34 mm.

 

The idea of a clerical error as the root cause of RA not being investigated earlier is so atrocious.

I think we have all heard story after story about clerical errors in prison, for instance, which sometimes mistakenly allow a prisoner to go free too early. Sometimes instead, clerical errors by prison staff keep people incarcerated after they have served their time.

The link above is about clerical errors in the court system.

Obviously the transposition of RA’s name and address was a foundational error in this case.

I cannot understand why this would still be happening in the 21st century.

I agree that the CO could’ve been overwhelmed by many tips and human error led to what has happened, but in today’s world there has to be a better way.


JMO

OT, but I'm pulling for this Anthony Short fella from the linked article.

Back OT, I'm finding this case exhausting as a pure onlooker with no stake except at-a-distance emotional and cognitive investment. I cannot imagine how the families are finding their way through this.
 
I wonder what prompted him to confess to his wife. Did she call him out on a lie he had previously told her about 2/13/17?
Oh, that's the $64K question isn't it? Thank goodness it was on a recorded jailhouse phone line and even the Defense acknowledged that RA did that during the last hearing when all %^$# broke loose after the State's Discovery dump. I think that may have been what prompted RA to confess 5 times to his wife and mother.

Bail talk was sacked, RA started eating paper and drooling on himself. We now know, unfortunately, the grisly details of the crime scene due to the trick play by the Defense. That had to have been a very bad day for RA, he must have been terrified that those details were going to become public knowledge inside the jail and to his family and general public.

I think the Defense used their time from April until this Frank Motion Memo to craft the most outlandish and controversial theory to take the public's eye off of RA. It might have succeeded the first few days, but I believe calmer heads are now prevailing that this is nothing but a smoke and mirrors reach by the Defense.

ALL MOO
 
Latest Murdersheet covers the publicity and gag orders quite well from a public interest perspective but I think they kind of skipped over the legal issue here which the prosecution filing gets at.

I kind of agree the gag order may be a counter productive approach, though there is no real need IMO for the parties to be briefing media on the case outside of their filings

I think the real issue is obvious misconduct by the defence in putting a whole lot of wild speculation and conspiracies into a document which is supposedly about a Frank's hearing with the obvious intention of publicising those conspiracies outside of the court room to influence jurors.

Especially it now seems to be the standard practice by defence lawyers to allege misfeasance by the states attorneys based on no evidence. Especially in cases where there is significant evidence exists against the defendant to justify the charges this seems wild to me.

IMO Judges need to be more prepared to sanction defence teams who engage in this behaviour because it lessens trust in a key public institution
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For instance, would any of the Odinist prison guard stuff even be admissible at trial? Probably not. Would the claim about Abby being hung in a tree be admissible? No IMO.

These are examples of blatant conspiracies being included in legal filings.

Generally agree -- Morphew case being an outstanding example -- but I wonder to what extent the levels of mystery and secrecy surrounding a case, and resultant public frustration, actually bolster the ability of some defence attorneys to make hay with such accusations with the lessening of trust in institutions being absolutely part of the goal -- and of course as a key plank of political process in many places. Once mistrust of DA's offices is well and widely-seeded, the job of an aggressive defence attorney is a whole lot easier.

Then, the prospective juror who has spent years wondering what the state "is hiding" by maneuvering to keep all possible documents and transactions under seal for as long as possible may have legitimate reasons to then buy into a theory that seems to address those questions. At last, an answer that seems to explain the secrecy, however much it stretches credulity. If local LE are rife with "Odinite" death cult conspiracists, then poor ol' Rick being framed by "Odinite" death cult conspiracists is easier to believe, or even part-believe.

IMO, transparency is a defence against conspiracy. Doesn't always work, but it helps. And in this case we had the highly-dramatic and often baffling pressers, various high-profile leaks that sparked intense discussion and, with the arrest of RA, the possibility (probability?) that LE may have dropped the ball on key info pointing towards the perp, extending the families' agony and compromising the collection and preservation of key evidence for trial.

So while I agree with you regarding these unsavoury and unethical D practices, I suspect that LE and DA have helped do the defence's work for them here, by making wild claims more plausible and harder to refute, pretrial at least.

I expect that we'll see enough evidence to handily convict RA in trial -- but then I thought that with Suzanne Morphew also (and still do).
 
Oh, that's the $64K question isn't it? Thank goodness it was on a recorded jailhouse phone line and even the Defense acknowledged that RA did that during the last hearing when all %^$# broke loose after the State's Discovery dump. I think that may have been what prompted RA to confess 5 times to his wife and mother.

Bail talk was sacked, RA started eating paper and drooling on himself. We now know, unfortunately, the grisly details of the crime scene due to the trick play by the Defense. That had to have been a very bad day for RA, he must have been terrified that those details were going to become public knowledge inside the jail and to his family and general public.

I think the Defense used their time from April until this Frank Motion Memo to craft the most outlandish and controversial theory to take the public's eye off of RA. It might have succeeded the first few days, but I believe calmer heads are now prevailing that this is nothing but a smoke and mirrors reach by the Defense.

ALL MOO

Possibly the confessions arose in response to something that had been long bugging her, something that maybe he’d already passed off as entirely insignificant if she’d mentioned it earlier but the issue was still niggling at her as it potentially linked him to the crime or else meant nothing at all.

So finally he admitted his prior explanation was a lie - hypothetically a verbal confrontation not unlike that with a cheating spouse. That type of confession is significant because it could link circumstances, his behaviour or actions with his guilt. That’s a different scenario from a confession which discloses inside details only the murderer would know, but could still be equally damaging in front of a jury.

All just my imaginary thoughts..
 
Possibly the confessions arose in response to something that had been long bugging her, something that maybe he’d already passed off as entirely insignificant if she’d mentioned it earlier but the issue was still niggling at her as it potentially linked him to the crime or else meant nothing at all.

So finally he admitted his prior explanation was a lie - hypothetically a verbal confrontation not unlike that with a cheating spouse. That type of confession is significant because it could link circumstances, his behaviour or actions with his guilt. That’s a different scenario from a confession which discloses inside details only the murderer would know, but could still be equally damaging in front of a jury.

All just my imaginary thoughts..
Very well could be Misty.

I've often wondered if a family member didn't tip RA in after all.

MOO
 
To be fair, RA did not fit ANY of the descriptions proffered by LE nor, IMO, does he look like BG. (However, BG totally looks like pretty much everyone and no one all at once).

The BG frames were available to the public at large (which includes Carroll County and Delphi) and in six years NOBODY from the community recognized RA as BG or as either sketch? Not one single person in a not-very-populous community saw that BG “video” and said “Holy Crap, it’s Rick!”?

Not once? In six YEARS?

Granted, I don’t know what the prosecution has or knows, but if RA really did this, I hope so hard that the DA can prove it. I am not confident, though.
FWIW, I am not from Delphi, but when this first happened, I looked through some old Delphi area papers online and I was surprised just how many people looked "kinda sorta" like the BG video. I also looked up some demographics and a lot of Delphi is Irish/German/ etc. with a lot of people with light or reddish brown hair. So not surprised that no one immediately thought it was this person.
 
All this Odinist stuff is clearly garbage.

Odinists tend to be Volkisch - an Odinist wouldn't sacrifice two young girls of the (white) folk who could have plenty of healthy bouncing Aryan children.

Besides which, there's no religious reason to sacrifice another person. It's not a sacrifice unless *you* give something up - it's merely an offering to your god(s). Historically the Vikings (who Odinists emulate) would slaughter livestock in their rituals. The animal blood would be used to consecrate the space and the meat would be eaten by the celebrants.

It's either a meth riddled fantasy, desperate play, or mental illness. It's like saying Jonestown was a Christian massacre. Jonestown clearly had nothing to do with Christianity, and in the same way, this doesn't have anything to do with Odinism. I'd bet my last dollar.

Rant over, I'll return to my usual easy going self shortly.

So well said.

I'm not sure there were any attempts to stage these murders as some kind of ritual. And the perpetrator, in this case, doesn't seem to line up with any major mental health diagnosis (so far). He reminds me more of the garden variety pedophiles I studied (who were in fact at a state prison mental hospital - having pleaded guilty to their crimes by reason of insanity). There were two different wards for sex offenders (the pedophiles and the other group, which was most serial rapists/attackers of women 18 and older).

I can't say exactly why I think that, it's entirely intuition/speculation. This is a crime I will never, ever understand. I have some conjecture on what went on in RA's head that day, but whatever it was, it was not religious in any sense.

IMO.
 
Well, Libby and Abby knew who killed them, but they aren’t here to tell us.

Libby gave us his photo and his voice, and it’s a dead ringer for RA.

jmo

True. However, I do wonder if they actually knew his identity. If most people in Delphi knew each other, they'd have recognized him - perhaps not by name, but as a neighbor and a community member. That makes me even more sad, if possible.
 
This is why I believe he didn't tell anyone.

For instance if he was always in the bar discussing the case and how he was on the bridge that day right around that time and he looks a bit like Bridge Guy - surely that story gets told and retold?

If he didn't then how do we know that he wasn't reported on by someone who merely wanted part, or the whole, fund? Maybe even the real murder, who had access to some of the girls' stuff, placed it among his things? A prize fund that large is questionable - there might be false accusations.
 
All this Odinist stuff is clearly garbage.

Odinists tend to be Volkisch - an Odinist wouldn't sacrifice two young girls of the (white) folk who could have plenty of healthy bouncing Aryan children.

Besides which, there's no religious reason to sacrifice another person. It's not a sacrifice unless *you* give something up - it's merely an offering to your god(s). Historically the Vikings (who Odinists emulate) would slaughter livestock in their rituals. The animal blood would be used to consecrate the space and the meat would be eaten by the celebrants.

It's either a meth riddled fantasy, desperate play, or mental illness. It's like saying Jonestown was a Christian massacre. Jonestown clearly had nothing to do with Christianity, and in the same way, this doesn't have anything to do with Odinism. I'd bet my last dollar.

Rant over, I'll return to my usual easy going self shortly.

We don't know anything about the situation. Ritual sacrifices I don't believe either but it might be so that a real, very obvious, motive, existed. It is impossible to sort out amidst all barrage of news, what is a rumor, and what, truth. So, ritual sacrifices I don't believe, but what if girls were making photos of some rituals and made these guys angry? You mentioned meth. It seems to be a strong component for everything.

In short, I don't specifically believe it was some group because I believe it was personal. But since the whole case did not become clear after six years of investigation, and mostly! - a young man with curly hair and a Teutonic chin, whose sketch DC unveiled at 2019 conference, has nothing to do with RA, nothing makes sense.
 
Possibly the confessions arose in response to something that had been long bugging her, something that maybe he’d already passed off as entirely insignificant if she’d mentioned it earlier but the issue was still niggling at her as it potentially linked him to the crime or else meant nothing at all.

So finally he admitted his prior explanation was a lie - hypothetically a verbal confrontation not unlike that with a cheating spouse. That type of confession is significant because it could link circumstances, his behaviour or actions with his guilt. That’s a different scenario from a confession which discloses inside details only the murderer would know, but could still be equally damaging in front of a jury.

All just my imaginary thoughts..
At the last hearing, his wife was crying and calling him "her person." From the outside, it appears that she is standing by him, so I'm not convinced she would say or do anything over a known recorded phone call to jeopardize his case. Jmo.
 
If he didn't then how do we know that he wasn't reported on by someone who merely wanted part, or the whole, fund? Maybe even the real murder, who had access to some of the girls' stuff, placed it among his things? A prize fund that large is questionable - there might be false accusations.

If someone was going to set someone up in order to collect a reward I think it’s unlikely they’d let so many years pass by. Plus there’s not even the slightest hint of tipster involvement in the SW or arrest PCs.
 
At the last hearing, his wife was crying and calling him "her person." From the outside, it appears that she is standing by him, so I'm not convinced she would say or do anything over a known recorded phone call to jeopardize his case. Jmo.

That he allegedly confessed five times(?) before she hung up leads me to think it was quite an intense conversation. She could’ve hung up after the first time.

I read that about the “her person”. I‘d wondered if the reporter misheard?

“ACCUSED Delphi murderer Richard Allen offered his wife no acknowledgment as he appeared in court after reportedly making a series of confessions about the 2017 killings, two podcasters say.

Allen's wife, Kathy Allen, reportedly burst into tears at the sight of him as he was led into the courtroom….”
 
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