IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #103

Discussion in 'Located Persons Discussion' started by Tricia, Apr 22, 2019.

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  1. mtnlites

    mtnlites President of the Imaginary Friends' Club

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    Hunt continues for missing western Wis. girl after parents found dead

    And at that time LE had no idea who took JC or if she were dead or alive.
     
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  2. Charlot123

    Charlot123 Well-Known Member

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    100% agree. But - I think the LE probably has some DNA. (That is workable only to a degree, could have been placed there is intentionally, fell from a wig, or who knows what.)

    I wonder if people are not coming forward because they were doing/selling drugs under that bridge, and don’t trust the police? Or, the couple under the bridge. They might be afraid that coming forward would ruin two marriages, for example...

    So, the LE has to promise not to prosecute people helping the case, but uninvolved in murders, even if these people themselves were nearby that day because of involvement in not-so-good activity.
     
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  3. Charlot123

    Charlot123 Well-Known Member

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    Ok I would not do it necessarily for crime. But DNA.land that deals with breast cancer...I gave them our DNAs. What if donating our genetic codes means, better drugs for us and our kids?
     
  4. cluciano63

    cluciano63 Well-Known Member

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    Jmo the couple under the bridge is a rumor, I think.

    To me, DNA and sexual assault stand out as two topics LE has refused to speak clearly about...which in my brain, links them. Could be wrong but this crime fits sexual assault as a motive in every way to me. Jmo
     
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  5. MassGuy

    MassGuy The Monsters Ain’t the Ones Beneath the Bed

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    They aren’t necessarily linked, although I do believe SA to be the motive.

    Law enforcement saying they have DNA, isn’t necessarily an indication that the DNA came from a sexual act.

    Skin under the fingernails is also a source, in the event that one of the girls scratched him.

    He could have also cut himself on a knife.

    So they could say “we have DNA,” and it wouldn’t serve as confirmation of SA.
     
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  6. Cutiekitty

    Cutiekitty Well-Known Member

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    Just googled triangulation and it looks like they have to have 2-3 towers and the area of overlap is the approximate location. Almost all of the articles I looked at said it’s accurate within 3/4 of a square mile. Pretty cool.
     
  7. mtnlites

    mtnlites President of the Imaginary Friends' Club

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    One could've pulled hair out at the root. Saliva could be present, also. There's even a chance that the DNA wasn't on the girls at all, but on something nearby-something that BG dropped or accidentally left behind. That would certainly make things complicated because LE would need to be certain that the DNA belonged to BG and not someone else.
     
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  8. Jethro4WS

    Jethro4WS Well-Known Member

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    Go to this site. In the Address Lookup put in Delphi, Indiana. When the map comes up it will show two towers. Zoom out.
    United States Cell Tower Map - SCADACore

    There are towers in Flora and Americus each about 7 miles or so from the bridge area. That puts 4 towers within range of any phone. With 4 towers obtaining a triangulated position (the phone does this on its own) is not a problem.
     
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  9. bradfordsleuth

    bradfordsleuth Well-Known Member

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    I feel very strongly that one key to help blowing this case open is the witness who contributed to sketch #2.

    I am wondering if they have done a cognitive interview to get him/her to try to recall as much as possible about what he/she saw that day.

    Now, of course not being privy to any inside details about the circumstances of their interaction (if any) I don't know if a cognitive interview would even help in this case.

    If the witness saw something that they felt needed to be reported at the time, then has this person been brought back in to further discuss the tip that he/she provided just a few days after the murders?

    Is he/she still even alive?

    I have so many questions!

    They seem so sure that 1 tip will be the key to arresting this guy and that tip seems to point to finding the driver of the car.

    They must have pulled camera/video footage in the days before the murders to see who parked there occasionally leading up to the 13th!

    I am not savvy with google earth (I have never used it!) but I am going to attempt to check from Jan 1, 2017 until Feb 13th to see if I can view cars parked there. He would have scouted out the area when the foilage was in a similar state...so unless he tried planning this crime in early 2016...that is my starting point.

    If my hunch I posted back earlier in this thread is right, then this guy did several 'practice runs' to scout his crime site before he committed the crimes on Feb 13, 2017 and has parked there before.

    Sorry...I am long-winded once again.

    I just want to help by throwing out ideas....

    JMO
     
  10. MistyWaters

    MistyWaters Well-Known Member

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    Sorry, I’m missing your point. What purpose would it serve to establish a cellphone user was in Delphi if he also lived and worked there?
     
  11. TL4S

    TL4S Well-Known Member

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    This might be a really stupid idea, but is it possible the DNA they claimed to have ended up not being human DNA? Wouldn't a coyote or deer sniffing one of the bodies leave DNA? Or what if BG had a dog? Dog or cat DNA could be matched to a perp's pet, right?
     
    Last edited: May 18, 2019
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  12. MDATCA

    MDATCA Well-Known Member

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    It would not have made a difference in the outcome except for the possible risk of an injury to a searcher.
     
  13. MCDRAW

    MCDRAW Well-Known Member

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    This was a very safe area. And we have been told for years, take a buddy. We are now seeing, no one is safe. It is so easy to question L.E. and how they do their jobs. I agree with your hindsight is 20/20.
     
  14. EarthtoMel

    EarthtoMel Active Member

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    I don't know if this was available 2 years ago, but I have a tracking device in my car that tracks my speed, location, how fast I brake and accelerate, etc for car insurance. The better I drive, the better rates I get on my insurance. I wonder if they could check with insurance companies....but I guess that would involve a LOT of legal issues.
     
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  15. Cutiekitty

    Cutiekitty Well-Known Member

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    If he lives or works there it could show where he was in Delphi that day. I don’t think it’s going to be the info that cracks the case, but the presence or absence of cellular data could help it. What if a spouse or parent was trying to get ahold of him, but his phone was turned off (hope not) during the crime and that is unusual? If he works there maybe didn’t show up and his phone was hitting towers in Delphi? I feel like LE uncovered an issue with a previous alibi and maybe the phone stuff supports that somehow.
     
  16. TL4S

    TL4S Well-Known Member

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    IMO, phone data could be helpful for the case, but more likely data collected after BG's apprehension, rather than before. JMO
     
  17. MistyWaters

    MistyWaters Well-Known Member

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    If LE was able to trace a cellphone to the trail, they’d also have enough information to also know who was the service provider. They’d be able to obtain a name and address and a treasure trove of historical information including other calls to friends, relatives, employer etc.

    Had they been able to successfully do so, I don’t think they still be holding PCs asking for that “one tip”, starting in a new direction more than two years later.
     
  18. Jethro4WS

    Jethro4WS Well-Known Member

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    I happen to think that BG has killed before. So, the clues to who BG is lie in prior kills going back in time - where it is likely more mistakes were made. The victims, locations, how the victims were killed, and other circumstances of those prior kills will inform more about BG. The big question is if law enforcement can find the unsolved cases BG is responsible for among all the seemingly unrelated unsolved cases out there. Since I believe BG is a serial killer with prior kills I also believe BG has killed at least once since the murders of Abby & Libby.
     
  19. Cutiekitty

    Cutiekitty Well-Known Member

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    I bet they could.

    There are so many ways to track people even if you don’t have a specific person to track. You’ve got phones, vehicle registration, your insurance tracking device, and location data from various sources. The answer is out there somewhere IMO.

    The amount of info LE would have to deal with from all these sources takes time to review and process which is why I think this is taking as long as it is. Tower dump info is going to be a lot if you are looking at a 5 hour period. If they don’t have a tag and just a vehicle description that’s a lot of tracking down cars. If somehow they can get gps info that’s got to be a lot too. Add the 42,000 tips sent in and all of the follow up with those. Plus, they were working other cases before, during and after this case. They’ve got their hands full and even with assistance from other agencies it’s a lot of info to deal with.

    They very well could have a pretty good POI from all of their work, but someone is covering for them. All JMO
     
  20. MistyWaters

    MistyWaters Well-Known Member

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    I agree. Had sketch one travelled from another state that sort of evidence would even be better. The problem is cellphone tracking is no longer a secret and it’s a pretty dumb murderer who hasn’t figured that out aside from drug runners and child porn creeps who require access to technology at all times in order to commit their crimes.

    I’m also not certain that Delphi’s cellphone towers were the same in 2017 as they are today because I recall something about the LE command center had to put up a temporary dish to handle the phone calls coming in. Older cell towers did not have the same capability as they do now in the same way that technology is continually improving.
     
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