Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #117

[tresir2012]

it doesn't say anything about being decapitated

I linked it upthread and so did bradfordsleuth.

 

[tresir2012]

Looking for a murder weapon. This no doubt was why they searched the creek using metal detectors amongst other things.

They took away a lot of items including a vehicle from one of the properties though so I do wonder why that was.

 

[tresir2012]

Also, if you look at the one pic of girl walking on the bridge, you will notice clouds in the sky, contrary to the photo with BG, there are none. Maybe camera angle but to me, it may have been some time between pics. Obviously LE knows what the time sequence of pics are but I just noticed this.

I hadn't noticed that. I'll have to go back and look.

 

[tresir2012]

So rumors & no articles to link? Gotchya! Thanks

The link has been posted several times and states a couple of things but they are repeating what has been said in online sources for a very long time that we cannot quote. The Sun is UK MSM so is an allowed source so we can discuss this now. That's how I see it anyway.

 

[tresir2012]

Can you please provide a link where LE said this because to my knowledge they've released nothing about the crime scene.

It is in the Sun article. I don't know their source. Perhaps Anna told them as her relative was one of the group who found the girls. MOO.

why did they print the OLD sketch???? This article is from Sept 2019, long after the new sketch was published. This is rubbish.

They also show the new sketch. You can see it if you read/scroll down to the bottom of the article.

 

[k-mac]

These are the first two official still images released by LE. It's not the camera angle. It's because NASA zoomed in as much as possible to try and get a better view of him.

View attachment 218230 View attachment 218231

thanks judi for these.
I really value these side by side stills......but these two are kinda doing my head in.

the first one I see a hoodie over his head and he looks older.
the second one he appears to not have hoodie over head and I see a mop of beautiful brown hair and a very youthful looking lad.

urgh!!

moo

 

[Falling Down]

Perfect image of the area of the CS, with the "berm" as I call it, in the background.

Attached is a USGS image from Google earth I screen shot. Where the above image was taken from is below the gravel pit, the pit can be seen in the USGS image from 1992. The CS is to the right and out of frame in the above image.

 

[Ozoner]

However, one of the possibilities is that the BG merely “herded” or “drove” (don’t know what would be the correct hunting term) the girls to the water, while the second person was waiting for them at that clearing, on the other side of the creek.

That could explain why no witness mentions a wet guy leaving the area. Nowhere, ever, did I see anything about people seeing anyone wet walking from the Monon bridge. To me, it indicates he was not.

We have no reason to think that BG returned to the trail after committing to murders. I don't know which route he used to flee, but he probably made a bee line for his car. It's likely that no one saw BG immediately after the crime, period, wet or dry. The witness that provided the NBG sketch may have seen him before the crime.
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By the way, do we know how wide or deep the creek was where BG crossed it? The pictures at the bottom of this page seem to show one location (right next to one of the piers) where the creek could possibly be stepped or leapt over:
https://bridgehunter.com/uploads/comments/04/4648/4648-003.jpg
The picture on this site seems to show a second place where one could cross the creek without stepping into the water:
The Monon High Bridge, Delphi Historic Trails | 17807 | TrailLink.com

 

[tresir2012]

A second person who "forced the girls down the hill" would qualify as a second perp. Playing games with semantics doesn't change the fact that there's no evidence whatsoever for a second participant in the crime. Libby took a video showing a single perp with audio that LE has stated is the same perp shown in the video. LE has made it crystal clear that a single perp is being sought, so a reasonable person can infer that LE did not find evidence of a second perp at the crime scene.
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In asking whether a second perp is possible, you're asking the wrong question. The question you should be asking is, "Is there any evidence of a second perp?" The answer to that question is,"No, there is not."
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You say that "we don't know what evidence LE has," but that isn't completely true. LE has shared enough information with the public for us to know that their current theory of the case does not involve a second perp. (Please don't respond by prattling on about ambiguous language used by LE two-and-a-half years ago, when the investigation was still brand new.)
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The evidence that we do have points clearly to second perp, and it is clear that LE has not found any evidence of a second perp.
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If you want to believe in the "possibility" of a spectral second perp even though there's absolutely no evidence that there was one and even though the evidence that we do have points overwhelmingly to a single perp, go right ahead.

Who do you think LE are appealing to when asking for tips? Why the difference in the sketches/descriptions from different witnesse? Why the change from "not blue eyes" to "eye colour unknown" ? Why the height reduction?

Just interested in why you think these have changed over the 2.5 years when we are still looking at the same still/video from the bridge.

 

[tresir2012]

We have no reason to think that BG returned to the trail after committing to murders. I don't know which route he used to flee, but he probably made a bee line for his car. It's likely that no one saw BG immediately after the crime, period, wet or dry. The witness that provided the NBG sketch may have seen him before the crime.
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By the way, do we know how wide or deep the creek was where BG crossed it? The pictures at the bottom of this page seem to show one location (right next to one of the piers) where the creek could possibly be stepped or leapt over.
https://bridgehunter.com/uploads/comments/04/4648/4648-003.jpg

How do we know he crossed the creek? Or where he crossed if he did? It's all supposition and guesswork without any detail from LE.

The pic you show is near the North end of the bridge which is the opposite end to where the bodies were found. That is why they didn't find the girls quickly because they searched downstream from that point which actually led away from the crime scene.

 

[kalvis]

First post here . I have been lurking since the beginning of the case .

I was visiting my daughter over the holiday and she was text snap chatting her cousins. I did not know this was a feature on Snapchat, as I do not use Snapchat. Apparently it disappears after one reads it the same as sending a snap chat picture disappears.

I have been reading this case on this site daily and have never seen this mentioned. So, I thought I would throw this out there .

I think I just jumped off of someone’s post as a reply . If I did I apologize . I will try to get it right next time

IMO

 

[stattlich1]

Interesting how LE says they are not interested in investigative suggestions.....this would lead me to believe they are confident of being on the right path with the new sketch. What they ARE seeking is tips on how the person in the new sketch is linked to the Delphi area.

Also interesting to note, not only that mysterious car, but they ask for a description of "vehicles" that were in the parking lot.....

Their Multi-Agency Task Force provided the following points of clarification after Monday’s informational news conference:

Indiana State Police releases clarification points on Delphi murder suspect

• A car was parked in the abandoned CPS building parking lot between the hours of noon and 5:00 p.m. on February 13, 2017
  • We are looking for anyone who could give a description of vehicles that were in the parking lot during the time
• The location of the abandoned CPS building was 6931 West 300 North, Delphi, IN
  • The building has since been demolished and the lot is vacant
• The Multi-Agency Task Force is seeking tips and information about how the subject depicted in the sketch is linked to the Delphi area.
  • The Task Force is not asking for investigative suggestions
  • Tips on the suspect sketch are our main interest
• When sending a tip to the abbyandlibbytip@cacoshrf.com email address, please do not leave just a name and number to call
  • Provide specific tip information in your email
  • Please include your name and contact phone number
    • This is for investigators to follow up if they need clarification on your tip
    • Your contact information will remain confidential
  
  

 

[Deleted member 102539]

Speaking of sheds, I recall seeing an aerial shot of the woods in vicinity of crime scene and there was shed kind of out in the middle of the woods (not seeming to be closely connected to any other buildings or houses around there). Anyone else recall this lone building?

I remember an open shed with a bouquet of flowers at a certain place after the murder and I'm 100% certain, there is a meaning to it, even if we don't know yet. MOO

 

[Ozoner]

Who do you think LE are appealing to when asking for tips? Why the difference in the sketches/descriptions from different witnesse? Why the change from "not blue eyes" to "eye colour unknown" ? Why the height reduction?

Just interested in why you think these have changed over the 2.5 years when we are still looking at the same still/video from the bridge.

We don't know how the first sketch was generated.
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It could be a sketch of someone seen interacting with minors in an inappropriate way, possibly on other dates or in other locations around Delphi.
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It may have been an artist's attempt to draw a sketch based on the video (although to believe that you'd have to believe that LE lied when they said that the sketches depicted two different people).
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It may simply be that the old sketch depicts someone seen on the trail who was not connected to the crime but who did not come forward, either because he feared being railroaded or because he was passing through and didn't know that he was being sought.
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LE stated at the April press conference that the man in the OBG sketch is no longer a person of interest.

 

[PezCandy]

They took away a lot of items including a vehicle from one of the properties though so I do wonder why that was.

I didn’t know a vehicle was taken?? I never heard anything about that.
but if it’s not related to the case then the vehicle must have had a title, insurance, registration, stolen etc issue that popped up while LE had a warrant to gather items. Maybe someone else can explain it better than me as I haven’t had my coffee yet lol.

 

[stattlich1]

If you read the transcript of the 4/22 presser, Carter says "During the course of this investigation we have concluded the first sketch released will become secondary"

Also this.....

On Wednesday, police emphasized that a new sketch of a suspect’s face is not supposed to be a different take on a composite sketch of a heavier, older-looking man. They are, according to Indiana State Police Sgt. Kim Riley, not the same person.
Riley also said Wednesday that the original sketch – released in the summer of 2017, showing a man with a goatee and a driving cap – is “not presently a person of interest in this investigation.
Delphi murders: New suspect sketch not same man as in old sketch, ISP clarifies

 

[Charlot123]

If you read the transcript of the 4/22 presser, Carter says "During the course of this investigation we have concluded the first sketch released will become secondary"

Also this.....

On Wednesday, police emphasized that a new sketch of a suspect’s face is not supposed to be a different take on a composite sketch of a heavier, older-looking man. They are, according to Indiana State Police Sgt. Kim Riley, not the same person.
Riley also said Wednesday that the original sketch – released in the summer of 2017, showing a man with a goatee and a driving cap – is “not presently a person of interest in this investigation.
Delphi murders: New suspect sketch not same man as in old sketch, ISP clarifies

Tell me it doesn’t mean that for two years, the ISP has been chasing the wrong guy.

 

[margarita25]

I remember an open shed with a bouquet of flowers at a certain place after the murder and I'm 100% certain, there is a meaning to it, even if we don't know yet. MOO

Ohhhh I forgot about this...flowers and the shed...

Going to google old posts in here to see what reference I can find on that.

 

[stattlich1]

Tell me it doesn’t mean that for two years, the ISP has been chasing the wrong guy.

Well, yes indeed, my opinion is exactly this. They were chasing the wrong guy for 2 years, and now have been seeking New Sketch Guy since at least that 4/22 presser.

I've posted these things because LE specifically has asked for info about

1. New Sketch Guy
2. Car(s) at the abandoned and no longer in existance CPS building

 

[Ozoner]

Tell me it doesn’t mean that for two years, the ISP has been chasing the wrong guy.

It means exactly that.
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Think about this: there were likely people out there who thought that they recognized BG from the video but didn't call in the tip because the person they had in mind looked nothing like the sketch.
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Little did those people know that the sketch that LE had been spreading far and wide for two years was of the wrong person.
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Many of those people have likely since stopped following the case--some of them may have died--and will probably never see the NBG sketch.