Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #118

[Fizzle]

I don't think that they have a full DNA profile of the killer. If they did, I think we'd see more movement in the case... I think they would have found a genetic link via ancestry and I think they'd have a Parabon sketch. Rumor is that they only have touch DNA and I believe it.

That makes me think that the killer did a good job planning and cleaning up. Gloves, hat, etc. etc. There was talk of a scarf from some of the potential witnesses so maybe he covered his face as well... who knows. My guess is that he had a weapon (knife or gun), but I think the bulk we are seeing in the jacket is probably some supplies for keeping them quiet (gags of some sort) and then for cleaning up the scene. The "clean" scene from a DNA standpoint makes me think either SK or someone who did a lot of research and prep work. Hard to believe that he could have gotten so lucky.

I can look at his attire and think that 1) he was a guy from the area, or 2) he was trying to look like "everyman" from the area. Hard to say which. But based on all of the photos I've been through, this "look" is/was quite common in and around Delphi. Seems like the local uniform is baggy jeans, hiking boots, and layers of caps, hoodies, jackets, etc. Also not uncommon for men around there to carry things at their sides, like pocket knives, phones, etc. When I first saw the pic of BG, I thought he was older because of the style of dress, but I've come to realize that there are many teens in Delphi that dress that same way.

 

[tresir2012]

MOO I have thought they should have a voluntary one use DNA drive downtown.

I think they should ask all mums to volunteer DNA. When I suggested it before there were a lot on here who were against it but if it catches a killer and protects more kids why would anyone be against it?

 

[tresir2012]

MOO I have thought they should have a voluntary one use DNA drive downtown.

I think they should ask all mums to volunteer DNA. When I suggested it before there were a lot on here who were against it but if it catches a killer and protects more kids why would anyone be against it?

Not sure about Delphi connection, but he didn't live far away at all and I'd bet he was familiar with the trails. He definitely used SM and I am sure that some of his posts drew the attention of LE.

10 miles to Buck Creek only. He loved the woods. I wish they would give an update.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

You folks keep forgetting that both cases are being handled by the Indiana State Police.

What does that mean?

 

[Deleted member 102539]

That makes me think that the killer did a good job planning and cleaning up.

I think, he very much likes to read something like that on here or elsewhere and is very proud of delivering the perfect crime, IMO. It is his goal and he reached it (again??) problem-free as far as we know today. I believe, he was prepared and planned a lot, which doesn't mean, he took much time for it. I believe, he is as fast as possible re the act of murder and so are his pre plannings: unbelievable f-a-a-a-s-t and exact, to the point. MOO

 

[sunsetbeach]

I’m pretty sure I read (recently) a news article or it could have been a news video that said evidence was collected from the bridge. Ima see if I can find that.

Replying to my own post.

So far I haven’t been able to locate it but I know I read something about it. I’m pretty sure it was from the people who do the Crime Watch Daily show. It was something about LE coming back to the “bridge” to collect evidence. Could they have meant the general area? I’m not positive without finding that article but my memory tells me it was on the bridge. I’ll keep looking and will post it if I find it.

 

[stattlich1]

You folks keep forgetting that both cases are being handled by the Indiana State Police.

Not certain to what you refer.

However, and it's MOO.....

As I've stated before, I would not point a finger at any one individual, for to do so would be folly.

It appears to me to be a LOT of illegal activity, of all sorts, occurring in the region.

I think that what we have in the case of A & L is either a serial killer, or one who may very well become a serial killer, OR, a murderer who had something to hide, someone in the local area who stood to lose his status, fame and/or fortune as a result of one or both of the girls becoming aware of some illegal activity in which he was engaged, to include involvement in child sexual activity of some sort or participation in what appears to be a rather active local drug trade OR a flat out meth head or drug addict under the influence that acted in a blackout rage that day.

I do sense the possibility though, that the killer in this case works in, or is involved in, the public sector and/or holds a position of leadership or status among his peers. Possibly the courts, LE, fire and rescue, local school, scouting, or a man of the cloth.

This murderer is either 1. a lucky dog, 2. a crafty, well studied killer, or 3. someone with enough experience from his daily work/life that he had the knowledge needed to kill, and walk away, in broad daylight. MOO

 

[stattlich1]

I'd like to take a little time to thank you all for welcoming me on board. And I'd like to say, even though there are times when opinions vary, and speculation abounds, I always keep these two girls up front and center in my mind. I believe it is finding their killer that is our common bond. You each have taught me much in such little time.

thanks,
carry on.

 

[Evinrude]

I watched a cold case on the Jessica Dishon case. Anything is possible.

 

[Boxer]

I think, he very much likes to read something like that on here or elsewhere and is very proud of delivering the perfect crime, IMO. It is his goal and he reached it (again??) problem-free as far as we know today. I believe, he was prepared and planned a lot, which doesn't mean, he took much time for it. I believe, he is as fast as possible re the act of murder and so are his pre plannings: unbelievable f-a-a-a-s-t and exact, to the point. MOO

Totally agree. A personality trait, and to do tasks as efficiency challenges.

 

[Falling Down]

Not sure about Delphi connection, but he didn't live far away at all and I'd bet he was familiar with the trails. He definitely used SM and I am sure that some of his posts drew the attention of LE.

Just an FYI for folks following the case closely...

There are a bunch of trails in that gorge, but only two that the public are allowed to use. The trail which goes to the bridge, and the Girard trail which ends up west of the bridge, down at the creek. There was a house down there decades ago, it can be seen in archived images from Google Earth.

Several trails in the woods are on private property, RL and the M family own those parcels and trails.

Which has made me wonder since early on, how familiar is BG with those private trails?

JMO

 

[stattlich1]

There are a bunch of trails in that gorge, but only two that the public are allowed to use.
Which has made me wonder since early on, how familiar is BG with those private trails?
JMO

Being an old country boy, I can pretty much guarantee that those woods have been explored by all kinds of people over time, notwithstanding private property.

I bet you take a metal detector through those woods and you'll hit beer cans, bottle caps, and who knows what else layin' under the leaves.

Plus, I've seen mention of how tough the terrain is, and I'm sure some of it is, but from most of the photos I've seen, those woods aren't as thick as many I've seen, and tramped through, over the years.

My gut opinion tells me the killer, or killers, knew their way around that area real well.

 

[MingyMoo]

Not certain to what you refer.

However, and it's MOO.....

As I've stated before, I would not point a finger at any one individual, for to do so would be folly.

It appears to me to be a LOT of illegal activity, of all sorts, occurring in the region.

I think that what we have in the case of A & L is either a serial killer, or one who may very well become a serial killer, OR, a murderer who had something to hide, someone in the local area who stood to lose his status, fame and/or fortune as a result of one or both of the girls becoming aware of some illegal activity in which he was engaged, to include involvement in child sexual activity of some sort or participation in what appears to be a rather active local drug trade OR a flat out meth head or drug addict under the influence that acted in a blackout rage that day.

I do sense the possibility though, that the killer in this case works in, or is involved in, the public sector and/or holds a position of leadership or status among his peers. Possibly the courts, LE, fire and rescue, local school, scouting, or a man of the cloth.

This murderer is either 1. a lucky dog, 2. a crafty, well studied killer, or 3. someone with enough experience from his daily work/life that he had the knowledge needed to kill, and walk away, in broad daylight. MOO

2. a crafty, well studied killer

possibly not of humans.

Once again pondering
MingyMoo

Edited changed probably to possibly

 

[Vesta66S]

I saved that photo to my drive, then opened it, and enlarged it. There is not a shoe print in terms of the exact pattern of the bottom of a sneaker, (at least not that I have found) rather a spot above that dead tree roots where it appears the dirt in the bank has been disturbed such that a person planted their foot there to step up that steep bank.

Whoever that guy is, he appears to be carrying a firearm, and a few other goodies.

carry on

There seem to be a footprint in the lower left, above the branch.

 

[JohnnyChicago]

Police "We believe you are hiding in plain sight"
Two years later in a town of under 3000. Half of which are males. Where is this individual?
In the final image of Abbie, has it been confirmed that in the far background behind a tree, the perpetrator is hiding/peeking from behind a tree?
Curious if there were two individuals involved? Police are withholding who knows what information at this point.
But curious if there was any DNA, footprints, tracks etc
There is the theory that two individuals were involved because the girls were unable to get away, but when you are in that position, you don't know how you would respond, so the fear may have seized them up. Or if the perpetrator had a weapon, then that would also deter any escape.

 

[Trebor5591]

I watched a cold case on the Jessica Dishon case. Anything is possible.

I looked up Jessica Dishon, and was shocked and saddened. Hard to believe local LE could mess up an investigation so badly. I pray that did not happen with Abby and Libby's case.

 

[Tiger Stripes]

From @taximama24:

"...What's more likely, IMO, is perhaps BG is an only child of only children and the parents are already protecting him by lying about his alibi, etc..." (SBM)

Ding, ding, ding-a-ling! @taximama24! Though I don't have the "lucky run" of the killer (or so he *thinks* he has such luck!), I'll take "perhaps [the killer] is an only child..." for a few million (since we're trying our odds here). Actually, @taximama24's guess sounds very clear, as if taximama24's already done her homework on the case, and has narrowed down many of the options for the killer.

Thankfully, LE *does* have information (though we *don't* know exactly what that is -- and I'm also thankful that we *don't* know the details... And...guess what? Neither does the killer know! Best part!), and they're working hard to bring justice for Abby & Libby and their families. May that day be soon!

 

[FrostedGlass]

Replying to my own post.

So far I haven’t been able to locate it but I know I read something about it. I’m pretty sure it was from the people who do the Crime Watch Daily show. It was something about LE coming back to the “bridge” to collect evidence. Could they have meant the general area? I’m not positive without finding that article but my memory tells me it was on the bridge. I’ll keep looking and will post it if I find it.

In thread #117, Tresir said this:
"Bringing this here from the media thread post 789 courtesy @bradfordsleuth.
(In case this has been buried in the thread I am bumping it up.)
You can fast forward to the three minute 20 second mark mark to bypass the commentary and listen. They found something (undisclosed) on the bridge the day that ISP went back to the crime scene area.
February 23, 2017
(Apologies but the video didn't come over - please go to media thread page 40 post 789 to view the video. Still having reply box problems)
The same day as this article was printed....."
DNA evidence is top priority in Delphi murder investigation

And on Nov 25, Taximama said this in reply:
"My guess is they saw what appears to be BG turning his head quickly to spit in the video clip, and they went back to the bridge and swabbed that plank for DNA. If it didn't rain in those 10 days one would assume with great technology that would still be a viable sample."

ETA media thread: IN - Abigail Williams & Liberty German, Delphi, Media, Maps, Timelines NO DISCUSSION

 

[Charlot123]

I think they should ask all mums to volunteer DNA. When I suggested it before there were a lot on here who were against it but if it catches a killer and protects more kids why would anyone be against

@tresir2012 , much as I think it might be someone random, imagine another ssituation. They said they cleared "most" of the families. Means, "not everyone", to me.

If one of their POIs is a family member, how are LEOs going to explain their DNA on the bodies/clothes. Could be random/from the house, or, could be not...

 

[mom2chloe]

I think they should ask all mums to volunteer DNA. When I suggested it before there were a lot on here who were against it but if it catches a killer and protects more kids why would anyone be against it?

They should definitely have had any volunteer searchers give DNA prior to searching! Haven’t we seen that done in some other cases? Although I am drawing a blank I am certain I’ve seen this as standard protocol in at least another search. MOO