Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #130

Discussion in 'Located Persons Discussion' started by Tricia, Apr 22, 2019.

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  1. Diddian

    Diddian Well-Known Member

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    I wonder whether they noticed whether the cemetery had been freshly mown?
     


  2. Nancy1954

    Nancy1954 Well-Known Member

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  3. Nancy1954

    Nancy1954 Well-Known Member

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    Perhaps because both girls were deceased by the time they got to the bank of where that one set of footprints is found. I have always wondered this, given that there was only mention of the one set of footprints. MOO.
     
  4. MistyWaters

    MistyWaters Well-Known Member

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    On this link flick the top photo to the second one. The bridge is not very wide at all. I think if he started approaching from the NW while the girls were on the bridge deck the logical option for them would be to walk SE ahead of him, even if they’d never intended to go the full length of the bridge. If so, I’d suppose they expected him to just turn around once he got to the end and walk back to the trails. Then they could cross back after he was gone.

    That’s the most likely scenario I can think of because passing someone on that bridge would scare the daylights out of most people, especially if it were a stranger. All it would take is a sharp nudge and the river or tree tops are 60 feet down below.

    Sponsor, donors sought to turn trestle into trail crossing
     
  5. stattlich1

    stattlich1 Well-Known Member

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    Doubtful there was any grass mowing going on in February.
     
  6. Satchie

    Satchie Well-Known Member

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    I'm not sure how wide, but it's a railway bridge with some extra platform on either side so maybe 6 feet, BUT, it is very high up over a gorge, without guardrails. People must have to pass each other on occassion, but IMO it would be done carefully and slowly.
     
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  7. MistyWaters

    MistyWaters Well-Known Member

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    In February, a warm winter day? That would appear suspicious for sure.
     
  8. Diddian

    Diddian Well-Known Member

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    One set of footprints could also mean the girls took a different path, as would happen if there were two predators working together, one initially confronting them on the south side of Deer Creek and then driving them toward the other on the north side and the other capturing or hunting them as they came in his direction.
     
  9. Diddian

    Diddian Well-Known Member

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    Good point! SMH.
     
  10. photographer4

    photographer4 Well-Known Member

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    If it had been freshly mown, in February no less, I'm sure we wouldn't have seen LE vehicles parked there in the photos / video of the investigation unfolding! Surely they'd have noticed that and wondered why and then searched it with a fine tooth comb or two?
     
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  11. TL4S

    TL4S Well-Known Member

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    I also think it's quite possible he was not hunting for a victim that day at all, but he saw them at whatever point and for whatever reason wanted to engage them. I don't think it necessarily took planning to corner them there, either, but I bet he knew he could if they crossed the bridge, because he was familiar.

    This is JMO, and it's only me guessing at random, but I don't think he planned or prepared a kill site, hung trail cams, scoped out the trail for victims, stuffed his jacket full of fantasy items, or any other pre-mediated activity. I don't know why I think that, but I do. There's just as good a chance he did any of those things as not, but I can't see it.

    I think in the space between the south end of the bridge and the creek, he got control and started his attack. I'm guessing L's shoe and phone and whatever else might have been lost during a struggle on the south side and whatever caused him to decide to take them across the creek was maybe an impulsive move to get them all out of sight. Or the girls ran that way. I don't know. If he left signatures, I think they were likely manifestations of his heightened state in that moment, and if things were "odd" it's because he's odd in his mentality, anyway. JMO
     
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2021
  12. stattlich1

    stattlich1 Well-Known Member

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    I would guess the railroad bridge to be greater than 8 and half feet wide.

    The standard railroad ties dimensions and most used are 7” (in) x 9” (in) x 8.5’ (feet). Some other dimensions are also in use, those are 7” (in) x 8” (in) x 8.5’ (feet) ; 6” (in) x 8” (in) x 8.5’ (feet).


    https://trainconductorhq.com/railroad-tie-dimensions/
     
  13. Beachlife926

    Beachlife926 Well-Known Member

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    In addition, last year they announced widening it to 10 feet.
    “The City of Delphi is working on the project as well. A $1.2 million grant from the state will help pave the trail, widen it 10 feet and help with soil erosion.”
    $260K renovation underway to turn Delphi's Monon High Bridge into pedestrian trail
     
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  14. stattlich1

    stattlich1 Well-Known Member

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  15. JnRyan

    JnRyan Well-Known Member

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    And that maybe why in the latest HLN special, Sheriff Leazenby stated they could only speculate as to how and where the murderer left the crime scene. In fact, some of the searchers before they found Abigail and Liberty might have parked there. Add to that, Sheriff Leazenby stated he may have made a mistake by calling off the tracking dogs. As you point out, hindsight is 20-20.
     
  16. Skully

    Skully Well-Known Member

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    Yes another good point, the searchers had to park somewhere.
     
  17. Skully

    Skully Well-Known Member

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    I don't think he put up cams either, but he came prepared. The common thought is that he had at least a gun to control them, a weapon to kill them other than a gun (no shots heard that we know of) maybe even a stun gun to get control of one of the girls so he could deal with the other. His jacket is full, you can see it. What's in the fanny pack? So I do think he was hunting that day. He most likely had hunted before but didn't get his victim, that day it lined up for him. JMO
     
  18. Angels27

    Angels27 Well-Known Member

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    How much DNA can they get from a cigarette? And how could they tell it was fresh? If true, that evidence should be as good or better than the video and audio. The cigarette brand. The DNA. The fact that someone involved smoked. Unless it was from a searcher. Did they get close to where it was found? That’s the first I’ve heard of a cigarette. Thanks for posting that.
     
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  19. Beachlife926

    Beachlife926 Well-Known Member

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    When reviewing a location on google it informs you of the “popular times”. While looking at “Monon High Bridge Trail” the busiest times are the following for a Monday:
    10am: usually a little busy
    11am-2pm: usually not too busy
    2pm-4pm: usually a little busy
    4pm-6pm: usually not too busy
    6pm-9pm: usually not busy

    It was similar for other days too (except Tuesday, the more busy times were 12/1pm and Thursday at 4pm). All week days had the 2pm hour as “usually a little busy”.
    IMO
    My old job had a trail system nearby so during our lunch break people would often walk the trails and I assume show that location as busy since we all took our lunch at the same time. I wonder if any businesses in the area regularly take their lunch breaks during the more busy hours and are close enough to drive/walk to trail system.
     
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2021
  20. Skully

    Skully Well-Known Member

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    But they had a "no school day", and it was unusually warm winter day. I would think that changed the numbers a little bit. I heard about 50 people that day, but again, when did they arrive, or leave. Ebb and flow. Either way, no one saw what he did. So sad.
     
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