Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #136

Discussion in 'Located Persons Discussion' started by Tricia, Apr 22, 2019.

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  1. UnapologeticallyAspie

    UnapologeticallyAspie Hiding In Plain Sight: Females on the Spectrum

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    WOW!
     
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  2. sandy_80

    sandy_80 On Time Out

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    you think BG targeted a very small time cause the locals would have no experience in dealing the case..like keyes did ?
     
  3. carbuff

    carbuff Well-Known Member

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    Excellent description of the process and the issues. The same issues come up in reconstructions of unidentified victims. Even the best recreation is an approximation of a possible face, not a photo of what the person looked like in life.

    And people like us aren't the audience for either. It doesn't matter whether we think the sketches look alike or are two different people or whatever. The important thing would be whether someone who knows the person would recognize them and be motivated to tell LE.
     
  4. Yemelyan

    Yemelyan Well-Known Member

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    Someone needs to pin this to the beginning of every Delphi thread! Thank you for articulating it so well.
     
  5. Ibiz

    Ibiz Once I thought I was wrong, but I was mistaken.

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    I think if BG is ever caught then we will see a little of him in both sketches. When it comes to JBC, im amazed at how much he resembles the first sketch, but yet his eye's and mouth are so familiar in the second sketch.

    Even if it cant be proven, i would be shocked if he is ever dismissed as a suspect.
     
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  6. Yemelyan

    Yemelyan Well-Known Member

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    It would be tricky to count on this because any time it's a missing/murdered "minor of tender age" the FBI almost always gets involved immediately as a resource, which is exactly what we saw happen here (along with the resources of the state police).
     
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  7. cujenn81

    cujenn81 Well-Known Member

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    I get that a sketch is not a photograph. I don’t expect BG to look exactly like (or even all that similar to) the man depicted in either sketch. I also know that eyewitness accounts are not infallible. In fact, eyewitness testimony is notoriously unreliable. No two people will ever describe XYZ the exact same way — even if they know what to pay attention to ahead of time and even when they know they will be asked to describe it later. Perception is a much more complicated beast than that.

    Here is my problem —


    If the man depicted in Sketch #1 is not the same man depicted in Sketch #2 (which is what we’ve been told by LE), it makes absolutely zero sense to say the suspect will likely resemble a combination of the two.

    Either

    Witness(es) #1 saw a man and described the man depicted in Sketch #1
    Witness #2 saw a different man and described the man depicted in Sketch #2

    OR

    Witness(es) #1 and Witness #2 saw the same man and described him in vastly different ways

    But, it can’t be both.

    While a “combination BG” is certainly plausible in the later scenario, LE says the opposite is true — the man depicted in the first sketch is not the same man depicted in the second sketch.

    And herein lies my confusion.
     
  8. MistyWaters

    MistyWaters Well-Known Member

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    Good point. This is also where we get stuck in an endless loop - does LE know the identity of the killer? How can DC say the appearance of the killer may be a combination of both sketches? Because in reality, the odds are far greater that he’ll resemble neither of the two.
     
    Last edited: Jun 23, 2021
  9. Becky Starkey

    Becky Starkey Well-Known Member

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    I've always thought he had a weird looking mustache, and rather than shaving it off, he just ripped it off. I can see it briefly as he lifts his head up in closer up versions of the video.
     
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  10. Becky Starkey

    Becky Starkey Well-Known Member

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    And his whole outfit is a disguise. It's not his normal wear. Recently in Ballwin, MO was a kidnap, rape and murder in a Catholic Supply store. The perp kept a very similar disguise under his trailer home, hiding it from his wife. In fact, a lot of people thought he might have been BG.
     
  11. Yemelyan

    Yemelyan Well-Known Member

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    I think it could be that it's the word ISP chose to use - "man" - that's creating the confusion. The sketches do depict a "man" in the sense that it's a human face with two eyes, one nose, etc but these depictions are not actual men as @carbuff explained so well. They are more like possible faces or memories, the accuracy of which is unknown.

    I think in their attempt to simplify the situation - "we now want the features of this sketch to be primary, not this other one" they used language that was too strong. It's kind of easy to understand why they did this because the whole press conference had errors in it (such as which day the vehicle was at CPS) so there was a lot to clarify. They definitely wanted people to put all their focus on the "new" sketch so they asked the public to think of these as different "men." However, if they had even used the word "face" or "depiction" instead of "man" (which would have been more correct) I think it would have made more sense to people that one sketch could be primary but that the eventual perpetrator may end up being a mixture of the two.

    This is just my opinion based on what I know about how sketches are made and used. I understand that others will think "man" should be taken more at face value.

    I believe that your second scenario is what likely occurred (witnesses saw the same person but described him differently; intelligence developed over time led LE to trust one depiction over the other). JMO
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2021
  12. sandy_80

    sandy_80 On Time Out

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    witnesses saw different persons and LE can not decide which one is BG is my take ...saying its a combination of both is either to try and disguise the mess they did with the sketches or they think he was wearing a unbelievable disguise ...
     
  13. SMK777

    SMK777 Well-Known Member

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    Exactly. Two minors were killed, so this was never going to be a crime simply handled by some “local yokels”; state police and FBI were immediately involved—and I’m assuming with Israel Keyes, though he was not dealing with minors, BUT WAS an abductor, rapist, and murderer, the same still applied.
     
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  14. minazoe

    minazoe Well-Known Member

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  15. minazoe

    minazoe Well-Known Member

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    Israel said he didn't do kids..yet he still refused to talk about the true sum of victims or who they were before he killed himself.

    Ted Bundy also denied his 12 year old victim.

    mOO
     
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  16. Charlot123

    Charlot123 Well-Known Member

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    I thought about it, but never seriously, tbh. But if we believe it, then:

    1) his hair may not be “his”
    2) even the skin tone and hair color is questionable; I saw it as reddish, but he might be very pale
    3) he may have longer neck, and different upper body anatomy
    4) if one speaks in a mask, how would the voice change?

    It could explain absence of anything on his face or under the girls’ nails if they were fighting him.
     
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  17. minazoe

    minazoe Well-Known Member

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    freak me out why dontcha? LOLz..scary thought. mOO
     
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  18. WildHuncher

    WildHuncher Certified Insane Amateur

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    Yes. Statements that the sketches are not of the same person are IMHO not literally true. Trying to take them as such sends one down blind alleys.
     
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  19. WildHuncher

    WildHuncher Certified Insane Amateur

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    He didn't want people to think he was creepy, probably.
     
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  20. Slawsb

    Slawsb Well-Known Member

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