Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #137

Discussion in 'Located Persons Discussion' started by Tricia, Apr 22, 2019.

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  1. carbuff

    carbuff Well-Known Member

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    With DN that's definitely possible. What was released to the public is kind of fuzzy, but LE might well know more.
     
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  2. MollyDDD

    MollyDDD Well-Known Member

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    I think he wore bulky clothes to disguise himself.
    Looks like a wind breaker to me with a hoodie underneath.
    The baggie jeans are seen in a few of his photos on Facebook. There’s one where he’s standing on a cliff with mountains in the background and he has that same stance.
    It’s chilling to see it. IMO
     
  3. MollyDDD

    MollyDDD Well-Known Member

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    I had the same thing happen with a few of my posts too, drives me crazy.
     
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  4. Imvp2

    Imvp2 Well-Known Member

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    The wind breaker, that in my opinion, with the weapon imprint worn into the right side, was well worn by BG prior to Delphi. It may be long gone now, but that wind breaker with the weapon impression, someone has got to recall seeing it over the years
     
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  5. JnRyan

    JnRyan Well-Known Member

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    What you are describing is what we used in some fraud cases. Also called 'data mining'. I always thought if I could have a database of the phone numbers, with the owner's names, that pinged in the area that afternoon and compared it with the motor vehicle database (assuming such database includes a photo). Going from there to compare the photos against the sketches and video we could get close. Using a 3rd DB, the FBI's tip database, Pyramid, might also help. Depending on the size of what might be the largest of the DB's, motor vehicle records, MS Access might do the trick.

    Of course, my idea here is fantasy because a listing of cell phones WITH the owner's data is not going to be allowed as it violates legal decisions or privacy laws. But I can dream.
     
  6. Charlot123

    Charlot123 Well-Known Member

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    Yes, but you are trying to make an algorithm to catch the Delphi killer. Which is a great idea because IMHO, manually, they can’t do much with Delphi tips.

    I simply think that while the tip database might not be useful to catch the murderer of the girls, statistically, there should be a couple of random serial killers there in general. I just want to let the programs do the job, assuming that these people hunt in previously known places.

    Your idea is great for this specific (Delphi) case. It probably could work even if the killer left the cellphone and the car 5 miles away from the CS and walked. It won’t work if he left this cellphone 60 miles away and took only a burner phone with him, but I believe people are more attached to their phones than we think, and that it probably was in his vehicle.
     
  7. JnRyan

    JnRyan Well-Known Member

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    All true, but using the tip database through a database program like MS Access to go after serial killers is really just another variant of the data mining that forensic accountants have been using for the last 10-15 years.
     
  8. sunshineray

    sunshineray Well-Known Member

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    It all comes back to what Sheriff Leazenby said and if you take his words literally or not.

    My hypothetical tipsters, by the time they're thinking about tipping, already know who the guilty is/are. That was my point, anyone else's opinions wouldn't factor in at all. AJMO
     
  9. Thechaoz

    Thechaoz New Member

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    Only an idiot would bring their phone to a potential murder site.

    That being said, it was a very bold murder. In fact, I honestly believe he probably thought he was going to get caught and didn't even care. Had to act on the urge.

    Busy day, unusually hot, condensed area in a small town on private property wearing clothes way too thick for the weather.

    How could he think he WOULD get away with it?

    Oh yes, LE incompetence
     
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  10. katydid23

    katydid23 Well-Known Member

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    I think he got away with it for a few reasons---

    ---It was an opportunity attack---he had no known connection to the girls.
    ---I don't think there was a sexual assault---so he left no DNA of that type.
    ---I think the 'killings' were what gives him that kind of pleasure--not SA.
    ---He was just moving through the area---no connections to reveal or point to
    ---He left the area and didn't leave a 'footprint'---no job or home in the area
    ---He didn't tell anyone what he did---he is a lone wolf
    ---He didn't park nearby---was able to slip away quietly on foot
    ---He is an experienced criminal
    ---He knows how to be charming and act normal enough to 'pass.'
     
  11. keep-it-real

    keep-it-real Well-Known Member

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    In my opinion they/he used Libbys phone to video the whole thing, thats the reason her phone was left at the scene.

    I havent discounted that Libbys phone was also used to contact people not present at the Monon Bridge are that day.

    JMO
     
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  12. minazoe

    minazoe Well-Known Member

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    How interesting..Im gonna say this is very much akin to my feelings too..because I have always thought he recorded the murders so he could watch them later..for a long time I thought he was wearing a go-pro camera with a mouth rig as he crossed the bridge..as a pedo/sadist a recording would be very important to him and I feel like its 80 percent possible he did record or take pictures maybe even with a phone. Yes he could have sent or transferred that file somewhere for safe downloading.. The only thing is I don't think the phone was in an obvious place...can anyone clarify how and where the phone was found? I can't remember.

    for me JBC has not put that much effort into concealing , he is just naturally very sneaky
    and he got lucky with earlier crimes.

    The fact that he was not caught emboldened him..I think he was lusting for attention with the murder of the girls and I do think he attempts sex acts etc..but he knows about DNA from prison and has used that info to conceal his identity.

    I think after the murders in Evansdale people have been much more watchful of their kids.. he may not have been able to get the little nine year olds he prefers.

    I also think it is possible he would murder adult women too and should not be ruled out as a POI in other possible cases.

    mOO
     
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  13. Detective Willy

    Detective Willy Well-Known Member

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    I like your theory here and if correct our Perp has committed premeditated double homicide. If this is the case LE has him on the shortlist but can’t nail him…..yet.
     
  14. minazoe

    minazoe Well-Known Member

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    this little ____er...is the kind of guy who is always on the prowl..in school I am sure he looked to get that one straggler from the pack alone so he could abuse them out of sight..I think what he did is pathological in that he is always going to do this..it's not so much a matter of a plan but actually who he is. He is a walking premeditation, he is ready when you are..he is just going to click the boxes and go...he's fast, he's efficient and he doesn't have to spend a lot of time..he is naturally sneaky so he has a preternatural way of making an assessment and having solutions to possible predicaments filed away in his head.

    ADDED. He is a natural criminal..a born criminal. pathologically criminal.

    mOO
     
  15. sandy_80

    sandy_80 Well-Known Member

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    I agree on all points except the last two
    he doesnt need to be ( experienced ) to pull this off .. he might have planned and fantasized for a long while like that guy who kidnapped the girl and killed her parents ..the one that escaped

    ..also he doesn't have to be charming...he could be every bit creepy and scary just the drifter who no one gives a second thought ..
     
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  16. carbuff

    carbuff Well-Known Member

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    In other cases, it seems like that kind of person is able to turn on charm when he wants to, and then flip to scary and angry in a second.
     
  17. JnRyan

    JnRyan Well-Known Member

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    Mostly I agree with these. That first especially as murders by strangers are harder to solve. On the third one, I do believe that even though there may have not been sexual assault he does derive some sexual gratification from the killings. (But that may be what you meant.) On number four, I believe he does have a connection to the area its just not obvious and recent. IOW, some time in his past - maybe middle school - he spent some time in the area maybe with a relative who no longer lives there or is deceased. I believe it is very likely he doesn't even live in Carroll County, let alone Delphi. He could even currently reside in Indianapolis, Louisville KY or Chicago IL and that is your fifth point.

    'He didn't park nearby' - I tend to believe he did but I'm not 100% on that point. To the best of our knowledge LE only has one unidentified vehicle and it was parked at the CPS building. Or at least that is the only one LE has mentioned to the public. But that doesn't mean that is the vehicle the killer was driving. It is probably an obvious assumption that this person went on the trails, but it is probably just that - an assumption. For all we know the driver parked there for some other obscure reason and never went out on the trails. But for most of us we have an unidentified person (sketches) and an unidentified vehicle (CPS building) and so we put them together.

    (I still can't get past LE bringing up the vehicle over 2 years after the murders. I can't remember the cars parked around me at a nearby trailhead two months ago and forget two years ago. Even if there was a vehicle parked on the shoulder of the road leading to the trailhead - i.e., outside the normal parking area - I don't believe I would remember enough details about it if it were last week. And if this was the car the killer arrived in, LE has to be relying on the public because he isn't going to come forward and say, "OK, you got me.". If the driver did use the trails and wasn't the killer and they are a male they're not likely to come forward as they will likely get the same treatment as all the other POI/suspects we've seen in the media. Then again, I wonder if LE sometime before the April 2019 PC went over the vehicles one more time and said, "Oops, we missed this one.")

    Experienced criminal. Yeah, I believe it. It may have not been murder or rape, but likely some crime against a person. I don't believe this killer just walked out on the trail that day and said, "Oh, I'm going to kill those two girls and then go back to being a law abiding citizen.".
     
  18. minazoe

    minazoe Well-Known Member

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    why is it important to know how he left or how he got there? I don't get the fascination over how he comes and goes from the park..people come and go from the park all the time..he had to get there somehow and leave somehow..there are several choices..maybe he borrowed a car that day..maybe he left on a spaceship..maybe he walked ..so much emphasis on which path..etc..I just don't get it...mOO
     
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  19. keep-it-real

    keep-it-real Well-Known Member

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    re the car and the sketch of the younger male if it comes to that are product of intellignce gathered LE didnt have details of these beforehand, someone offered up this information, someone under pressure and was either facing jail time or their partner/wife was and they did a deal.
    Did one or more of the group arrive in the car, most likely, was it abandoned on purpose most likely... time will tell.

    Was it a sexually motivated crime?.. No this wasnt a crime based on sexual pleasure at the press conference Doug Carter addresses the murderer and says this is all about 'POWER' to you! This crime was committed to publicly show the 'POWER' the murderer is able exert over someone. Wether that was power over the victim or power over someone connected to the victim is yet to be determind. My opinion is that this crime was videoed by the person/s involved and it was most likely videod using Libbys phone or a phone left at the scene.
    Its not enough these days for criminals competing for status or revenge to verbally threaten or physically beat people up or shoot them outright, real power comes from fear, fear that reaches new depths of humiliation torture and suffering and showing this in real time. This visual impact leaves the deepest and most profound effect on the lives of people wether they know the victim or not.

    The use of hard drugs have played a part in the acceleration of such crimes.

    These are my opinions only
     
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  20. minazoe

    minazoe Well-Known Member

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    sex crimes are always about power..and these kinds of murders are always about sex.

    mOO
     
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