Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #146

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stattlich1

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I think the trek from the cemetery to the crime scene is not near as difficult as some would propose. In fact, I'm convinced the woods in the area in February, as evidenced by the numerous videos available, are quite open and devoid of vegetation. RL actually pointed out the bridge to the reporter in what I think is the video on the following site which appears to have been removed, or at minimum I am not tech savvy enough to retrieve. They were standing in the area of the Southeast corner of the cemetery along the eastern side of the old quarry area. I recall it distinctly.

A quick click and look at the second photo/video tab shows the two of them walking, without difficulty, down the very hill.


Historic Aerials: Viewer, go to this site, click view images, type in Delphi, IN, slide over to the bridge and CS area, you can see the Delphi Cemetery, and you can zoom in and out. Then click the aerials tab on left, then choose 1958 or 1960. You can see the entire Cemetery, the scope and size of the quarry, and Deer Creek.

I've traipsed the Appalachians quite a bit in my time, and there is just no way that I'll be convinced I couldn't reach the CS from the area of the cemetery. As a matter of fact, it appears RL himself is standing by the CS tape in several available videos, some recently posted here on this thread. I would wager he walked down there.
 

stattlich1

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I was able to capture the photo of the area from the aforementioned website. From what I recall, this snapshot may very well even be the point in the video where RL is pointing out the bridge to the reporter.


1653266336364.png
 
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stattlich1

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And here they are standing in the area. I can see the woods are not so thick, and easily could be walked by anyone in decent enough shape to hurdle a couple downed trees now and then. Any fit man or woman could do so.

1653266580071.png
 

Falling Down

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I think the trek from the cemetery to the crime scene is not near as difficult as some would propose. In fact, I'm convinced the woods in the area in February, as evidenced by the numerous videos available, are quite open and devoid of vegetation. RL actually pointed out the bridge to the reporter in what I think is the video on the following site which appears to have been removed, or at minimum I am not tech savvy enough to retrieve. They were standing in the area of the Southeast corner of the cemetery along the eastern side of the old quarry area. I recall it distinctly.

A quick click and look at the second photo/video tab shows the two of them walking, without difficulty, down the very hill.


Historic Aerials: Viewer, go to this site, click view images, type in Delphi, IN, slide over to the bridge and CS area, you can see the Delphi Cemetery, and you can zoom in and out. Then click the aerials tab on left, then choose 1958 or 1960. You can see the entire Cemetery, the scope and size of the quarry, and Deer Creek.

I've traipsed the Appalachians quite a bit in my time, and there is just no way that I'll be convinced I couldn't reach the CS from the area of the cemetery. As a matter of fact, it appears RL himself is standing by the CS tape in several available videos, some recently posted here on this thread. I would wager he walked down there.

There are two gates, one where the cemetery road path meets RL's property, so SE corner of the cemetery, and one on RL's property.

The cemetery gate had a lock on it when I was there in 2017.

There's no direct access to the CS from the cemetery. There's also a fence between the cemetery and RL's property, the gate is at the far back end, there's also a fence at the back of the cemetery. There's a fence along the tree line on RL's property at the top of the gorge, and the other gate I mention is along that fence, near to the cemetery.
 

Falling Down

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I was able to capture the photo of the area from the aforementioned website. From what I recall, this snapshot may very well even be the point in the video where RL is pointing out the bridge to the reporter.


View attachment 345433

The bridge can't be seen from where they are, which is towards the top of the gorge.

He's pointing towards the road/driveway across the creek.
 

Spartygirl

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Here's something to ponder, what happens if Ron Logan was BG, he told the girls they were trespassing and offered to get them back across the creek where he killed them. But as a coincidence someone Libby had been communicating with went to the bridge to meet them - "I was supposed to meet up with her but she didn't show up".....he then thinks he's been blown off, exits the trails and gets his dad to pick him up.
Doug Carter said nobody had got the scenario right, it could be something like the aforementioned but it could explain someone giving LE the YBG sketch as he was there, with his burner phone perhaps, possibly planning to do something illegal, but not murder.
This case is just baffling, I think LE need to come out and publicly state Ron Logan was NOT bridge guy, or maybe he was, maybe he did get them back over to his side and shooed them off with a flea in their ears only for them to fall into the clutches of the actual killer that was on the trails - eek !!
I dont think RL is BG
I think if LE/FBI really thought he was and having that affidavit to obtain a search warrant and arresting him on probation violation, I think they would have arrested him for the murders.
They had search warrant, they had him physically in jail and plenty of opportunities to question him and hold him for the murders.

Yet, they didn't.

Kind of funny how a few months after his death, these docs are released.

All JMO
 

Spartygirl

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There are two gates, one where the cemetery road path meets RL's property, so SE corner of the cemetery, and one on RL's property.

The cemetery gate had a lock on it when I was there in 2017.

There's no direct access to the CS from the cemetery. There's also a fence between the cemetery and RL's property, the gate is at the far back end, there's also a fence at the back of the cemetery. There's a fence along the tree line on RL's property at the top of the gorge, and the other gate I mention is along that fence, near to the cemetery.
Yes.. that is how I remember it when I was there also.

We couldn't get to the CS from the cemetery without being on RL's property and there was a locked gate back in that corner also, along with the fencing.
 

IQuestion

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LE has never confirmed exactly the sequence of those words from what I recall.

A)The reason for the break/pause in the audio is one of those things we may only have confirmed WHEN this case gets solved.

B)A directive by him to the girls to find person(s) they were looking for 'down the hill' certainly aligns with a catfishing theory.

C)The reason for LE holding back that one word for over 2 years still bewilders me.

JMO
Bradfordsleuth...BINGO! Snipped and ABC'd by me. You hit 3 major issues. I remember years ago many WS'ers, including me, discussed the familiar/casual/colloquial form of address "guys" when it was released by LE. For some reason it was reduced in length to just 3 words. I still feel the words were more of a direction or location as opposed to a command. But of course if someone had a gun in their hands when they said it...definitely a command.
Q "Have you seen A-shots?"
A "Yah, the guy's down the hill" or "You want to see the guys down the hill." or "I just saw the guys down the hill."
There are just too many ways to interpret the words before and after "down the hill." A response?, an order?, a direction?....a contraction?, referring to one other or more than one?. I just can't figure it out. I too am bewildered by the vagueness of only 3 words. How would it ever be possible to identify with confidence a voice, recorded through pocket lining or under a jacket? Dhaaang, video, audio, short time frame and still no identified killer, right?n
Then of course 20 minutes at the crime scene...nah, maybe 20 minutes to drag an unconscious person a quarter of a mile? And also carrying another person the same distance. But now I Question... what was it in the killer's mind that compelled him to put the victims together, even in death? Is that the message/signature?
 
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steeltowngirl

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I dont think RL is BG
I think if LE/FBI really thought he was and having that affidavit to obtain a search warrant and arresting him on probation violation, I think they would have arrested him for the murders.
They had search warrant, they had him physically in jail and plenty of opportunities to question him and hold him for the murders.

Yet, they didn't.

Kind of funny how a few months after his death, these docs are released.

All JMO

I’m with ya. Maybe the documents were protected by privacy rights until RL’s death. They provide new and relevant information about the crime scene, so for that reason they are worthwhile. I do wish LE would come out and specifically clear RL once and for all.
 

rebelchild

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If it was actually the cousin’s alibi, I don’t think the cousin would have been the one to reveal the lie to police.

Unless he was trying to throw them off the trial .. maybe that's the reason for DC making the statement he did during the last press conference .. what was it? something like "you didn't think we'd change directions" and that they felt they had been on the right path in the beginning?

Sorry if this has already been talked about .. I am really far behind on this thread

Also has anyone mentioned if KK or his dad could possibly be "the cousin"? just a thought
 

MichMan015

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Perhaps this post should be in the KAK thread but it just seems more relevant here. Since there is a possibility of two perps and KAK had proven contact with Libby. He also has his father, at home both with access to the same devices that are seeming to point to a connection with the crime. Hhhhmmmm!
 

Falling Down

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Where do you now believe he parked?
At the abandoned CPS/county building.

Makes sense, he parked at one of three places people would have parked at to access the trails. He picked the one which most likely nobody else would have parked at that day, on a day when there would have little trail traffic mid-day, a place people driving by on C.R. 300 wouldn't have paid much attention to while driving by, a spot people would not have been able to see clearly from the trail, by the Freedom Bridge.

There's little traffic on C.R. 300 on any day. Would be risky parking at the main parking area on the other side of IN 25, as well as the spot where the girls were dropped off. Folks' memories and such.

JMO
 

TheVisual

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Bradfordsleuth...BINGO! Snipped and ABC'd by me. You hit 3 major issues. I remember years ago many WS'ers, including me, discussed the familiar/casual/colloquial form of address "guys" when it was released by LE. For some reason it was reduced in length to just 3 words. I still feel the words were more of a direction or location as opposed to a command. But of course if someone had a gun in their hands when they said it...definitely a command.
Q "Have you seen A-shots?"
A "Yah, the guy's down the hill" or "You want to see the guys down the hill." or "I just saw the guys down the hill."
There are just too many ways to interpret the words before and after "down the hill." A response?, an order?, a direction?....a contraction?, referring to one other or more than one?. I just can't figure it out. I too am bewildered by the vagueness of only 3 words. How would it ever be possible to identify with confidence a voice, recorded through pocket lining or under a jacket? Dhaaang, video, audio, short time frame and still no identified killer, right?n
Then of course 20 minutes at the crime scene...nah, maybe 20 minutes to drag an unconscious person a quarter of a mile? And also carrying another person the same distance. But now I Question... what was it in the killer's mind that compelled him to put the victims together, even in death? Is that the message/signature?
I've always thought that " guys" sounded like a greeting. Sounds different then "down the hill". Sort of like "Hi" but plural because there are two. "Down the hill" sounds more like a directive. Difference in the tone of both. I don't think these words were done at the same instance in time. Maybe one when the girls first encountered him and the other when he approached them at the south end of the bridge. JMO
 

Falling Down

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I've always thought that " guys" sounded like a greeting. Sounds different then "down the hill". Sort of like "Hi" but plural because there are two. "Down the hill" sounds more like a directive. Difference in the tone of both. I don't think these words were done at the same instance in time. Maybe one when the girls first encountered him and the other when he approached them at the south end of the bridge. JMO

I've wondered if they saw him from a distance after getting dropped off.
 

FromGermany1

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Sorry to just jump in, but I wanted to share this information from several Newspaper articles via Newspapers.com related to this crime and Ron Logan that I placed in Chronological order.

My personal opinion is that Ron Logan didn't have anything to do with these murders. I have always thought the BG video, albeit distorted, shows a man who is too young to be RL.



Monday / February 13, 2017

The owner of the property where the girls were found allegedly drove to the Carroll County Transfer Station on Feb. 13, according to a petition to revoke probation filed March 16 by an adult probation officer.

He allegedly committed, "a new criminal offense of Habitual Traffic Violater" when he drove to the Carroll County Transfer Station, where residents can drop off trash and recyclables.

During the sentencing hearing, deputy prosecutor Jerry Bean said the man's trip to the dump took place before the girls were dropped off at a hiking trail near his property.

Surveillance video from the transfer station "clearly shows" the property owner driving his truck to drop off a load of trash.

(The man (Ron Logan) told the paper that he'd gone to Lafayette on Feb. 13, the day the girls were killed.)

(He (Ron Logan) came home to find people asking him if they can search his property for the missing girls.)



Tuesday / February 14, 2017

Where the girls were found was at the back of his (Ron Logan's) property which slopes down as it nears the creek and it is not visible from the road or the house.



Thursday / February 16, 2017

"To have anyone murdered on your property... I don't know what my feelings are right now. It caught me by surprise."
- Ron Logan

"I haven't really had a chance to let it soak in. I know the families."
- Ron Logan



Monday / February 27, 2017

Probation officers also accused him (RL) of consuming an alcoholic beverage Feb. 27 at a Pizza King in Americus.



Saturday / March 11, 2017

He (RL) was arrested March 11 for allegedly violating the terms of his probation in a 2014 drunk driving case.



Thursday / March 16, 2017

The owner of the property where the girls were found allegedly drove to the Carroll County Transfer Station on Feb. 13, according to a petition to revoke probation filed March 16 by an adult probation officer.

According to the petition, the man was prohibited from consuming alcohol, having access to a vehicle or committing a new criminal offense as part of his two-year suspended sentence.

He allegedly committed, "a new criminal offense of Habitual Traffic Violater" when he drove to the Carroll County Transfer Station, where residents can drop off trash and recyclables.

Probation officers also accused him of consuming an alcoholic beverage Feb. 27 at a Pizza King in Americus.

Additionally, he allegedly had improper access to a vehicle parked across the street from his home in the 5800 block of West County Road 300 North in Delphi.



Friday / March 17, 2017

Police arrived just after 11:30 a.m. Friday. Police stormed a farmhouse Friday morning on Carroll County Road 300 North. He (RL) owns the property on which Libby and Abby were found.



Saturday / March 18, 2017

Slocum said police have served about a dozen search warrants in the course of this investigation and have interviewed hundreds of people.

"The search warrant is for the whole property, so we can go anywhere we want and look for whatever we need to look for." - Indiana Sgt. Kim Riley



Monday / April 3, 2017

During a court hearing Monday, the property owner (RL) pleaded guilty to the probation violation and a new felony charge of being a habitual traffic violator.

As part of a plea agreement, charges of false informing and obstruction of justice were dropped, according to Deputy Prosecutor Jerry Bean.

"You're a danger to this community." - Judge

"Maybe in the future, no one else will be murdered in my backyard."
- Ron Logan



Monday / April 10, 2017

The owner of the property where two Delphi teenagers were found dead was sentenced Monday.

The man was sentenced to serve the remainder of his probation, in addition to two years on a new felony charge of being a habitual traffic violator, totaling 3 1/2 years in the Indiana Department of Correction.

During the sentencing hearing, Deputy Prosecutor Jerry Bean said the man's trip to the dump took place before the girls were dropped off at a hiking trail near his property.

Surveillance video from the transfer station "clearly shows" the property owner driving his truck to drop off a load of trash.
Additionally, he allegedly had improper access to a vehicle parked across the street from his home in the 5800 block of West County Road 300 North in Delphi.

March 16, 2017

What does that mean? Is it important to know re the crime?
 

Yemelyan

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Additionally, he allegedly had improper access to a vehicle parked across the street from his home in the 5800 block of West County Road 300 North in Delphi.

March 16, 2017

What does that mean? Is it important to know re the crime?
It means, he wasn't allowed to drive a vehicle due to being convicted of habitual drunk driving but police know that he drove one anyway.
 

Justice101

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Saw the thread expanded to 16 pages over the weekend.

Was hoping when I came back on here Monday morning and that this was a sign of some sort of new information on the case.

Alas... I'm afraid it was not to be.

This crime baffles me.. and all of us.. Obviously, LE has the most information and the most "evidence" and they don't have enough to be able to arrest (yet) and move this to court.

What's crazy is that none of the current list of talked about suspects - RL, KAK or AK.. really looks like BG to me.

The warrants are all technically truthful... however, by nature, they are slanted a little by just including the facts that support someone's involvement (and not what goes against their involvement).

This case may never come to an arrest or identification of the perpetrator.
 

CADwrest

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Saw the thread expanded to 16 pages over the weekend.

Was hoping when I came back on here Monday morning and that this was a sign of some sort of new information on the case.

Alas... I'm afraid it was not to be.

This crime baffles me.. and all of us.. Obviously, LE has the most information and the most "evidence" and they don't have enough to be able to arrest (yet) and move this to court.

What's crazy is that none of the current list of talked about suspects - RL, KAK or AK.. really looks like BG to me.

The warrants are all technically truthful... however, by nature, they are slanted a little by just including the facts that support someone's involvement (and not what goes against their involvement).

This case may never come to an arrest or identification of the perpetrator.
I've noticed this pattern with cases that drag on for years like this. Nothing new gets released for a long time, and then when something DOES finally come out, it assumes this huge significance that's really not warranted. It does have a little new information, but obviously, the RL search warrant application didn't work out with him getting arrested for the crime.
At this point, I actually hope no one we've heard about is the killer, because if they are, LE has known about them for years, and if they haven't been charged, that means there's a significant problem tying them to the murders.
 
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